Faction idea: Feel free to say 'we have to many factions!'

[Anyar]

Early japanese armour was made of layers of hardened leather, which later became hard metallic plates. Both were covered and treated with varnish to protect them from the humidity in Japan.

The katana is a weapon made to cut through your enemies (even the armored ones), its curve absorbs part of the impact and helps the slashing motion to cut easily. It was made with soft high-quality steel in the center and hardened (tempered) steel in the outside. This made a sword that didn't bend and that absorbed the impact avoiding breaking.

Full plate (there must be something wrong with the term plate mail) were some of the better armours in existence, but it also encumbered greatly its wearer (he was still flexible though, but not agile). The broadsword was practically the mofo of all swords, cutting like a cleaver and hitting as hard as a mace (the thing was heavy).

If you fight a samurai against a fully plated knight, i'd say the mobility of the samurai is what would make the difference. Although i don't think the katana would go through the breastplate for sure, the arms should be an easy target and weak enough for the katana to go through. After one wound to our fully plated knight, it is game over. In duels of knights, the broadsword had to hit an unprotected place or wear down the enemy with its powerful strikes, so i think the japanese plate should give enough protection to the samurai.

WE must remember armours were made to stop blows, so both plates have their chances to stop common blows. I, however, think that a samurai with a katana would make more more good blows than a knight with full plate, just because of the mobility and agility.

O.o How do you know all of this?

[appleide]

Just finished my National Geographic magazine that just got delivered on Sunday...

I could use Pygmys! They are people who average less than 150 cm and live in rainforests.

okay, here:

a pygmy tree:

Was thinking for these guys to have movement 6, move 1 in forest but 2 on grass, have high defense, ambush, low hp, high cost, and in higherlevels, skirmishers and backstab

a tribal warrior tree:

As good in throwing spears as they fight in Close combat with them? high hp, low resistances, good defense on grass and sand?

and a shaman tree
have a magical attack? like 1-10 attack with sand or maybe a 'curse' magical attack, which goes 6-3 slow, ranged, magical.

and a fast unit tree?
Might need to twist reality here. Tiger or rhino or giraffe riders? Or maybe just scouts on foot that move 7?

How should I draw the pygmy?
oh and for reference :

pygmy
Generally speaking, pygmy (from Greek pygmaios, "fist sized", a kind of dwarf in Greek mythology) can refer to any human or animal of unusually small size, for example, the pygmy hippopotamus.

In an anthropological context, a Pygmy is specifically a member of one of the hunter-gatherer people living in equatorial rainforests characterised by their short height (below one and a half metres, or 59 inches, on average). Pygmies are found throughout central Africa, with smaller numbers in south-east Asia. The most closely studied group are the Mbuti of the Ituri Rainforest in the Democratic Republic of the Congo, which were the subject of a study by Colin Turnbull (The Forest People (1962)). Among the other African groups are the Aka, BaBenzl, Baka, Binga, Efé, and Twa. In the Central African Republic, at least, the term Bayaka is preferred to Pygmy, as it refers to the people and not only to their stature.

Pygmies are smaller because in their early teens they do not experience the growth spurt normal in most other humans. This is an environmental adaptation; generally, smaller people tolerate wet and hot conditions better because they generate less body heat.

The African Pygmies are particularly known for their usually vocal music, usually characterised by density, counterpoint, communalism and improvisation. Simha Arom says that the level of polyphonic complexity of Pygmy music was reached in Europe in the 14th century, yet Pygmy culture is unwritten and ancient, some Pygmy groups being among the oldest known cultures in some areas of Africa. Their societies are renowned for their relative egalitarianism. They are often romantically portrayed as both utopian and premodern, which denies the fact they too live in the 21st century and have relationships with non-Pygmies (such as inhabitants of nearby villages, agricultural employers, logging companies, evangelical missionaries and commercial hunters encroaching on their food sources).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygmy

[unsung]

Early japanese armour was made of layers of hardened leather, which later became hard metallic plates. Both were covered and treated with varnish to protect them from the humidity in Japan.

