Res Magica development thread. [Update 19/06]

[mehmode]

Not really. It just loses one attack in favour of another, similarly to the Spearman-Swordsman path. The strikes and damage increase should be more than enough to compensate. A first strike polearm attack would not be thematically appropriate.

[styles1005]

Mmm . . . Good point. *checks* Actually, the Spearman still has one advancement path (Javelineer) that loses nothing. I understand that the rest is worth more than enough, but what if the opponent's spamming cavalry? It now costs one more per turn in upkeep, gives more experience if killed, and lost one of its main advantages over the cavalry. And that's not just applicable to that particular (admittedly unlikely) situation; that's just an example. Basically, it's always bad to have no choice when leveling up but to lose something. That doesn't necessitate any change to the unit; just add an alternate advancement path that keeps it. As a matter of fact, you could start it at level 2 and make it a more combat-focused path without leadership, to justify its focusing more on combat and therefore keeping the weapons. And if it's because of historical accuracy that it's necessary to get rid of it, WINR.

[mehmode]

If the opponent is spamming cavalry, the correct counter unit is Spear Militia, which will have an advancement path dedicated to killing chargers. Plus, it's not about historical realism, it's about keeping in line with the theme. Why would a high ranking commander tote about a pike, which is a formation weapon? All in all, it will come down to playtesting anyway. The blade atack may gain first strike if it is necessary, but there probably won't be a pierce attack. There is the militia unit AND a combat-oriented advancement path for the Freeblade to take care of that.

[Drakefriend]

Why should a warlord (what the condottieri were) not use a polearm?
The Partisan was a wide-spread officer weapon, and the duells in the Illiad are fought mainly with lances(so polearms are not only a formation weapon but also a personal weapon). In fact, polearms were among the weapons most featured in the medieval martial arts manuals in Europe, the Fechtbüchern.

[mehmode]

The duels in the Illiad are fought with spear, sword and shield, used in an entirely different manner.
Also, precisely which fechtbucher are your referring to? The only major one with a decent section on the spear is Flos Duellatorum. Others concentrate mostly on the pollaxe, which was the choice weapon for armoured duel [vide Talhoffer, whose discourse of the spear concentrates on throwing it.]. The longpspear, the pike and the halberd are weapons which would reasonably qualify for First Strike. All of them are mostly counter-cavalry weapons, used in formation. None of them has any in-depth material on personal combat. Short spear? Sure. Pollaxe? Tons. Lucerne hammer? Here you go. Nothing for the pike, though. But then again, we're straying into a realism discussion.
Here's three solutions, pick one:
Blade attack gains a special ability, most likely Counter or Marksman.
Unit keeps both attacks, slightly stronger, piercing either fluffed as polearm of some sort or pistol crossbow.
Unit loses the FIrst Strike piercing attack in favour of a ranged attack.

[Drakefriend]

I think I prefer the melee crossbow

[mehmode]

Crossbow it is. Or maybe a pistol. I'm not 100% clear on how wide-spread firearms will be.

[styles1005]

Hey . . . hopefully this isn't dead. That'd be really annoying.

[lie] I've been working on coding, [/lie] [notalie] but there's been about a hundred things going on lately. [/notalie] Still trying to figure out how to give a race no names, and possibly no traits depending on what you want in that respect, but aside from that as soon as I get some concrete stats that's pretty much done (I hope.)

Anyway, yeah, good idea for the melee crossbow (though that may confuse some people; prepare for complaints about proper range for a crossbow.)

[Drakefriend]

Maybe the condattiere has both a melee and a range attack utilizing his crossbow?

[styles1005]

Nah, just put an explanation in the description or something. I came up with something to explain it, but I'm not sure I can remember.

[Drakefriend]

Or he would not hit anything if his aim is too far away.
Maybe he uses the crossbow only for the Firststrike and otherwise dtab with his sword.

[styles1005]

Yeah, my explanation had to do with the crossbow being small and not being able to shoot very far, but then I realized that not having enough power to do that was sorta confusing seeing as how it hits harder than a polearm.

. . .

Maybe his aim is very good?

[Drakefriend]

Maybe he uses a Gun Sword?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pistol_Sword

[styles1005]

And that changes what I said how? Good idea, but doesn't change the question of how it would be a melee weapon instead of ranged. Waitasec, something mehmode said gave me an idea. I didn't understand half of what he was saying about fechtbuchern and all that (take pity on the poor high-schooler here!) but I'll see if I can find an appropriate weapon on Wikipedia.

*looks*

A halberd, of course! It has a blade and a spike, giving it piercing and blade damage. I was avoiding it on the assumption that it was a formation weapon, but, to quote Wikipedia, "The halberd has been used as a court bodyguard weapon for centuries, and is still the ceremonial weapon of the Swiss Guard in the Vatican." (Yes, I use Wikipedia a lot. It's that or an antique encyclopedia set.) It was also used by low-ranking officers in European infantry units from the 16th to 18th centuries, which may be the wrong time period to some extent but WINR; it doesn't have to be perfectly realistic, and anyhow there is some overlap between its use and the Renaissance.

[Drakefriend]

Actually the gun of a gunsword is only a weak secondary weapon, so I think it can justify its melee use.
In fact the Tenere wields a partisan, a rather short polearm with a lance tip and cutting edges used mainly by officers, though usually lower ones, it came to my mind, too, and I think a Condatierre could still use it for good protection. I think if I had to decide, I would take the Partisan as the Condatierre's Weapon, but it is of course mehmode's decision.