Categorizing UMC music by moods

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 3rd, 2023, 2:53 pm

beforethisbattle.ogg Creepy, Underground Works for either IMHO
Yeah I had both creepy and underground, too, as well as calm for a possible 3rd one

Had a quick re-listen and yeah, calm's OK too...

Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?

In this context, yes

Hadn't really gotten wistful on listening but now you've pointed it out, I could live with sad as well for this one.

defeat_ending_adventures.ogg Sad, Calm? Duration ~35 secs, ends abruptly, maybe one to exclude?
I had this one as just "Sad", but will just leave it out

defeattheme.ogg Normal, Sad? Not that sad IMHO, duration ~13 secs so maybe don't use?
I had this one as just "Sad", too, but I'll be leaving this one out as well, so...

Agree they are too short for background music

HighlanderWarDrums.ogg Battle, Creepy/Normal?...
I actually couldn't get this one to play properly for me? If you're able to listen to it, could you try re-encoding it in some other format?

It's a chunky file (~5.5MB) but within attachment size allowed here.
I use Windows 7 (!) and the file size reports as 5.29 MB (5,554,176 bytes).
Just as a sanity check, could you check the file size and/or have you tried re-downloading the music book in case the transfer had a glitch?
The file does play so the .ogg format seems valid.
However if you want it re-encoding I'm happy to do so, just let me know your preferred format (never done this before so bear with me).

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"

For me the bright piano opening doesn't seem that sad, though it does feel a bit sadder later?
Can live with any combination of calm/normal/sad though for me sad is the 3rd choice

Code: Select all
Loyalist_Loss_Cello.ogg		Normal, Sad?		Very short ~10 seconds, maybe one to exclude?
Loyalist_Loss_Piano.ogg		Normal			Very short ~10 seconds, maybe one to exclude?
							(sounds brighter and less mournful on piano)
I couldn't get the Cello version to play for me either here... so you're confirming for me that the Piano version is basically just the same thing, but as a different instrument? (I mean not that it really matters, since I probably won't end up using either, but whatever...)

Yup, essentially the same melody but I agree both are too short for use as background music.

LunarCage.ogg Normal
I love this one! I have it as "normal/elvish" and "adventure-ish"

I really like this tune as well, it has a pleasing melodic arc with a beginning, middle and end.

Definitely agree it's adventure-ish, not so sure it's that elvish to me but as I like the tune so much happy for it to crop up more often

March_of_the_divine.ogg Epic, Battle? Works for either IMHO
Yeah I had it as "epic-ish"... it feels more like the lead-up to a major battle, rather than the battle itself, IMO...

Happy for it to go into either or both of battle/epic

music_score.ogg =battle-epic.ogg? Already in core/music?

Agreed it ain't needed as it's in mainline.

presentation.ogg Battle, Underground?
I had this one as just "Battle"... it sounded like it was going to build up to something, but then never really did...

Fair enough, wasn't sure about underground...

Tarhensis_Theme.ogg Normal, Battle? Calm then lively...
I had this one as "normal/epic"

Parts of it (0:30-0:45) sounded familiar?
For me it doesn't feel epic enough - though I can see where you're coming from.

UNDEAD.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude?
Yeah I had this one as "retro/creepy" and will probably just leave it out

victorytheme.ogg Normal <10 seconds, maybe one to exclude?
Yeah too short; I'm just going to leave it out

Agreed

Wesn.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude? Duration ~4:40
Oh yeah this one I think got corrupted...

Oh, I thought it was techno and meant to sound like a modem on acid+speed

Just listened to your version and it's very different!
Would now recategorise as Normal and/or Battle; happy with either or both.
Haven't got time to properly listen multiple times now but that's my initial impression FWIW.
Definitely keep it though, not a bad tune.

Wesnoth_Horn.ogg Normal, Battle? ...
Yeah I had this one as battle/normal at first and then battle/epic later on

I have quite a high bar for "epic" and tend to only include tracks that (for me anyway) say "this is more than just another battle".
But then if it was me doing this there'd only be about 6 tracks in epic

Will try and get another MB done soon-ish but still having a ******* time here

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 3rd, 2023, 8:55 pm

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 3rd, 2023, 2:53 pm
Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?
In this context, yes
Hadn't really gotten wistful on listening but now you've pointed it out, I could live with sad as well for this one.

Hm... I keep going back and forth on whether I actually want to put this one in "Sad" as well...

