Scenario 21: Clash at the Manor

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Scenario 21: Clash at the Manor

Post by Content Feedback » May 23rd, 2009, 12:00 am

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
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lotsofphil
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Joined: March 27th, 2009, 4:45 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by lotsofphil » June 10th, 2009, 2:16 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? 3
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? Fine.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? None, really. Easy chokepoints.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? 6
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun? Does the enemy even try to escape? At one point I left 3 horsemen with a chance and they just attacked me.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario? No.

Pilafman is a silly name (like rice pilaf). It should be changed. Also maybe make the enemy a little more keen on escaping.

starstrike
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Joined: September 6th, 2009, 4:49 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by starstrike » September 6th, 2009, 5:06 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? 10
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? Clear
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? No way to open the secret door
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? 1 ... or 7 if the enemies tried to escape and there was an openable door
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The code to make the horsemen escape does not seem to work. I don't know enough of the xml to work out why.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I searched everywhere for the secret door with no success, including sending Chantal to the small island up north. Eventually I looked in the XML, which said (33,11). But that is inside the impenetrable wall area of the map, and no unit can reach it. So - no way to open the secret door and win the scenario.
The guards themselves were quite easy, but only because they all - horsemen included - charge eagerly into the forest to take on the elves.

fabi
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Location: Germany

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by fabi » September 13th, 2009, 10:44 pm

starstrike wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on? Medium
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? 10
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? Clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario? Clear
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario? No way to open the secret door
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? 1 ... or 7 if the enemies tried to escape and there was an openable door
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The code to make the horsemen escape does not seem to work. I don't know enough of the xml to work out why.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
I searched everywhere for the secret door with no success, including sending Chantal to the small island up north. Eventually I looked in the XML, which said (33,11). But that is inside the impenetrable wall area of the map, and no unit can reach it. So - no way to open the secret door and win the scenario.
The guards themselves were quite easy, but only because they all - horsemen included - charge eagerly into the forest to take on the elves.
There is now a reachable secret door somewhere around the manor.
A bug has been fixed that leaded the horseman to a wrong location.

Handigar
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Joined: September 14th, 2009, 12:22 am

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by Handigar » September 14th, 2009, 12:24 am

I also cannot find the secret passage for love nor money.

Heidi M
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by Heidi M » September 16th, 2009, 11:41 pm

I can't find the entrance either!

fabi
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Location: Germany

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by fabi » September 17th, 2009, 8:22 am

The entrance was unreachable in the last released versions.
The first version that includes a reachable entrance will be the upcoming 1.7.6.

In earlier versions you can replace the scenario's file with the new one:
http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/*checkout*/w ... ?rev=38534
Load from the prestart savegame please.

Greetings, Fabi

spir
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by spir » October 3rd, 2009, 4:43 pm

Hello Fabi,

I have tried the new version, but the secret door event still does not trigger when a unit of side #1 steps or even stays on the proper tile (32,8). Have you actually tried it?
I am not quite sure about how wml works in this very case. The issue is nested events: when all ennemy units are killed, a new objective is set and a custom event fired. This second event will (try to) activate a new, embedded, event to be triggered when the secret door is found -- but only after first objective is reached
Below the relevant code snippet (for any reason the first objective comes after the second one):

Code: Select all

    # new objectives, find the book
    [event]
        name=new-objectives
        [message]
            id=Delfador
            message= _ "The guards are slain. Now we must look for the book."
        [/message]
        [objectives]
            side=1
            [objective]
                description= _ " New Objective: Find the secret door. Explore the manor."
                condition=win
            [/objective]
        [/objectives]
        # Create some new events for when we move to the right spot.
        [event]
            name=moveto
            [filter]
                side=1
                x,y=32,8
            [/filter]

            [music]
                name=northerners.ogg
                play_once=yes
            [/music]

            [message]
                id=unit
                message= _ "This looks like a secret door. Let's see where it leads..."
            [/message]
            [terrain]
                x=32
                y=9
                terrain=Uu
            [/terrain]
            [endlevel]
                result=victory
            [/endlevel]
        [/event]
    [/event]
    
    ...
    
