undead vs undead solution

UngeheuerLich · Post by **UngeheuerLich** » February 26th, 2007, 11:03 pm

yes, and a ghoul should make him run...

but: i thought of a magical 6-2 where you wanted a non magical...

i think magical is better, because the most serious problem is when undead hide in 60% def spots orÃ‚Â´villages, because because of the lower damage in UD vs UD healing does relatively more (undead tend to have low hp, so fights donÃ‚Â´t last that long IF they fight on open ground)

so a magical 6-2 is more useful than a nonmagical 7-2 and 9-2 is still a lot more than 10-2 reduced by 60%... indeed vs a goul it is the same damage as now... but why should the ghoul be the only redundand unit in the match... but: we donÃ‚Â´t know what holy change is exactly, maybe it doubles damage vs undead and is apliciable to any weapon... (this would be an easy change and if the dark adept got this atribute then it is about the same as your 7-2 impact...)

Post by **F8 Binds...** » February 26th, 2007, 11:37 pm

F8 Binds... wrote:(magic is debatable)

UngeheuerLich · Post by **UngeheuerLich** » February 26th, 2007, 11:48 pm

jep, i can read, but in my opinion magical should not be debatable, but damage...

I think the 70% times 6 is about the same as the (high approximated) average 60% times 7...
so a reduction from 7-2 magical to 6-2 magical is the same damage reduction as 7-2 magical to 7-2 normal (and since we speak from an undead mirror match donÃ‚Â´t tell me that there are units which have an average of 30% defense)

Post by **F8 Binds...** » February 27th, 2007, 12:00 am

actually, the 6-2 magical is much better than regular 7-2.

UngeheuerLich · Post by **UngeheuerLich** » February 27th, 2007, 12:05 am

I know

but not in the worst case which never happens: finding skellis hiding in deep water

I didnÃ‚Â´t want to bash you so much, so i made optimistic approximation:

so we agree: 6-2 magical lies between 7-2 magical and 7-2

and it would be the compromise between the two cases

Post by **F8 Binds...** » February 27th, 2007, 12:13 am

I support 7-2 magical, as this is more equivilant to the adept's damage at night against other races. (10-2 vs undead at night, 12-2 vs others at night)

UngeheuerLich · Post by **UngeheuerLich** » February 27th, 2007, 12:52 am

ghosts do holy damage now, and are the only units whose holy resistance was decreased...

at night ghosts do 8-3 damage vs ghosts...

so they have a chance to kill eack other with one attack series...

and bats are also killed very fast... i wonder how undead scouting vs undead looks like now... it strange now...

also there is no cold melee anymore, so undead is heavily nerved vs drakes...

Glowing Fish · Post by **Glowing Fish** » February 27th, 2007, 1:01 am

UngeheuerLich wrote:ghosts do holy damage now, and are the only units whose holy resistance was decreased...

at night ghosts do 8-3 damage vs ghosts...

so they have a chance to kill eack other with one attack series...

and bats are also killed very fast... i wonder how undead scouting vs undead looks like now... it strange now...

also there is no cold melee anymore, so undead is heavily nerved vs drakes...

Ghosts do Holy Damage in 1.3.x?

Okay, I can understand this for gameplay reasons, but I would like to see the plot rationalization behind it...

Gus · Post by **Gus** » February 27th, 2007, 1:25 am

"Holy" is a transitional name, waiting for something better. The damage it describes is something that relates to the "essence" of things, as i understand it. It works best on "magical" creatures, and less on normal ones.

Glowing Fish · Post by **Glowing Fish** » February 27th, 2007, 1:38 am

Gus wrote:"Holy" is a transitional name, waiting for something better. The damage it describes is something that relates to the "essence" of things, as i understand it. It works best on "magical" creatures, and less on normal ones.

How about calling it "Ether"?

Post by **F8 Binds...** » February 27th, 2007, 3:15 am

Wow. Ghosts with holy...

That is awkward...

Gus · Post by **Gus** » February 27th, 2007, 3:45 am

Glowing Fish wrote:
Gus wrote:"Holy" is a transitional name, waiting for something better. The damage it describes is something that relates to the "essence" of things, as i understand it. It works best on "magical" creatures, and less on normal ones.
How about calling it "Ether"?

Ask the devs. There's been a lenghty (like, a couple of months at least) discussion on the name, and they still haven't found something they like, it would seem.

commanderkeen · Post by **commanderkeen** » February 27th, 2007, 6:24 am

Holy ghosts? Holy cow!
Right, I'm downloading 1.3.1 now. I absolutely MUST see this!
Just holy melee, or ranged too? I guess I'll find out in 1 hour, 40 minutes, and 30 seconds

Konrad II · Post by **Konrad II** » February 27th, 2007, 6:33 am

commanderkeen wrote:Holy ghosts? Holy cow!
Right, I'm downloading 1.3.1 now. I absolutely MUST see this!
Just holy melee, or ranged too? I guess I'll find out in 1 hour, 40 minutes, and 30 seconds

Ranged stays cold.

Post by **Noyga** » February 27th, 2007, 8:58 am

UngeheuerLich wrote:ghosts do holy damage now, and are the only units whose holy resistance was decreased...

at night ghosts do 8-3 damage vs ghosts...

so they have a chance to kill eack other with one attack series...

and bats are also killed very fast... i wonder how undead scouting vs undead looks like now... it strange now...

also there is no cold melee anymore, so undead is heavily nerved vs drakes...

Well drakes now have an "holy" weakness (-30% IIRC)...
As Gis said, "holy" is a transitionnal name, that makes more damage to magical creatures, we did not find a good name we all agree with, so for the moment it is still "holy".