The Dwarvish Treasure - Version 0.5

Post by **Baufo** » September 19th, 2006, 5:49 pm

1) I agree spawn camping is a problem. I am thinking about rotating spawns (so you can't camp at a weak hero's spawn)

2) Nothing I could do. I think the creeps head toward a place where others of them are already fighting.

Anyway thanks for the feedback

Arhnayel · Post by **Arhnayel** » September 19th, 2006, 6:40 pm

This version is very very good ! I like it !! But still, I think that giving +10hp when you kill a creep at the computer's turn isn't so good. Strong fighters can kill one to three creeps in this turn and become to much powerfull. I don't konw what is the best solution :
- no bonus ?
- only +5hp ?
- removing fighters from heroes ?

but I'm pretty sure you'll find a good one

once again, nice job !

Merudo · Post by **Merudo** » September 19th, 2006, 9:54 pm

Another thing, the skirmisher ability seems to be very powerful on this map. When all the yeti are dead, it is a big race for the treasure. Yet, skirmishers can simply bypass all the guardians and go straight for the treasure, while other players must kill 2-3 guardians each.

This get even worse for the Fencer, who is already quite overpowered. He has 60% def anywhere, has great movement, and is one of the very few units who get 5 attacks naturally. And he has the skirmisher ability. Not suprisingly, almost everyone I talked to agree that Fencers win the most.

Merudo · Post by **Merudo** » September 19th, 2006, 10:02 pm

Baufo wrote: 2) Nothing I could do. I think the creeps head toward a place where others of them are already fighting.

To compensate that, you could also make some creatures spawn outside the middle ( they could spawn on the sides of the map ). That way even if all creatures go the same way some are bound to enter your "territory" to do so

Post by **Baufo** » September 20th, 2006, 4:26 am

Merudo wrote:Another thing, the skirmisher ability seems to be very powerful on this map. When all the yeti are dead, it is a big race for the treasure. Yet, skirmishers can simply bypass all the guardians and go straight for the treasure, while other players must kill 2-3 guardians each.

This get even worse for the Fencer, who is already quite overpowered. He has 60% def anywhere, has great movement, and is one of the very few units who get 5 attacks naturally. And he has the skirmisher ability. Not suprisingly, almost everyone I talked to agree that Fencers win the most.

Hmm... so I should remove it?

Multiplayer Scenarios / Campaigns · Post by **Rhuvaen** » September 20th, 2006, 3:27 pm

Baufo wrote:I agree spawn camping is a problem. I am thinking about rotating spawns (so you can't camp at a weak hero's spawn)

That's not a solution. Players who are lagging behind need to move to the creep spawn places to get stronger. They're easily caught by players with some move bonuses. It's good that there's only six dwarven potions - but player killing offers potentially infinite number of attacks, and it's way overpowered. I'd still say only give the bonus once per player - it's too easy to run away from the rest of the group otherwise. It also detracts from the scenario goal.

Also, maybe restrict bonuses to once per turn. It's too easy to accumulate tons of hp once you get stronger and move close to a lot of low-level creeps (who all suicide). I ended the last game with 745 hp or something.

EDIT: it would be great to have the intro in the scenario objectives, too, for mid-game reference.

Post by **Baufo** » September 20th, 2006, 6:19 pm

Hmm seem like I should really work on DT more. I must admit that I have not completed to many games of it...

Let's see what next weekend will bring

Merudo · Post by **Merudo** » September 20th, 2006, 10:44 pm

Another thing ; I would recommand giving a different bonus for killing Yeti. They give +2 moves and that is a bit much. What happens is that the first player that kill the yeti get movement bonus that allows him to quickly go to the second yeti and kill it, getting even more movement that allows him to go to the next yeti and so on. Maybe give +1 movement and +4 damage or something, +2 movement is really powerful and it often takes less time to move to the next yeti then to go get a blue potion ( since terrain makes it longer to get blue potion ).

Elestel · Post by **Elestel** » September 21st, 2006, 12:17 pm

10 reasons for not play this scenary

- It's addictive
- See the flying zombie going out of the gate when you close it
- Have a crashing windows
- Hear a dialectical battle between two players about non-game things (or personal)
- Not have compromised people knowing it can take a more than a while
- Have a wet bow and fail every shoot
- Be pursued by bad luck and an agressive player finding a lot of attacks from a poor lv 1-2 player
- Realize you have the worst unit at the turn 10
- See a group of danzing trolls going round the treasure
- It's too addictive

Merudo · Post by **Merudo** » September 23rd, 2006, 10:50 am

Also, I noticed that strong creeps ALWAYS go the left. In all the games I played they never went to the right. This means people at slot 3-4 have a big advantage and can generally kill creep easily.

Merudo · Post by **Merudo** » September 23rd, 2006, 11:55 am

Baufo wrote:
Merudo wrote:Another thing, the skirmisher ability seems to be very powerful on this map. When all the yeti are dead, it is a big race for the treasure. Yet, skirmishers can simply bypass all the guardians and go straight for the treasure, while other players must kill 2-3 guardians each.

This get even worse for the Fencer, who is already quite overpowered. He has 60% def anywhere, has great movement, and is one of the very few units who get 5 attacks naturally. And he has the skirmisher ability. Not suprisingly, almost everyone I talked to agree that Fencers win the most.
Hmm... so I should remove it?

One less extreme thing you could do would be to change the treasure area a bit... as it is skirmisher can go past the two guardians in the water and go straight to fight the unstoned troll warrior... and guardians cant even attack him back ! You could make it so the guardians are one title closer to the troll warrior, so that even if skirmisher go past them, guardians will still attack him. I would also boost the power of the guardians, they are very weak at the moment and do almost no damage...

Post by **Baufo** » November 11th, 2006, 4:18 pm

Finally I have polished this sceanrio again a bit.
Version 0.3:

No weapons for killing normal creeps. Only specialless wepaons for strong creeps. The really good weapons can be got by killing one of the units in the middle and stepping on their chest (Each of it contains a weapon that is typically used by the unit that guarded it).
Killing a creep on the AI's turn give now only half the hp bonus.
Removed all skirmisher units.

About the spawn camper problem: There will always be lamers who play in a way that makes the game less enjoyable for the other players. I have been thinking a lot about it but could not find a really good solution so I think players should simply not do it. Campers are also a problem of most FPSs but they do also not kill you automatically if you don't move for one minute or anything like that.

Uploaded to the campaign server (with TCed icon).

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » November 14th, 2006, 5:48 pm

I really like this level, really good job;

Any chance of convincing you to make a version with completely custom and awesome creeps?

(I'll help!

)

Post by **Baufo** » November 14th, 2006, 7:06 pm

Neoriceisgood wrote:I really like this level, really good job;

Any chance of convincing you to make a version with completely custom and awesome creeps? (I'll help! )

I would love to! Especially I would like six cool unique monsters insteed of these boring yetis.

Tomorrow is a holiday in Austria so I could start trying myself on sprite art a bit. But I warn you: think twice if you really want to help me with it - I suck at art

Post by **Neoriceisgood** » November 14th, 2006, 7:32 pm

Well, I'd be the one doing the art