    [event]
        name=die
        first_time_only=no
        [if]
            [not]
                [have_unit]
                    side=2
                [/have_unit]
            [/not]
            [then]
                [fire_event]
                    # Factored like this so the inner events
                    # won't trigger a false postive from wmllint.
                    name=new-objectives
                [/fire_event]
            [/then]
        [/if]
    [/event]

I suspect that the nested event will only be read and can only be launched if the secret door would be discovered precisely while the outer event (new-objectives) is triggered. I mean the inner event would not be controlled for ever, but only at the time the external one triggers... Don't know, actually. Would like to know the answer...

Anyway, I was doubtful about that, precisely; the reason why, when I had to code such a nested event, I used a flag instead. Something like this (untested yet):

Code: Select all

    # conditioned secret door event
    #ifdef ennemies_dead
        [event]
            name=moveto
            [filter]
                side=1
                x,y=32,8
            [/filter]

            [music]
                name=northerners.ogg
                play_once=yes
            [/music]

            [message]
                id=unit
                message= _ "This looks like a secret door. Let's see where it leads..."
            [/message]
            [terrain]
                x=32
                y=9
                terrain=Uu
            [/terrain]
            [endlevel]
                result=victory
            [/endlevel]
        [/event]
    #endif
    
    # first objective reached
    [event]
        name=die
        first_time_only=no
        [if]
            [not]
                [have_unit]
                    side=2
                [/have_unit]
            [/not]
            [then]
                [message]
                    id=Delfador
                    message= _ "The guards are slain. Now we must look for the book."
                [/message]
                [objectives]
                    side=1
                    [objective]
                        description= _ " New Objective: Find the secret door. Explore the manor."
                        condition=win
                    [/objective]
                [/objectives]
                # flag used as secret door event conition
                #define ennemies_dead #enddef
            [/then]
        [/if]
    [/event]
(note: initial message & new objectives need not be in the conditioned part.)

Also, I find strange there's only one rider trying to escape, for Pilafman (!!!) says: "Riders, quickly, go alert the queen."

I will test it later.
Denis
life is strange

various stuff about BfW (rules, stats, alternatives) and WML (parser, semantic schema, evolution)

spir
Posts: 97
Joined: September 15th, 2009, 9:31 am
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secret door event

Post by spir » October 3rd, 2009, 6:31 pm

Hello again,

It works, but with two changes:
  • Must use "normal" variables, not preprocessor #define (why?)
  • The condition must be nested in the event, not the contrary (why?).
Here is the working code:

Code: Select all

    [event]
        name=prestart
        {DEBUG_MSG "secret door test version #5"}
    [/event]
    [event]
        name=new_turn
        first_time_only=yes
        [if]
            [variable]
                name=all_ennemies_dead
                equals=yes
            [/variable]
            [then]
                {DEBUG_MSG "all_ennemies_dead: yes"}
            [/then]
        [/if]
    [/event]
    
    [event]
        name=prestart
        {VARIABLE all_ennemies_dead no}
    [/event]
    # conditioned secret door event
            [event]
                name=moveto
                [filter]
                    side=1
                    x,y=32,8
                [/filter]

    [if]
        [variable]
            name=all_ennemies_dead
            equals=yes
        [/variable]
        [then]
                [music]
                    name=northerners.ogg
                    play_once=yes
                [/music]

                [message]
                    id=unit
                    message= _ "This looks like a secret door. Let's see where it leads..."
                [/message]
                [terrain]
                    x=32
                    y=9
                    terrain=Uu
                [/terrain]
                [endlevel]
                    result=victory
                [/endlevel]
        [/then]
    [/if]
            [/event]
    
    # first objective reached
    [event]
        name=die
        first_time_only=no
        [if]
            [not]
                [have_unit]
                    side=2
                [/have_unit]
            [/not]
            [then]
                [message]
                    id=Delfador
                    message= _ "The guards are slain. Now we must look for the book."
                [/message]
                [objectives]
                    side=1
                    [objective]
                        description= _ " New Objective: Find the secret door. Explore the manor."
                        condition=win
                    [/objective]
                [/objectives]
                # flag used as secret door event condition
                {VARIABLE all_ennemies_dead yes}
            [/then]
        [/if]
    [/event]
There is still something to change: with the present [side] def, Pilaf can well have no rider at all (happened to me while testing)! I guess you should change the code to
  • either "pre-recruit" the guards (presently he usually recruits 3 lvl2 bowmen and a royal guard, plus one dragoon), and let only riders on the recruitment list,
  • or let only one or two types on the recruitment list in addition to riders (and probably change the recruitment pattern, too -- don't know what category cavalrymen and dragoons are supposed to be).
And finally, as the victory happens when the secret door is found, we cannot "explore the manor" as stated in the victory condition. (and anyway, it's really strange as is presently: a unit steps on a tile, "victory" splash, and we can hardly see the secret passge behind the translucent splash frame). At least, wait until a unit enters the manor...
Denis
life is strange

various stuff about BfW (rules, stats, alternatives) and WML (parser, semantic schema, evolution)