HighlanderWarDrums.ogg Battle, Creepy/Normal?...
I actually couldn't get this one to play properly for me? If you're able to listen to it, could you try re-encoding it in some other format?
It's a chunky file (~5.5MB) but within attachment size allowed here.
I use Windows 7 (!) and the file size reports as 5.29 MB (5,554,176 bytes).
Just as a sanity check, could you check the file size and/or have you tried re-downloading the music book in case the transfer had a glitch?

5.30MB in Discord (where I'm trying to play it from); I tried uploading it there twice but it failed to play each time

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"
For me the bright piano opening doesn't seem that sad, though it does feel a bit sadder later?
Can live with any combination of calm/normal/sad though for me sad is the 3rd choice

Well ok would you say that this is more sad or less sad than Breeze.ogg? I want to mark at least one track from this book as "Sad", but with all the ones I'm skipping here, that doesn't leave many...

Tarhensis_Theme.ogg Normal, Battle? Calm then lively...
I had this one as "normal/epic"
Parts of it (0:30-0:45) sounded familiar?
For me it doesn't feel epic enough - though I can see where you're coming from.

OK, so just "Normal" then...

Wesn.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude? Duration ~4:40
Oh yeah this one I think got corrupted...
Oh, I thought it was techno and meant to sound like a modem on acid+speed
Just listened to your version and it's very different!
Would now recategorise as Normal and/or Battle; happy with either or both.

Well, regardless of how my re-encoded version sounds, the point remains that that's not the version that's included in the actual UMC Music Book add-on being shipped to players. We'd have to wait for someone™ (Pent?) to update it before using it.

Wesnoth_Horn.ogg Normal, Battle? ...
Yeah I had this one as battle/normal at first and then battle/epic later on
I have quite a high bar for "epic" and tend to only include tracks that (for me anyway) say "this is more than just another battle".
But then if it was me doing this there'd only be about 6 tracks in epic

Well, to be clear, I only thought that certain parts (in particular near the end) fit under "Epic", so I guess I'll just keep this under "Battle"...

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 4th, 2023, 6:39 pm

Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"
...
Well ok would you say that this is more sad or less sad than Breeze.ogg? I want to mark at least one track from this book as "Sad", but with all the ones I'm skipping here, that doesn't leave many...

Ohhh, tough call... both include pianos so that cancels out.
Intro: for me the sadness comes mainly from the low frequency strings and chord structure though the mood lifts (IMHO) at the end.
Breeze: sadness/wistfulness is, for me, more from main theme.
Listened to them both a few times... if I had to choose I'd go for Breeze Intro ...

... Intro, damnit!
That said, though the tunes induce slightly different feelings in me, both have mournful components and tbh if I'm including Intro in sad then Breeze can probably be included as well...

HighlanderWarDrums.ogg Battle, Creepy/Normal?...
I actually couldn't get this one to play properly for me? If you're able to listen to it, could you try re-encoding it in some other format?

I've attached my copy from MB06, if that doesn't play on your system then I'll re-encode it, but others may hit the same issue?

Wesn.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude? Duration ~4:40

Well, regardless of how my re-encoded version sounds, the point remains that that's not the version that's included in the actual UMC Music Book add-on being shipped to players. We'd have to wait for someone™ (Pent?) to update it before using it.

Ah. Good point.

Let me know how you get on with the attached HighlanderWarDrums.ogg and, if that doesn't work for you, what encoding/file format you prefer.

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 5th, 2023, 2:16 am

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 4th, 2023, 6:39 pm
Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"
...
Well ok would you say that this is more sad or less sad than Breeze.ogg? I want to mark at least one track from this book as "Sad", but with all the ones I'm skipping here, that doesn't leave many...
Ohhh, tough call... both include pianos so that cancels out.
Intro: for me the sadness comes mainly from the low frequency strings and chord structure though the mood lifts (IMHO) at the end.
Breeze: sadness/wistfulness is, for me, more from main theme.
Listened to them both a few times... if I had to choose I'd go for Breeze Intro ... ... Intro, damnit!
That said, though the tunes induce slightly different feelings in me, both have mournful components and tbh if I'm including Intro in sad then Breeze can probably be included as well...

...hm, maybe we need a 3rd person's opinion... until then I guess I just won't have a track from the 6th book for the "Sad" mood... (I mean, I guess I could include them both, but since they're both borderline, I dunno if that's a good idea...)

HighlanderWarDrums.ogg Battle, Creepy/Normal?...
I actually couldn't get this one to play properly for me? If you're able to listen to it, could you try re-encoding it in some other format?
I've attached my copy from MB06, if that doesn't play on your system then I'll re-encode it, but others may hit the same issue?

