"Asia Mod" by Thelost1 Updated to version [0.2]

[appleide]

Weeellll. Given playtests, I think that I may exclude he engineer and give the glider a lvl 2 and 3 and thhe rocket launcher will have a lvl 2.

Note that neither will be leader choices.

Hey, what about this, make the rocket launcher as an advance for the engineer! After all, it is controlled by the engineer.

Temuchin is right, Crossbowmen are definitely essential.

[Seleukus]

The level 0 crossbowmen should be able to either upgrade into heavy crossbowmen (only name I could think of) with stronger attack, or repeating crossbowmen.


Some information about repeating crossbows:

Repeating crossbows have a long history, with the oldest accurate written knowledge dating back to the Han dynasty (ca. 20-220 A.D.) in China. The Chinese repeating crossbow (诸葛弩, pinyin Zhū Gě nǔ, English transcription: Chu-ko-nu or Zhuge-nu, meaning 'Zhuge crossbow' in English) is an extremely simple piece of equipment. It is claimed to have been invented by Chinese strategist Zhuge Liang (181-234 A.D.), which is arguable since the earliest drawings of the weapon have been found from the buried library of Chu, dating all the way back to 250 B.C. It is more likely that during the Ming dynasty historians confused it with Zhuge Liang`s invention of the lian-nu which shot two to three bolts at once and was used in massed formations. The Chinese repeating crossbow saw its last serious action in the China-Japan war of 1894-1895, where photographs show repeating crossbows as common weapons among Manchurian troops. The basic construction of this weapon has remained very much unchanged since its invention, making it one of the longest-lived mechanical weapons.
[edit]

Chu-ko-nu (or Zhuge Nu)

The chu-ko-nu is one of the most simple, rugged and famous designs. This weapon was extremely easy to manufacture and use, and could easily launch ten arrows in fifteen seconds. In comparison, a standard arbalest could barely shoot one in that time. The chu-ko-nu, however, had neither the power nor accuracy of a common crossbow, for operational reasons. This gave it a shorter range, compensated for by using lightweight arrows instead of the heavy bolts of single-shot crossbows. Thus, the chu-ko-nu was not very useful against more heavily armored troops unless poison was smeared on arrows, in which case even a small wound could be fatal. Since a chu-ko-nu was shot from the hip, the accuracy was poor but could be adjusted very swiftly since the next shot was only a second away.

The chu-ko-nu was operated by moving a lever forwards and backwards. In that movement, a bolt would be dropped in place, the string would be strung, then the bolt would be shot and another one would be ready to take its place.

This put the weapon's string under heavy wear since it had forces straining it from above and below, and lifting of the magazine especially added serious pressure to the string. Nu-strings were therefore often reinforced with quills of birds, preferably swan or duck.

Alterations of chu-ko-nus included mountable siege crossbows with bigger arrows and greater power which required two men to operate: sighter and operator. There was also a heavy version using two magazines, thus doubling the number of arrows discharged. The latter was used in extreme close-quarter combat because they had extremely short range, and the bigger version which required two hands to operate was mounted on wall tops. They proved to be effective in defending gates and doorways of castles. It can be considered as a kind of submachine gun of the ancients.

- Source

These repeating crossbows would have low attack (2-4), but a high number of attacks (8-12.) They would also poison enemies. They could upgrade to units that carry two repeating crossbows (having twice as many attacks.)[/url]

[appleide]

Could do this and replace current archer:

Chu Ku No Archer: attacks as good as elfish archer, but because of inferior movement and move type, costs less.

cost 15
smallfoot
hp: 35

Leather Armour (against other arrows) : 10% resistance vs pierce.

Chu Ku No:
Ranged
2-5 pierce
Short Ranged
4-5 pierce

Dagger:
4-2 blade

[Seleukus]

They would have much higher number of attacks then Elvish archers. Remember, the best longbowmen could only launch 10-15 arrows/minute. A chu ko nu can launch 40-60 bolts in a minute. That's a very significant difference.

I'm thinking something more like this:
Repeating Crossbowmen (The chu ko nu was the name of the weapon, not the wielder.)
HP: 20 (lowered to compensate for lower cost)
Cost: 10 (very common, as it could be used without training)
Moves: 4-5
Resistances: 0 for everything, except 20% for holy. Standard.
Dagger (blade): 3-2
Chu ko nu (pierce): 2-8 poison

[appleide]

But, you could argue that elvish archers DO fire that many arrows with their hands only.

