New Dark Adept Branch - CONTINUED

[Circon]

Leadership and Healing will be fine.

[J-ser]

Can we keep darkens as well? I relly want to use that to kill humans.

[tigrezno]

bad stats i think. My idea is a branch focusing in ranged damage increment, and the other branch in leadership, heals OR darkens and normal damage. You are giving too much power for a single unit.

[autolycus]

Leadership, Healing, Darkness, Slow

I suggest a way to reconcile these four 'aura'-type suggestions.

The dark adept is de facto an undead commander, and if he is going to lead hordes of undead to some military goal, he will need the ability to control them well. So at least one branch must have leadership (the undead variety). If there is only one branch, it should be leadership, or else the undead ought to be even more ineffective.

So perhaps you could have L1 Dark Adept, L2 Dark Commander (has Leadership), and two L3 choices - Dark Captain (adds Darkness, he imposes a penalty to opposite-aligned troops) or Dark Sustainer (adds Healing, he imposes a heal bonus to his own troops as he repairs them with dark energies each round). This gives the undead player strategic options equivalent but not the same as the Elvish player.

I don't like the Slow option. It somehow isn't obviously an undead faction type of power. But others may differ. Also note that I place Captain at a higher level than Commander. You could reverse this, it's just that to me Captain seems to imply a more frontline role - as the unit would have to have if it wanted to use its darkness aura in the most effective way.

[Elvish_Pillager]

I say do Dark Commander->Dark Lord and give Leadership, then Darkens.

[AT]

The Dark Captian is on my to-do list, but i can't promise when (or exactly how), so feel free to keep brainstorming and trying to get god stats and such.

[Circon]

Another attempt at statting these units...

"Dark Commander" :
- Hitpoints : 32
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : 120
- Level : 2
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Dark Lord, Dark Sustainer
- Cost : 40 ?
- Usage : Mixed fighter
- Ability : Leadership
- Attack :
name = dark cry
type = cold
range = long
damage = 10
number = 2


"Dark Sustainer" :
- Hitpoints : 40
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120 ?
- Usage : Healer
- Ability : Leadership, Heals
- Attack :
name = dark scream
type = cold
special = slow
range = long
damage = 18
number = 2

"Dark Lord" :
- Hitpoints : 52
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120 ?
- Usage : No idea
- Ability : Leadership,Dark Aura
- Attack :

name = dark scream
type = cold
special = slow
range = long
damage = 11
number = 3


Hmm... Dark Lord is overused, but Lord seems to be a standard for the other races... Lord of Death perhaps? Undead lord?

[autolycus]

I think Dark Lord is fine. It's obvious, and if people say it's a cliche, well we make good use of cliches here at Wesnoth!

[tigrezno]

remove slow from all them, too many features.

[Circon]

remove slow from all them, too many features.

Evlish Shaman, a lvl 1 unit, has both slow and heals.
You should note that the level 2 unit does *not* have slow...

[tigrezno]

remove slow from all them, too many features.

Evlish Shaman, a lvl 1 unit, has both slow and heals.
You should note that the level 2 unit does *not* have slow...

Well, i think those two branches should be more different, as example, give slow + leadership to one branch, and dark aura + heals to another, but not slow+leadership for two branches.

[Elvish_Pillager]

You should note that the level 2 unit does *not* have slow...

You should note that no other unit gains more than one ability on level-up...

I think heals is weak. I think the Sustainer should get Cures...and I don't think it should get Slow.
I think slowing is kind of weird... at least for the Sustainer. For the lord, it's OK.
I think their HP could be increased a bit.

Otherwise, they're good stats. It's nice to see units without 4 abilities, and the other stats are reasonable enough.

[Mutxiko]

Well, well, I am VERY glad to see that the ideas are being efficiently discussed !


Thank you AT for your answer, too !


Here is another update of the stats ( mostly a synthesia of everything you said... but the new things are commented with "// ....." ) :

"Dark Commander" :
- Hitpoints : 32
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : 120
- Level : 2
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Dark Lord, Dark Sustainer
- Cost : 40 // ??
- Usage : Mixed fighter
- Ability : Leadership
- Attack :
name = dark cry
type = cold
special = magical // ?? ( maybe too powerful )
range = long
damage = 10
number = 2


"Dark Sustainer" :
- Hitpoints : 48 // he must not be too weak since he has no melee defend
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120 // ??
- Usage : Healer
- Ability : Leadership, Cures // Yes, a true healer...
- Attack :
name = dark scream
type = cold
special = magical // more balanced than slow, IMO
range = long
damage = 13 // it is a healer, after all
number = 2


"Dark Lord" :
- Hitpoints : 56 // considering the Lich's 66 HP and high damage...
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120 // ??
- Usage : Mixed fighter
- Ability : Leadership, Dark Aura // ( "Unlights")
- Attack :
name = dark scream
type = cold
special = slow
range = long
damage = 9 // Yes, a mixed fighter, and this is less than the Lich's 12-3 attack
number = 3


-------------------------

Now I guess I have to do the graphics for the Dark Sustainer and the Dark Lord , if the Dark Commander's graphics ( level 2 ) are enough for a beta-implementation... But I will be completely away on Sunday, Monday and Tuesday ( If you wanna know, in a 3-days horseback trip in the Pyrénées ), and on Thursday is the beginning of the school-year.

So maybe we could share the work : I suggest that Circon and Elvish Pillager work together ( or against each other ) for the Dark Lord's graphics ( it ought to be very impressive, IMHO ), and I will try to draw a nice complete set for the Dark Sustainer ( since some people liked my "undead-healing" animation ).

What do you think about all this ?

[tigrezno]

Again, my opinion is giving leadership, dark aura, and slow is too powerfull.

Those are my stats:

"Dark Commander" :
- Hitpoints : 32
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : 120
- Level : 2
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Dark Lord, Dark Sustainer
- Cost : 40
- Usage : Mixed fighter
- Ability : Leadership
- Attack :
name = dark cry
type = cold
special = magical
range = long
damage = 8
number = 3


"Dark Sustainer" :
- Hitpoints : 48
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120
- Usage : Healer
- Ability : Leadership, Cures
- Attack :
name = dark scream
type = cold
special = magical
range = long
damage = 10
number = 3


"Dark Lord" :
- Hitpoints : 56
- Movement type : Undeadfoot
- Movement : 5
- Experience : --
- Level : 3
- Alignement : Chaotic
- Advance to : Null
- Cost : 120 // ??
- Usage : Mixed fighter
- Ability : Leadership, Dark Aura
- Attack :
name = dark scream
type = cold
special = magical
range = long
damage = 12
number = 3


[edit]
Also, i think necro/lich branch should gain more ranged damage and no abilities (just only drain). So necro should do 14-2 and lich 14-3, IMO.

[Circon]

So maybe we could share the work : I suggest that Circon and Elvish Pillager work together ( or against each other ) for the Dark Lord's graphics ( it ought to be very impressive, IMHO ), and I will try to draw a nice complete set for the Dark Sustainer ( since some people liked my "undead-healing" animation ).

You asked me to do a unit???
Don't ask me to do units.
Because if you ask me to do units...

Da da da DAHHH!!