Actually I guess the issue is just on Discord's end, because it plays fine when I load it in Audacity instead...
Edit: OK, now that I'm actually listening to it myself, I'd say it fits the "Underground" mood best, I guess? I don't really like it much, though; might just skip it...

Wesn.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude? Duration ~4:40

Well, regardless of how my re-encoded version sounds, the point remains that that's not the version that's included in the actual UMC Music Book add-on being shipped to players. We'd have to wait for someone™ (Pent?) to update it before using it.
Ah. Good point.

Pent says the new version is now uploaded: https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=684061#p684061
I still dunno if I want to risk players possibly having an old version installed instead, though... maybe there's a way to check the version of the add-on and then only add the song to the playlist conditionally, depending on if the version is new enough?

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 5th, 2023, 9:59 pm

Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"
...
...hm, maybe we need a 3rd person's opinion... until then I guess I just won't have a track from the 6th book for the "Sad" mood... (I mean, I guess I could include them both, but since they're both borderline, I dunno if that's a good idea...)

Is it necessary to have every music book contributing to every mood?
If so, why? (Just curious)

HighlanderWarDrums.ogg Battle, Creepy/Normal?...
...Edit: OK, now that I'm actually listening to it myself, I'd say it fits the "Underground" mood best, I guess? I don't really like it much, though; might just skip it...

Yeah, I wasn't too keen either TBH.
Doesn't say "Underground" (or anything much in particular, mood-wise) to me though Battle seemed most fitting.

Wesn.ogg Creepy? Very techno, maybe one to exclude? Duration ~4:40
Pent says the new version is now uploaded: https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=684061#p684061
I still dunno if I want to risk players possibly having an old version installed instead, though... maybe there's a way to check the version of the add-on and then only add the song to the playlist conditionally, depending on if the version is new enough?

No idea, will have to do some research (but a bit busy with real life just now

).

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 7th, 2023, 12:05 am

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 5th, 2023, 9:59 pm
Breeze.ogg Calm, Sad? Bit lively in places, sound effects, duration >5 mins
I had this one as calm and "wistful"... I dunno, would you consider "wistful" to be a synonym for "sad"?

intro.ogg Normal, Calm? Close call, works for either IMHO
I had this one as "mostly calm, maybe a bit sad/normal, too"
...
...hm, maybe we need a 3rd person's opinion... until then I guess I just won't have a track from the 6th book for the "Sad" mood... (I mean, I guess I could include them both, but since they're both borderline, I dunno if that's a good idea...)
Is it necessary to have every music book contributing to every mood?

OK I guess not really; never mind...

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 14th, 2023, 11:35 am

Apologies for the delay, really, really busy just now and likely to remain so for quite some time

Anyway, thoughts on MB07 (only had one play-through, no time for re-listens

).

Code: Select all

Track				Mood(s)			Comment

after_full_moon_piano.ogg	Calm, Underground?	Piano solo

ambuscade.ogg			Battle			For me, not quite epic

besieged.ogg			Battle			Replace the glockenspiel (or whatever)
							 with brass and it might've been epic?

bubblegum.ogg			Normal			~45 seconds; too short?  Difficult to categorise;
							 first half sad, second half more upbeat.

dark_passage.ogg		Creepy, Underground	Fits both moods but IMHO creepy slightly better fit?

Drums_of_War.ogg		Battle			Volume seems a bit lower than average?  Ends abruptly

exploration.ogg			Calm, Normal?

Farewell.ogg			Sad?, Calm?		22 seconds; too short?  Maybe CUE Doom?

hail_to_the_cheese.ogg		Battle, Normal?		26 seconds; too short?

Layers_of_Harmony.ogg		Calm, CUE Elves?

loyalists10.ogg			Normal			24 seconds; too short?

milk_and_cookies.ogg		Calm			38 seconds; too short?  Maybe also sad (ish)?

New_Thingy.ogg			Normal?			Has battle, calm, sad and maybe creepy aspects also?

Pantest.ogg			Calm, Normal?

Short_Sequence.ogg		Normal?			59 seconds and difficult to categorise - maybe skip?

sing.ogg			Calm, CUE Elves?

sir_rupert.ogg			Normal			32 seconds; too short?

space_marines.ogg		Battle, Underground?	Techno-ish

tadpole.ogg			Normal?			Calm/sad intro (50 seconds, almost half)
							 then pace and mood picks up, ends in battle mood

tedium.ogg			Sad, Calm		43 seconds; too short?