[Seleukus]

I'm not sure what you mean by that. Could you clarify?

[appleide]

I'm not sure what you mean by that. Could you clarify?

For example: Elvish archers can fire arrows so fast their speed can only be matched by chu ku no, this is why elves have 5-4 as ranged and chu ku no have 4-5...

[Seleukus]

Simply put, it is impossible to do that. No matter how quickly you can fire an arrow, it takes time to take an arrow out of a quiver, nock it, aim, and fire. You cannot do so in one or two seconds; the best longbowmen could do it in perhaps four (really stretching it) or five seconds. And that is devoting almost no time to accuracy - just aiming roughly at a thick clump of enemy soldiers and firing. Chu ko nus would thus be able to fire three or so times more than the best archers.

You could end up giving them 1-15 (pierce) with poison. That could work too.

[appleide]

Simply put, it is impossible to do that. No matter how quickly you can fire an arrow, it takes time to take an arrow out of a quiver, nock it, aim, and fire. You cannot do so in one or two seconds; the best longbowmen could do it in perhaps four (really stretching it) or five seconds. And that is devoting almost no time to accuracy - just aiming roughly at a thick clump of enemy soldiers and firing. Chu ko nus would thus be able to fire three or so times more than the best archers.

You could end up giving them 1-15 (pierce) with poison. That could work too.

We're talking about elves, here. Also, WINR Wesnoth is not real.

[turin]

1-15 poison? Why should the unit be guaranteed to poison the enemy?


If anything, it sounds like the unit should be 2-10 with maximum accuracy 50%.

[Prometheus]

Based on Seleukus comments, I would say the crossbow line would look something like this:

level 0 peasant crossbowman 8-1 damage

level 1 heavy crossbowman 8-2 damage

level 2 two-handed crossbow 30-1 damage, moves slow
level 2 multi-barrel crossbow(lian-nu) 16-2 damage

level 1 repeating crossbow (chu-ko-nu) 2-8 damage

level 2 poisoned repeater 2-8 damage, poison
level 2 double magazine repeater 2-16 damage

That's a lot of unit art. But I think leveling up the crossbowman should be a big part of the Chinese faction.

[turin]

One thing to remember is that having a 1-16 attack doesn't actually simulate a fast-firing crossbow very well. In fact, it will make the unit take a lot longer to shoot than most units - it has to fire 16 times, taking at least half a second each attack. That's not a huge problem with a unit that is 5-4, but a 1-16 unit would just get irritating with how long it takes.

[appleide]

I got a better idea.. (at least in my opinion... ).

The repeater crossbowman has:
a 4-2 sword attack
a 2-4 ranged attack attack weight = 0
a 5-4 ranged attack defense weight = 0

2-4 is used for defending, it is low because presumably any ranged units would have attacked it from further away. 5-4 is used for attacking only, presumably because the repeater crossbowman would've gone closer to bring the full potential out of the weapon, whilst the opponent ranged unit would still have their full potential even though target is not so far away any more. -K-I-S-S-. I have made an update with this implemented. (and all the names changed to english.... so that it can be easily playtested as people now know exactly what each unit is designed for)

[appleide]

Based on Seleukus comments, I would say the crossbow line would look something like this:

level 0 peasant crossbowman 8-1 damage

level 1 heavy crossbowman 8-2 damage

level 2 two-handed crossbow 30-1 damage, moves slow
level 2 multi-barrel crossbow(lian-nu) 16-2 damage

level 1 repeating crossbow (chu-ko-nu) 2-8 damage

level 2 poisoned repeater 2-8 damage, poison
level 2 double magazine repeater 2-16 damage

That's a lot of unit art. But I think leveling up the crossbowman should be a big part of the Chinese faction.

I think having just plain crossbows isn't too exciting for a unit supposed to be the main tree.
The crossbowman line, could go like this:
Level 1: Crossbow 11-2 pierce [Is this too much?]
Level 2: Composite Crossbow 13-3 pierce
Level 2: Repeater Crossbow [defend 2-4] 6-4 Berserk 2 (combat is twice as long)

Level 3: Steel Crossbow 17-3 pierce
Level 3: 2 Magazine repeater Crossbowman [defend 3-4] [8-4] Berserk 2

We are talking about an army, right? I don't think there should be level 0 crossbowman... (eg, no peasant in loyalists) It is not zero-cost equipment...

[turin]

He means "rage (2)" - rage is an Imperial Era special that works like berserk, but instead of infinite rounds, 2 rounds.