[Historical] Orcish campaign

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How is this campaign ?

Too hard, I'm stuck!
0
No votes
Hard, but challenging
3
75%
Just as it ought
1
25%
Too easy, I already have 20 lvl3 trolls !
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 4

benj
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Re: Names of trolls in Towards_Mountains_of_Haag

Post by benj » May 12th, 2004, 12:49 pm

Jyhem wrote:I like the names, and the humor, and the campaign, but
I'm just trying to avoid unnecessary problems.
Especially as these names only appear in one scenario,
it would involve much to change them.
You're right, all these names come from the comic book "Trolls de Troy". When I chose them, I did not think about this problem. I will change them, thought AFAIK as they are not trademarks I think there is few chances we'll have a problem. Grüü is a private joke between me and some colleagues but I think it is derivated from the sound of an animal in another comic book (La quête de l'oiseau du temps). This one is OK I think. Thanks for raising this issue.

Insinuator wrote: Small bug report: On the "Smug" level, an error was made in turns; a big one. Turns are set to two instead of twenty, thus making the scenario impossible. Also, some of the dialog had spaces such as this:" ." And the last or second to last dialog line says something to the effect of: "Leave your troops there and then go defend the city." The there was not mentioned in the rest of the subject matter, so I assume it means here.
You're right, there was a bug (now fixed). I fixed the typos too. Thanks for your feedback.

benj
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New scénario : Saving Inarix

Post by benj » May 15th, 2004, 11:29 am

FYI, a new scenario has been commited in CVS. It features the rescue of Saurians, orcish allies, by Kapou'e. Will Kapou'e be able to cross enemy lines and to rescue Inarix, ruler of Saurians? It is up to you !

Image Fearless Inarix ...

Neoriceisgood
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Post by Neoriceisgood » May 15th, 2004, 11:34 am

=D rejoice of the saurians ::must make animations for the level 3 one..::

Jyhem
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Re: Names of trolls in Towards_Mountains_of_Haag

Post by Jyhem » May 15th, 2004, 6:28 pm

benj wrote:
Jyhem wrote:I like the names, and the humor, and the campaign, but
I'm just trying to avoid unnecessary problems.
Especially as these names only appear in one scenario,
it not would involve much to change them.
You're right, all these names come from the comic book "Trolls de Troy". When I chose them, I did not think about this problem. I will change them, thought AFAIK as they are not trademarks I think there is few chances we'll have a problem.
I'm not a lawyer, but as it's so plainly inspired, let's just stay on the safe side.
benj wrote: Grüü is a private joke between me and some colleagues but I think it is derivated from the sound of an animal in another comic book (La quête de l'oiseau du temps). This one is OK I think. Thanks for raising this issue.
I agree: it's just a sound, and it is not used in the same context at all (I certainly don't remember any Trolls in "La quête de l'oiseau du temps").
Plus, it really suits the character :-D
I'd leave it there.

Sangel
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Post by Sangel » May 15th, 2004, 11:00 pm

Yes, I like the idea of Trolls with simple "sounds" for names - Grüü, Ugg, Targ, Tor, etc. I've renamed all my trolls in the Orc campaign along these lines.

Hmmm. Maybe we should create a set of troll names for the game.
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Insinuator
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Post by Insinuator » May 16th, 2004, 6:25 am

For those of us without access or knowledge of CVS (I don't even know what it stands for), will you be posting any binary versions?

benj
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Post by benj » May 16th, 2004, 9:44 am

Insinuator wrote:For those of us without access or knowledge of CVS (I don't even know what it stands for), will you be posting any binary versions?
CVS is the central repository of code, intended to developers or people who want to test bleeding edge features. As the campaign is now official (thus in CVS), I think the best way is to wait for the new version (0.7.7 or 0.8 ), who is to come soon I bet.

Insinuator
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What now?

Post by Insinuator » May 21st, 2004, 7:41 am

Sorry to take up space if the answer is obvious, but I have as question as to the winning conditions in the "Saving Inarix" scenario. How do you win? Obviously, it is almost impossible to kill the leaders, so, logically, I just tried to follow the directions. I rescued five saurians (a name which I strongly object to) and brought them inside the fort. I assume the fort is the large, northern structure. Nothing happens. I arrange them on the wall. Nothing happens. I fall back all my troops to the castle. Nothing happens. I study the event procedure for ten minutes and try again after gaining no insight. I'm not sure whether the coding is incorrect, or if I am supposed to defeat the enemy leaders. If the latter is true, I give up.

benj
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Re: What now?