The_Fazzemer_Theme.ogg		Sad, Calm		Despite brief upbeat segment at 0:45

Tide_of_Battle.ogg		Battle			Not epic IMHO

wesnoth_song1.ogg		Battle			Maybe epic-ish?  (But then I'm biased, I like this tune)

I find myself struggling with 3 categories; Creepy, Epic and Underground.
I'm not really clear what works for underground?
I imagine underground as being dark/very low light, with strange sounds in the distance and not being able to see what's round the corner; i.e. creepy!
I also seem to have a high bar for creepy and epic.

Anyway, must dash!

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 14th, 2023, 11:35 am
Code: Select all
Track				Mood(s)			Comment

after_full_moon_piano.ogg	Calm, Underground?	Piano solo

I had this one as "Sad" (due to the contexts in which it's used in "A New Order")

Code: Select all

ambuscade.ogg			Battle			For me, not quite epic

"not quite epic"?!

Blasphemy! This one's GOTTA be epic! (Well ok maybe that's just due to how other campaigns are already using it...)

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besieged.ogg			Battle			Replace the glockenspiel (or whatever)
							 with brass and it might've been epic?

Yeah I had this one as "battle (maybe epic, too)" at first, but then went back to "...nah, mostly just plain battle" as the song continued... Also, didn't it sound kinda like the old menu theme?

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bubblegum.ogg			Normal			~45 seconds; too short?  Difficult to categorise;
							 first half sad, second half more upbeat.

Yeah I had about the same reaction; also it seems extremely mistitled, IMO... skipping.

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dark_passage.ogg		Creepy, Underground	Fits both moods but IMHO creepy slightly better fit?

Agreed.

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Drums_of_War.ogg		Battle			Volume seems a bit lower than average?  Ends abruptly

Agreed. Could probably fit as Epic, too, if it weren't for the 2 quirks you noted...

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exploration.ogg			Calm, Normal?

Agreed, and maybe a bit Sad, too?

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Farewell.ogg			Sad?, Calm?		22 seconds; too short?  Maybe CUE Doom?

Agreed that it's too short; skipping.

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hail_to_the_cheese.ogg		Battle, Normal?		26 seconds; too short?

Agreed on Battle; if it were a bit longer, it might be able to fit as Epic, too, but as you noted, it's too short, currently...

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Layers_of_Harmony.ogg		Calm, CUE Elves?

Agreed.

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loyalists10.ogg			Normal			24 seconds; too short?

Yeah the abrupt cutoff makes me wonder if it was supposed to be longer... It might be able to fit as "Battle" too, if it didn't abruptly end like that...

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milk_and_cookies.ogg		Calm			38 seconds; too short?  Maybe also sad (ish)?

I had this one as just Calm.

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New_Thingy.ogg			Normal?			Has battle, calm, sad and maybe creepy aspects also?

Hey now wait a moment; did I skip this one? Holding this thought... (Edit: OK yeah I'd originally missed it, but now that I've listened to it, I'd put it as primarily Normal, but it does kinda move into Battle part way through, though...)

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Pantest.ogg			Calm, Normal?

A bit too boring and slow to fit under the "Normal" mood IMO, which just leaves Calm.

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Short_Sequence.ogg		Normal?			59 seconds and difficult to categorise - maybe skip?

I had this one as "calm, foreboding, ends a bit epic" (but yeah a bit too short, so, skipping)

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sing.ogg			Calm, CUE Elves?

Agreed.

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sir_rupert.ogg			Normal			32 seconds; too short?

Agreed (that it's too short); skipping.

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space_marines.ogg		Battle, Underground?	Techno-ish

Skipping this one here for now; I did copy it over to TWoT, though

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tadpole.ogg			Normal?			Calm/sad intro (50 seconds, almost half)
							 then pace and mood picks up, ends in battle mood

Yeah I dunno, this one was kinda hard to categorize for me; it changes too much over the course of the track for me to really be able to pin down...

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tedium.ogg			Sad, Calm		43 seconds; too short?

I had this one as just Sad originally, but I guess Calm could work, too...

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The_Fazzemer_Theme.ogg		Sad, Calm		Despite brief upbeat segment at 0:45

I couldn't really decide on this one, but yeah I guess either of those (or both) would work..

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Tide_of_Battle.ogg		Battle			Not epic IMHO

Agreed, seems kinda JRPG-ish. For people who want to draw the Fire Emblem comparisons more closely, I'd recommend using this track for that purpose.