Full plate (there must be something wrong with the term plate mail) were some of the better armours in existence,

If you fight a samurai against a fully plated knight, i'd say the mobility of the samurai is what would make the difference. Although i don't think the katana would go through the breastplate for sure, the arms should be an easy target and weak enough for the katana to go through.
WE must remember armours were made to stop blows, so both plates have their chances to stop common blows. I, however, think that a samurai with a katana would make more more good blows than a knight with full plate, just because of the mobility and agility.

knights have the advantage of a shield though, which allows him to block, making dodgeing unnecassary.
and plate mail is the correct term. it was bassically plate armour, with chain used in certain points, alowing for better movement. that, or it just sounds cooler. either way, thats what I'm using (its shorter to type!).

if the katana had a good chance of breaking on the knights armour, when used in a slash, then what would happen if it hit the shield? or, if the knight blocked it with his sword?enough hits, it could break. plus, theres the good old shield bash technique. or the punch in the face with an iron gauntlet.
plus, chain mail was often worn under plate mail, making it muych harder to kkill withou repeatedly hiting one spot.
maybe we should make a topic for this argument...

[unsung]

Early japanese armour was made of layers of hardened leather, which later became hard metallic plates. Both were covered and treated with varnish to protect them from the humidity in Japan.

The katana is a weapon made to cut through your enemies (even the armored ones), its curve absorbs part of the impact and helps the slashing motion to cut easily. It was made with soft high-quality steel in the center and hardened (tempered) steel in the outside. This made a sword that didn't bend and that absorbed the impact avoiding breaking.

Full plate (there must be something wrong with the term plate mail) were some of the better armours in existence, but it also encumbered greatly its wearer (he was still flexible though, but not agile). The broadsword was practically the mofo of all swords, cutting like a cleaver and hitting as hard as a mace (the thing was heavy).

If you fight a samurai against a fully plated knight, i'd say the mobility of the samurai is what would make the difference. Although i don't think the katana would go through the breastplate for sure, the arms should be an easy target and weak enough for the katana to go through. After one wound to our fully plated knight, it is game over. In duels of knights, the broadsword had to hit an unprotected place or wear down the enemy with its powerful strikes, so i think the japanese plate should give enough protection to the samurai.

WE must remember armours were made to stop blows, so both plates have their chances to stop common blows. I, however, think that a samurai with a katana would make more more good blows than a knight with full plate, just because of the mobility and agility.

O.o How do you know all of this?

both of us seem to have an equal intrest in these things, as well as other things like this. and we both have a lot of free time. (I think)
the history channel should make a show about this.

[Temuchin Khan]

a pygmy tree:

Was thinking for these guys to have movement 6, move 1 in forest but 2 on grass, have high defense, ambush, low hp, high cost, and in higherlevels, skirmishers and backstab

Good! Someone who could challenge the elves in the forest! Also, pygmies have been known to successfully hunt elephants....

a tribal warrior tree:

As good in throwing spears as they fight in Close combat with them? high hp, low resistances, good defense on grass and sand?

Why not make all the tribals good in forests? Well, is this tribal warrior another pygmy, or is he based on the Zulus? The Zulus would have been good in open plains.

and a shaman tree
have a magical attack? like 1-10 attack with sand or maybe a 'curse' magical attack, which goes 6-3 slow, ranged, magical.

and a fast unit tree?
Might need to twist reality here. Tiger or rhino or giraffe riders? Or maybe just scouts on foot that move 7?

Maybe you could make the shaman the fast unit. His magic increases his speed.

[Temuchin Khan]

It just struck me that a faction of Peruvian, Chilean, and Brazilian natives would be pretty interesting.

For a scout, they would have a hot air balloon. And yes, this was invented in pre-Columbian Peru. See *Ancient Inventions* by Peter James and Nick Thorpe.

Ranged units could be either slingers or bola throwers. For variety's sake, probably bola throwers. A bola, of course, was three rocks tied together that could be thrown at one's enemy's legs and trip him up and/or hobble him. An impact (slow) attack, I guess.

Quechua (=Inca) warriors would bear spears, axes, and/or maces. Also, the warrior line would branch into one line of strictly warriors and another of warriors with leadership (with "Inca" as the highest rank) and another of royal guards (the "Big Ears," as they were called for their massive earings).

Chimu warriors would have steadfast. Historically, they built a great wall along their border with the Incas, but became outflanked as the Inca Empire expanded.

Aymara mountaineers would be fast even in the mountains, and could probably use their speed to challenge the dwarves for control of the heights.

And at least one Brazilian tribe resisted Portuguese invaders by burning red peppers upwind from their enemies and letting the wind blow it into their faces and irritate their eyes. A fire (slow) attack?