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Majki-Fajki
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Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by Majki-Fajki » April 16th, 2010, 6:46 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5. 4 Sylphs and everybody dies.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
At the beginning, clear. But searching for the hidden door... I thought, that BoW is strategy game, not adventure:)
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Good. Delfador shows, that he can reason like a man, and fight like a man :)
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Finding frakking doors.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
3 - doors quest. Too easy overall.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
More enemies.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
None.
(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
N/A

cph
Posts: 129
Joined: May 12th, 2007, 4:29 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by cph » April 24th, 2010, 9:21 pm

(1) Great Mage, 1.8.0
(2) 3
(3) Clear for the first half; I wasn't so clear in the search phase, but found the entrance okay.
(4) Very good. It's gives an interesting new edge on things to see the elves cast in a darker role.
(5) None. Even the royal guards didn't do any harm, as they could be slowed by a shyde and then picked off by an avenger.
(6) 6 - a quick, almost RPG scenario.
(7) Some guard units tied to the manor itself would make the resistance endure a bit longer than it does currently.
(8) No.

Gerion
Posts: 49
Joined: March 28th, 2010, 11:01 am

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by Gerion » May 2nd, 2010, 3:23 am

1) Medium
(2) Way too easy. The opponent dies in a matter of rounds, killed at the border of the forest, because he doesn't try to reach the signpost and attacks my units instead. Not that it mattered... I had units close to the signpost, just in case...
(3) Very clear
(4) Yes, it is definitely necessary to tell what happened to the book, but two ridiculously easy scenarios just to tell a story that could be told in 5 sentences? I had preferred more emphasis on the scenarios around the closing of the gate and the killing of the lich and had left these as a footnote in the epilogue. But that is just my opinion
(5) No challenge at all
(6) 5.
(7) Some kind of plot twist or surprise. I think it is too straightforward
(8) No

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quantum137
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Joined: April 20th, 2010, 10:51 am

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by quantum137 » June 12th, 2010, 8:49 am

Hi there, I am playing 1.8.0 version and as many people here I cannot find the entrance to the manor. Has this bug been fixed or there is no way of finishing this scenario without editing files as discussed here?

shadowblack
Posts: 368
Joined: April 15th, 2010, 3:03 pm

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by shadowblack » July 6th, 2010, 9:20 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
1.8.3, Mage (Normal/Medium/whatever you call it)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
1

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Fine

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
No challenges, since the enemy has so little gold. I recalled just 5 units, for a total of 8, and divided them in 2 almost equal groups. For a brief moment that did not seem so wise, as the west side had a rider and a few archers to deal with while the south group had only a single rider. But the archers proved to be no threat.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
1 – too short and easy to be any real fun

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Increase the size of the map, so that there will be more room for maneuvering and also increase the enemy’s starting gold so that he can recruit a few more troops.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No


I think there’s a bug: When a unit finds the secret door something is supposed to be said (or so it seems from the scenario code). However my Sylph said nothing when she found the secret door – the scenario just ended. Save attached – just move the Sylph to the door and see if she says anything. In my case she did (I tried several times).
Attachments
DM-Clash_at_the_manor_turn_11_bug.gz
(36.03 KiB) Downloaded 425 times
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Maiklas3000
Posts: 532
Joined: June 23rd, 2010, 10:43 am

Re: Scenario Review: DM 21 - Clash at the Manor

Post by Maiklas3000 » August 15th, 2010, 7:09 am

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Most difficult; 1.8.4; 100 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Pretty clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Good.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The main challenge was withstanding the assault wave, while keeping calvary from reaching a signpost. The b*stards tried to suicidally assassinate Delfador, like with an archer shooting at him and an almost dead calvary unit charging him. They almost succeeded.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Maybe the leader should make a run for it too (for a signpost) after all his men are dead.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.
Attachments
DM-Clash_at_the_manor_replay.gz
(29.03 KiB) Downloaded 418 times
Last edited by Maiklas3000 on August 22nd, 2010, 4:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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