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wesnoth_song1.ogg		Battle			Maybe epic-ish?  (But then I'm biased, I like this tune)

I was thinking Sad at first, but then Epic as it got going, so, I guess that puts it in Epic, then...

I find myself struggling with 3 categories; Creepy, Epic and Underground.
I'm not really clear what works for underground?
I imagine underground as being dark/very low light, with strange sounds in the distance and not being able to see what's round the corner; i.e. creepy!
I also seem to have a high bar for creepy and epic.

Well ok the "creepy" mood didn't exist at first when I first inherited TEG from Anonymissimus, I only added it after coming across a few tracks that I thought were either too creepy to fit in with the existing "underground" tracks, or could also be used in an aboveground context (i.e. if it's night out and you're in a haunted forest or a graveyard or something)

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 15th, 2023, 8:12 am

Anyways you're in for a treat with UMC Music Book 08 up next! That one's probably my favorite of the series...

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 15th, 2023, 11:08 am

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
after_full_moon_piano.ogg	Calm, Underground?	Piano solo
I had this one as "Sad" (due to the contexts in which it's used in "A New Order")

Had a re-listen, first time the brightness of the piano lifted it a bit for me but yeah, listening more to the tune and less to the sound (as it were) sad would work.
So agreed.

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
ambuscade.ogg			Battle			For me, not quite epic
"not quite epic"?! Blasphemy! This one's GOTTA be epic! (Well ok maybe that's just due to how other campaigns are already using it...)

Well, it was close, if ya want epic, go for it

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
besieged.ogg			Battle			Replace the glockenspiel (or whatever) with brass and it might've been epic?
Yeah I had this one as "battle (maybe epic, too)" at first, but then went back to "...nah, mostly just plain battle" as the song continued... Also, didn't it sound kinda like the old menu theme?

Now you mention it... yup

Hadn't spotted that, it does have a structure and some elements very similar to main_menu.ogg, especially in the opening few seconds.

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
bubblegum.ogg			Normal			~45 seconds; too short?  Difficult to categorise; first half sad, second half more upbeat.
Yeah I had about the same reaction; also it seems extremely mistitled, IMO

I thought the same about the title...

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
exploration.ogg			Calm, Normal?
Agreed, and maybe a bit Sad, too?

Agreed, though for me it's less sad than it is calm.
Happy with calm, normal or sad - though I think:

for me calm is first choice then normal or sad, close call on second place on re-listen
2 moods is enough for any tune given the number of tracks available?

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
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loyalists10.ogg			Normal			24 seconds; too short?
Yeah the abrupt cutoff makes me wonder if it was supposed to be longer... It might be able to fit as "Battle" too, if it didn't abruptly end like that...

The combination of shortness and abruptness rather put me off, if it was me I wouldn't bother.

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
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milk_and_cookies.ogg		Calm			38 seconds; too short?  Maybe also sad (ish)?
I had this one as just Calm.
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Pantest.ogg			Calm, Normal?
A bit too boring and slow to fit under the "Normal" mood IMO, which just leaves Calm.

Fair enough

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
tadpole.ogg			Normal?			Calm/sad intro (50 seconds, almost half) then pace and mood picks up, ends in battle mood
Yeah I dunno, this one was kinda hard to categorize for me; it changes too much over the course of the track for me to really be able to pin down...

Maybe skip this one - I don't think you're short of calm or normal tracks?
As there's so much material to choose from I wouldn't worry about being quite selective: FWIW I don't think I'd bother with anything <90 seconds duration (and be quite picky for things <2 minutes) as backing music.
Shorter tracks would all be put in the "maybe CUE" bucket?
But then YMMV

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
Tide_of_Battle.ogg		Battle			Not epic IMHO
Agreed, seems kinda JRPG-ish. For people who want to draw the Fire Emblem comparisons more closely, I'd recommend using this track for that purpose.

I'm sorry to say that for me it sounded rather incoherent and I struggle to see where I could use it

I prefer music with an identifiable theme and I couldn't find one here - and it ended a tad abruptly too.
I'm sure the composer put a lot of effort into creating this track, but it just didn't do anything for me

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
I find myself struggling with 3 categories; Creepy, Epic and Underground.
I'm not really clear what works for underground?
I imagine underground as being dark/very low light, with strange sounds in the distance and not being able to see what's round the corner; i.e. creepy!
I also seem to have a high bar for creepy and epic.
Well ok the "creepy" mood didn't exist at first when I first inherited TEG from Anonymissimus, I only added it after coming across a few tracks that I thought were either too creepy to fit in with the existing "underground" tracks, or could also be used in an aboveground context (i.e. if it's night out and you're in a haunted forest or a graveyard or something)

OK, makes sense.
I'll bear that in mind.