The mummification of corpses and the ritual sharing of meals with them was a big part of ancient Peruvian culture. In Wesnoth, of course, this could be translated into an actual Mummy unit....

[dtw]

First of all i'd like to say this is a hideously stereotypical of "tribes" and secondly I'd like to say:

YOU DON'T GET TIGERS IN AFRICA!

For crying out loud

[Temuchin Khan]

First of all i'd like to say this is a hideously stereotypical of "tribes" and secondly I'd like to say:

YOU DON'T GET TIGERS IN AFRICA!

For crying out loud :roll:

Thank you! I was fixated on correcting some of the other errors in this proposed faction and getting side-tracked with other ideas and somehow overlooked that particular error.

[Cuyo Quiz]

knights have the advantage of a shield though, which allows him to block, making dodgeing unnecassary.
and plate mail is the correct term. it was bassically plate armour, with chain used in certain points, alowing for better movement. that, or it just sounds cooler. either way, thats what I'm using (its shorter to type!).

if the katana had a good chance of breaking on the knights armour, when used in a slash, then what would happen if it hit the shield? or, if the knight blocked it with his sword?enough hits, it could break. plus, theres the good old shield bash technique. or the punch in the face with an iron gauntlet.
plus, chain mail was often worn under plate mail, making it muych harder to kkill withou repeatedly hiting one spot.
maybe we should make a topic for this argument...

Kite and heater shields (the first is the large one from crusaders and the second the small one that looks like an heraldic shield) were made of laminated wood. And a buckler was too thin (arrows practically went through it) although made of metal.

Alas, i was thinking on the better full plate (called gothic), used with a two-handed weapon (i think the specific term is longsword) since with that shields were practically unnecessary. Using a broadsword in one hand wouldn't hit as hard as to get through the armored samurai, but gettting your katana stuck in the shield could be a problem, although only when trying to go back into your stand. After some time fighting knights started using their broadswords with 2 hands, releasing the shield, as a result of tiring.

Given the technique used with a katana (no quarrel, almost no touching of the swords-parrying was done with the broader area- and powerful slashes), "shield bash" wouldn't be a problem. But the use of a shield certainly adds an interesting dimension to the duel.

[unsung]

YOU DON'T GET TIGERS IN AFRICA!

replace with female lions, because males are as lazy as they come and don't even hunt.



you should put jackals in too becuase jackals own.
brave little things, though most people think (wrongly) they're just ground bound vultures.

[appleide]

It just struck me that a faction of Peruvian, Chilean, and Brazilian natives would be pretty interesting.

For a scout, they would have a hot air balloon. And yes, this was invented in pre-Columbian Peru. See *Ancient Inventions* by Peter James and Nick Thorpe.

Ranged units could be either slingers or bola throwers. For variety's sake, probably bola throwers. A bola, of course, was three rocks tied together that could be thrown at one's enemy's legs and trip him up and/or hobble him. An impact (slow) attack, I guess.

Quechua (=Inca) warriors would bear spears, axes, and/or maces. Also, the warrior line would branch into one line of strictly warriors and another of warriors with leadership (with "Inca" as the highest rank) and another of royal guards (the "Big Ears," as they were called for their massive earings).

Chimu warriors would have steadfast. Historically, they built a great wall along their border with the Incas, but became outflanked as the Inca Empire expanded.

Aymara mountaineers would be fast even in the mountains, and could probably use their speed to challenge the dwarves for control of the heights.

And at least one Brazilian tribe resisted Portuguese invaders by burning red peppers upwind from their enemies and letting the wind blow it into their faces and irritate their eyes. A fire (slow) attack?

The mummification of corpses and the ritual sharing of meals with them was a big part of ancient Peruvian culture. In Wesnoth, of course, this could be translated into an actual Mummy unit....

Cool!

okay, no tigers in Africa, how did I forget that?

a tribal warrior tree:

As good in throwing spears as they fight in Close combat with them? high hp, low resistances, good defense on grass and sand?

Why not make all the tribals good in forests? Well, is this tribal warrior another pygmy, or is he based on the Zulus? The Zulus would have been good in open plains.

and a shaman tree
have a magical attack? like 1-10 attack with sand or maybe a 'curse' magical attack, which goes 6-3 slow, ranged, magical.

and a fast unit tree?
Might need to twist reality here. Tiger or rhino or giraffe riders? Or maybe just scouts on foot that move 7?

