Ultimatum is a outrageous game indeed.

[Cliff]

Ya,it has infringed the license. However,we can adopt some good ideas that Ultimatum .
For example, 1. building ,equipment and unit upgrades
2. the player can build structures

[turin]

1. Ultimatum has not, in fact, infringed on Wesnoth's license. It has graphics that are "inspired" by Wesnoth's graphics; but Wesnoth has graphics that are "inspired" by Final Fantasy, Ogre Battle, and myriad other games. Being "inspired" by something does not, necessarily, entail license infringement. And the gameplay is not particularly similar.

2. Wesnoth is by design a war game - not an empire-building game. Having the ability to build structures, purchase upgrades, etc, would fundamentally change the gameplay of Wesnoth. It would make it Not-Wesnoth. That would be A Very Bad Thing (tm). There is nothing wrong with a game with those characteristics, but that game would not be Wesnoth, and clearly a lot of people like Wesnoth the way it is...

[Jetrel]

1. building ,equipment and unit upgrades
2. the player can build structures

Given how overpoweringly prevalent those are in the gaming industry, you might think that Dave had WILLFULLY OMITTED them. Because he's explicitly stated that he did.



That said, it's an interesting point of psychology that so many people think of adding these in spite of what's already been stated as our design principles. This is why "so many people" suck at general design.

LESS IS MORE, retards.

[Dragon Master]

even if we did implement it, what would you build that could be in anyway more useful than villages?

[Eleazar]

That said, it's an interesting point of psychology that so many people think of adding these in spite of what's already been stated as our design principles. This is why "so many people" suck at general design.

LESS IS MORE, retards.

Ah, yes, that's one of the greatest short internet videos ever. I've seen the design process go wrong like that — though thankfully not go that far wrong.

Most commercial games are designed to be played for a few weeks to a few months. With mods maybe for a year, with only rare exceptions. Wesnoth offers a different type of gaming experience from most commercial war games, and people are remaining interested in playing it for multiple years. Wesnoth occupies one of the top spots in the open source game world (especially if you discount "clones" of commercial products). Why should we abandon successful individuality, to try to compete in an overcrowded sub-catagory of strategy gaming?

[Viliam]

Wesnoth is simple. Well... some parts are difficult, the other parts are simple. The simple parts let player to concentrate fully on the few difficult parts. The difficult parts are units and terrains. If you change units and terrains, you have changed the way you need to play the scenario. Changing the difficult parts is what makes player interested.

Games like e.g. Warcraft have a difficult system of constructing buildings and upgrading units. The only problem is that in another scenario, you usually get the same buildings and the same unit lines. So after you have played a few multiplayer scenarios, when you get a new multiplayer scenario, you will probably do exactly the same thing as you did before. OK, sometimes you will put a defense tower on a different place, depending on the surrounding terrain. But it is never like "oh, in this map I should probably use archers-only strategy... and in that map, I have to avoid archers and use only knights and mages". This is what makes it boring after a while... the complicated parts are always the same. Building a development tree can be fun when you do it for the first time. Then it becomes something you do without thinking ("yeah... +1 armor... +2 armor... +1 attack... +2 attack... +1 range... +2 range... +1 mana... +2 mana").

Some Wesnoth scenarios could use buildings or upgrades, but done in a non-boring way. For example it would be interesting to offer player after finishing each scenario to upgrade some unit type in some attribute. But in one campaign only! It could be interesting to have a scenario where player fights along the long road, and on a few specific places s/he finds ruins of the castle, and can re-build them for 200 GP... so that s/he can choose to re-build some, but cannot re-build all. Again, only one such scenario! If you put it into each campaign, each scenario, it will become boring...

[Darth Fool]

And of course, the great thing is, this can already be done with WML.

[Nev]

I have to agree with the developers on this one - "If it isn't broken... why fix it?"

I'm a huge fan of this type of game - currently playing Advanced Wars 2 on GBA - awesome, awesome stuff. Advanced Wars plays... well, pretty much identically to Wesnoth, but set in a modern/futuristic Manga setting - worth checking out if you have a GBA. Worth buying a GBA if you don't. And no, I don't work for Nintendo.

[Maeglin Dubh]

Welcome to the forums, I'll be your friendly neighborhood Sith Lord.

I wonder why this was resurrected to tell the devs that they're right.

They already know that.

((And yes, AW is fairly fun. Not as fun as Wesnoth, though.))

Locked, since I've heard quite enough about Ultimatum, and we really don't need this to be resurrected again.