Idea for Far East Faction

Weeksy · Post by **Weeksy** » June 27th, 2007, 12:08 am

I was thinking it would be nice to get the japanese as a lawful faction, the mongols as a chaotic, the indians as neutral, and the chinese army+ninjas as a lawful/chaotic mix, like the drakes+saurians....

Seiryu · Post by **Seiryu** » June 27th, 2007, 12:01 pm

Weeksy wrote:I was thinking it would be nice to get the japanese as a lawful faction, the mongols as a chaotic, the indians as neutral, and the chinese army+ninjas as a lawful/chaotic mix, like the drakes+saurians....

Japanese: were not always lawful... so I propose to do: Lawful/chaotic
Mongols: I share the same idea
Indians: same
Chinese: Hum... Maybe I can agree with that... still

Weeksy · Post by **Weeksy** » July 4th, 2007, 11:40 pm

In no way am I saying the Japanese were always lawful, just that the strongly disciplined samurai are the epitome of law, and so I can't think of any other factions in the region that would work as a completely lawful faction (I feel we need one)

Temuchin Khan · Post by **Temuchin Khan** » July 5th, 2007, 2:44 am

Weeksy wrote:In no way am I saying the Japanese were always lawful, just that the strongly disciplined samurai are the epitome of law, and so I can't think of any other factions in the region that would work as a completely lawful faction (I feel we need one)

I suppose an argument could be made that the extreme regimentation of society produced by India's caste system would put them into the category of lawful, albeit in a different way.

This is not to deny that the caste system is responsible for many evils (e.g., the treatment of the Untouchables), but even so there's no way that we could logically call such a structured society "chaotic," and even "neutral" is pushing it. We'd have to divorce the terms "lawful" and "chaotic" from the moral connotations that D&D bequeathed them, but that isn't really such a loss.

EDIT: Similarly, the Chinese have generally been law abiding people. In fact, I don't think any Far Eastern nations could be classified as entirely chaotic.

Weeksy · Post by **Weeksy** » July 5th, 2007, 8:11 am

Someone with more information would be helpful, but from what I've read the mongols had fairly loose laws, and so would be the most likely to be chaotic (and thus add better alignment variation to the era), and in many of the battle accounts of India I have read, they drew up nice, strong, rules for how the battle would go, and then, in many cases, ignored them. I, for one, would like to see a bit of alignment variations in this faction, and the ways I have provided, with Japan lawful, China as lawful/chaotic, the Mongols as chaotic, and India as neutral, is one way of doing that.

battlestar · Post by **battlestar** » July 5th, 2007, 2:07 pm

Anyone doing art for this?

theotherhiveking · Post by **theotherhiveking** » July 5th, 2007, 2:13 pm

There are 2 samurais. AFAIK no one doing nothing.

Weeksy · Post by **Weeksy** » July 6th, 2007, 3:13 am

My spriting isn't the best, but I'd be happy to make attempts at some units once I can get off the road, if someone could give me a unit list for the units we think we will want. I'm currently away from home though, so it should take 2 or 3 days until I can get back to a computer with photoshop and the GIMP

Temuchin Khan · Post by **Temuchin Khan** » July 6th, 2007, 10:57 am

battlestar wrote:Anyone doing art for this?

Art for Foot Samurai, Mounted Samurai, and Ninjas was done several years ago. So was art for a the lvl 1 units of a complete Chinese faction, as well as art for a lvl 1 Chinese warrior monk.

We don't have to start from scratch, we just have to find out if anyone (a) has the old art and (b) is willing to make it available again.

TheLost1 · Post by **TheLost1** » July 15th, 2007, 6:42 am

Temuchin Khan wrote:
battlestar wrote:Anyone doing art for this?
Art for Foot Samurai, Mounted Samurai, and Ninjas was done several years ago. So was art for a the lvl 1 units of a complete Chinese faction, as well as art for a lvl 1 Chinese warrior monk.

We don't have to start from scratch, we just have to find out if anyone (a) has the old art and (b) is willing to make it available again.

"Complete chinese faction", meh, could have used that when I did that whole asia thing...

Post by **irrevenant** » July 15th, 2007, 9:01 am

Weeksy wrote:I was thinking it would be nice to get the japanese as a lawful faction, the mongols as a chaotic, the indians as neutral, and the chinese army+ninjas as a lawful/chaotic mix, like the drakes+saurians....

Ninja are Japanese, not chinese.

Samurai/Ninja would make a good lawful/chaotic mix like Drakes/Saurians.

It's probably as reasonable to consider the Mediaeval Chinese army purely lawful as it is to consider the Mediaeval European army (which is basically what the Loyalists are) purely lawful.

Stilgar · Post by **Stilgar** » July 15th, 2007, 9:31 am

I was under the impression that being "lawful" or "chaotic" in Wesnoth meant only "fights better at day than at night" and vice versa, and that the only reason those terms were used is because they were the simplest ones to represent that? (And perhaps because, if I recall correctly, those were the terms that Master of Monsters used?)

Weeksy · Post by **Weeksy** » July 15th, 2007, 5:44 pm

Irrevenant, while ninja faught primarily in japan, for the Japanese lords, they were a Chinese invention, and quite a few came over from China. I'll try to get some citations later this week, but you could put them with their traditional enemies in order to provide players who would be more comfortable doing things by location and not nationality. This would mean that we'd have to reconsider the phoenix/dragon situation, but I think that could be managed....

hagabaka · Post by **hagabaka** » August 2nd, 2007, 2:01 am

Hello,

The idea of far east faction(s) sounds very interesting. I hope to write a campaign with them. I drew a sprite for a Chinese goddess/nymph thing; the current version is here. See the first post in the thread about some descriptions of the unit.

I'm not sure whether this will fit in the Chinese faction. On one hand it would be nice to have a female and magical unit; on the other hand this doesn't seem to be a unit who'll be usually fighting with the Chinese army, even in fantasy stories. My impression is that they're more like messengers from the heavens, who will offer advices to the emperor and heroes, and occasionally help neutralize evil monsters. So maybe it should only appear as a character in campaigns. Either way, I hope to get some suggestions on how to flesh out the unit. Here is my profile for the unit.

Name: Celestial Maiden (suggestions?)
Level: 2

HP: 32
MP: 6
XP: 80

Attacks:
melee / whisk 2-2 / impact (blur)
ranged / heavenly wind 10-3 / cold (magical)

The whisk seems to be a weapon favored by Taoists. The blur weapon special is like a temporary slow, reducing damage received by half, because the tassel blurs the vision of the attacker.

Resistances:
blade: 0%
cold: 40%
fire: 20%
arcane: 0%
pierce: 0%
impact: 0%

Terrain Movement Defense
Castle 1 60%
Village 1 60%
Deep Water 1 60%
Shallow Water 1 60%
Grassland 1 60%
Forest 3 60%
Hills 2 60%
Mountains 3 60%
Swamp 1 60%
Sand 1 60%
Cave 2 60%
Snow 1 60%
Mushroom Grove 3 60%
Chasm 99 60%

She hovers above flat terrains including water, so movement is reduced only on mountains, forest, etc. Her defense is higher than most flying units because the magical clouds around her obstruct the attacker's view and impede their strikes.

nebula955 · Post by **nebula955** » August 2nd, 2007, 2:59 am

this is what we call overpowered