Post by benj » May 21st, 2004, 3:17 pm

Insinuator wrote:Sorry to take up space if the answer is obvious, but I have as question as to the winning conditions in the "Saving Inarix" scenario. How do you win? Obviously, it is almost impossible to kill the leaders, so, logically, I just tried to follow the directions. I rescued five saurians (a name which I strongly object to) and brought them inside the fort. I assume the fort is the large, northern structure. Nothing happens. I arrange them on the wall. Nothing happens. I fall back all my troops to the castle. Nothing happens. I study the event procedure for ten minutes and try again after gaining no insight. I'm not sure whether the coding is incorrect, or if I am supposed to defeat the enemy leaders. If the latter is true, I give up.
You are supposed to send your saurian folks to the middle of the bridge where it is fortified.

Which version of wesnoth are you using ? You must use an up to date CVS version or 0.7.7. If you are, please send me or attach to this forum a copy of your savefile so that I can track the bug down.

Sangel
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Post by Sangel » May 22nd, 2004, 2:27 am

OK, I guess I'll be the first one to say it: Saving Inarix is way too hard, even on Easy, and that's even in the context of a campaign which is overly difficult on Easy.

Through over-recruitment, strategy and no small measure of luck (if the computer sends its initial troops downwards, you're screwed), I've managed to get in a position to win (like Insinuator, I can't actually win, even with a bunch of Saurians all the way across the bridge). However, there are literally hordes of elves all over me, and I'm losing second and third level units all over the place. This should not be happening on an Easy game.

Balancing needed (especially for easy):

- The swamp needs to extend further up, and contain at least one, preferably two more villages. Saurians don't regenerate, remember.

- The Elven Castle needs to shrink two hexes, and the Knalgan Castle at least one. At present, the size of their waves is too great.

- The enemy leaders need to run out of gold after five to six waves, tops, on easy. Having them recruiting a full castle of troops on Turn 10 is just plain crazy.
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Insinuator
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Needs tweaking

Post by Insinuator » May 24th, 2004, 7:26 am

Yes, indeed. I am afraid I can't imagine how those with the latest version of BfW could beat it. My favorite scenario in all of BfW was the previous one. I upgraded more units there than I did in the entire rest of the orcish campaign combined. 3 Troll Warriors, 2 Trolls, 2 Orcish Warlords, 3 Orcish Warriors, 1 Crossbowman, 1 Direwolver, 2 Goblin Knights, and a host of others close to upgrading. I had roughly 350 gold, not bad. And, my saurians could regenerate (I despise skirmishing lizards).

With these conditions, I was able to hold off the hordes, but just barely. This campaign marked the first time I have strategically retreated. Not winning slightly irked me. Less castle tiles I very strongly second. The rest, well, don't make it too easy.

Sangel
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Post by Sangel » May 24th, 2004, 12:33 pm

Is there a way to change map details between difficulties levels? Prestart events maybe? This way the swamp could be small on Hard, bigger on Medium, and large on Easy.

Come to think of it... prestart events would do the job nicely.
"Pure logic is the ruin of the spirit." - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Dave
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Post by Dave » May 24th, 2004, 2:50 pm

Sangel wrote:Is there a way to change map details between difficulties levels? Prestart events maybe? This way the swamp could be small on Hard, bigger on Medium, and large on Easy.

Come to think of it... prestart events would do the job nicely.
prestart events could do it, but would be annoying to specify precisely where the terrain goes.

Easier, though more redundant:

map=Saving_Inarix

#ifdef HARD
map=Saving_Inarix_small_swamp
#enddef

#ifdef EASY
map=Saving_Inarix_large_swamp
#enddef

Of course, this means that if you want to change the map, you have to change all three versions, but otoh, with a prestart event it's still likely you'd have to change the event depending, anyway.

Whether a prestart event or different specification of maps is easier really depends on what the precise changes are.

Hmmmm...perhaps it would be cool to allow a new way to change terrain:

Code: Select all

[apply_terrain_mask]
x,y=10,20
mask="
..WWWWW...
...WWWW...
.WWWWWWW..
..WWWW...
....W...."
[/apply_terrain_mask]
and it super-imposes the map block given over the map at location (10,20), with a '.' meaning "leave this tile as-is". In fact, I don't know why I didn't think of this earlier, since I think this is the perfect way to manipulate maps mid-scenario.

David
“At Gambling, the deadly sin is to mistake bad play for bad luck.” -- Ian Fleming

Roel
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Post by Roel » May 24th, 2004, 2:52 pm

does manipulating maps mid scenario mean things like floods and earthquakes? Or islands rising up from the ocean?

Dave
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Post by Dave » May 24th, 2004, 2:59 pm

Roel wrote:does manipulating maps mid scenario mean things like floods and earthquakes? Or islands rising up from the ocean?
You can do things like that with map manipulation.

In this context we're simply talking about manipulating a map at the start of the scenario based on difficulty level though.

Another example of map manipulation is how snow starts to fall in 'Northern Winter'.

David
“At Gambling, the deadly sin is to mistake bad play for bad luck.” -- Ian Fleming

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