Maybe you could make the shaman the fast unit. His magic increases his speed.

I could make them all Pygmies!

Pygmy fighter, pygmy hunter, and pygmy shaman

The fighter has good CC attack, hunter has good throwing spear attack and a sling, and shaman can move 7,, heals, and move one on grass, and has a curse magical ranged slow attack.

Then have the Inca warriors, bola throwers, and the chilli throwers for another faction?

And... someone give me pointers how a pygmy should be drawn? I could use the outlaw scouts as template maybe? But darken the hair, skin, take off the shield.

[Cuyo Quiz]

You need Chancas. The only tribe which was really feared, even by the Incan Empire. They were like the Zulus of South America. They would be good candidates for Berserk.

A lil something about the Chancas: They were famous for their patasca, which today is a soup made with ram's head and called "head soup". I'm sure you all can figure out from were the Chancas got their heads for the original version of the soup.

[Temuchin Khan]

And here come the Aztecs:

Code: Select all

Aztec Warrior -> Eagle Warrior -> Eagle Knight -- wooden sword, impact plague (captive) and blade plague (captive)
                      -> Jaguar Warrior -> Jaguar Knight -- spear, pierce plague (captive)

Atlatl -> Veteran Atlatl -> Elite Atlatl -- javelin-thrower (an "atlatl" was a device to increase a thrown spear's range and power)

Aztec Slinger -> Veteran Slinger -> Elite Slinger

Aztec Priest -> Warrior Priest -> Priest of the Serpent -- obsidian knife; secondary "sacrifice" attack which can only be used on captives.

Captive (lvl 0) -- non-recruitable; does not fight; can only be attacked by Aztec priest; low resistances; if it becomes entirely surrounded by non-Aztec units, it may be "liberated" and transformed into a human peasant on the side of the faction by which it was rescued.

When the Aztec priest sacrifices a captive, other Aztec units may eat it. Any unit that eats a sacrificed captive gains five experience.

And North American Natives:

Code: Select all

Iroquois -> Iroquois Brave -> Iroquois Sachem -- tomahawk, close and ranged; good in forests and shallow water; brave gains peace pipe 1-4 ranged (fire) slow; sachem gains leadership
            -> Mohawk Brave -> Mohawk Champion -- tomahawk, close and ranged; ambush (forest); good in forests and shallow water

Apache Scout -> Apache Ranger -> Apache Warchief -- bow and spear; good resistances in hills and sand; ambush (hills); fast for infantry

Plains Horse -> Horse Brave -> Horse Chief -- bow and spear

Headhunter -> Maneater -> Cannibal -- spear (pierce); wooden sword plague (trophy head); good in forest, sand, shallow water.  If he collects a trophy head from a kill, he gains one extra experience point beyond what he would have earned.

Trophy Head (lvl 0) -- lies on the battlefield until someone collects it.

Eskimo -> Seal Hunter -> Walrus Hunter -- harpoon (pierce) melee; harpoon (pierce) ranged; no movement penalty on snow and ice; good defense in snow and ice; highly resistant to cold attacks.

Somewhat vicious, I know. Some tribes were like that!

[Cuyo Quiz]

*hails Temuchin*

OTOH, that is HEAVY work. So if it ever gets finished, an updatable package is the way to do this. So there is an "Empires package" (Europe and the East) and a "Tribes Package" (America and Africa).

Simplify the Captive, if anyone other than an Aztec kills it, it becomes a peasant. The North American Natives may miss a Shaman (that could branch into different totemic shamans).

[appleide]

And here come the Aztecs:


When the Aztec priest sacrifices a captive, other Aztec units may eat it. Any unit that eats a sacrificed captive gains five experience.

Would it be possible for the priest, when sacrificing a captive, give 5 gold to the player?

Aztecs! Hurrah!

Simple African tribe (summarised all my suggestions in this thread):
Cost 17 Tribal Shaman (move 7,heals, 5-3 curse, cold, slow, magical, 5-3 Staff impact) hp 30 resistant to cold, holy)

Cost 14 Tribal Warrior (move 5, 9-2 spear first strike, 9-2 javalin) hp 50, -30% resistance to all but cold fire holy.

Cost 15 Tribal Scout (move 6, 5-3 fist, 5-4 sling, skirmisher) hp 40, -30% to all but cold fire holy.)