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:12 am Anyways you're in for a treat with UMC Music Book 08 up next! That one's probably my favorite of the series...

There's a few tracks in there I recognise and all of those I like, so here's hoping the rest are as good!

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 16th, 2023, 3:14 am

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 11:08 am
egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
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exploration.ogg			Calm, Normal?
Agreed, and maybe a bit Sad, too?
Agreed, though for me it's less sad than it is calm.
Happy with calm, normal or sad - though I think:
for me calm is first choice then normal or sad, close call on second place on re-listen

2 moods is enough for any tune given the number of tracks available?

Argh, I'll have to give this one some more thought...

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
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loyalists10.ogg			Normal			24 seconds; too short?
Yeah the abrupt cutoff makes me wonder if it was supposed to be longer... It might be able to fit as "Battle" too, if it didn't abruptly end like that...
The combination of shortness and abruptness rather put me off, if it was me I wouldn't bother.

OK, skipping, then...

egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
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Tide_of_Battle.ogg		Battle			Not epic IMHO
Agreed, seems kinda JRPG-ish. For people who want to draw the Fire Emblem comparisons more closely, I'd recommend using this track for that purpose.
I'm sorry to say that for me it sounded rather incoherent and I struggle to see where I could use it
I prefer music with an identifiable theme and I couldn't find one here - and it ended a tad abruptly too.
I'm sure the composer put a lot of effort into creating this track, but it just didn't do anything for me

Oh so maybe we're not actually agreed then... I agreed that it fit the Battle mood, and that it wasn't epic, but to me "not epic" doesn't necessarily mean "bad" though. IMO the difference between "Battle" and "Epic" is basically the difference between normal battles in an RPG, and a boss fight... This piece sounds like it could fit the purpose of battles with your average enemies in an ordinary JRPG, which is an important role and often one filled by memorable songs. Many songs in the Wesnoth soundtrack feel like they're written for movies, but this one feels like it's written for an actual video game, which I consider a plus. You can kinda tell by how it has to fade out at the end, which is something that songs usually do in soundtracks when they'd loop when played in-game. Unfortunately, Wesnoth doesn't currently support tracks that loop, so the fade-out is somewhat of a necessity of that limitation.

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 16th, 2023, 10:31 am

egallager wrote: ↑October 16th, 2023, 3:14 am
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exploration.ogg			Calm, Normal?
Argh, I'll have to give this one some more thought...

Had a re-listen - first time was a bit rushed and as I'd heard this track before I maybe didn't pay as much attention as I should've

On reflection I can see why you'd put sad second, I think the slightly upbeat section after the first minute probably caught my attention too much.
So, no problem with calm+sad (and drop normal).

egallager wrote: ↑October 16th, 2023, 3:14 am
Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 11:08 am
egallager wrote: ↑October 15th, 2023, 8:04 am
Code: Select all
Tide_of_Battle.ogg		Battle			Not epic IMHO
Agreed, seems kinda JRPG-ish. For people who want to draw the Fire Emblem comparisons more closely, I'd recommend using this track for that purpose.
I'm sorry to say that for me it sounded rather incoherent and I struggle to see where I could use it
I prefer music with an identifiable theme and I couldn't find one here - and it ended a tad abruptly too.
I'm sure the composer put a lot of effort into creating this track, but it just didn't do anything for me
Oh so maybe we're not actually agreed then... I agreed that it fit the Battle mood, and that it wasn't epic, but to me "not epic" doesn't necessarily mean "bad" though. IMO the difference between "Battle" and "Epic" is basically the difference between normal battles in an RPG, and a boss fight... This piece sounds like it could fit the purpose of battles with your average enemies in an ordinary JRPG, which is an important role and often one filled by memorable songs. Many songs in the Wesnoth soundtrack feel like they're written for movies, but this one feels like it's written for an actual video game, which I consider a plus. You can kinda tell by how it has to fade out at the end, which is something that songs usually do in soundtracks when they'd loop when played in-game. Unfortunately, Wesnoth doesn't currently support tracks that loop, so the fade-out is somewhat of a necessity of that limitation.

Sorry, wasn't clear.
I agree that the track's best fit is battle and I can see how the music is intended to raise excitement during action gameplay by being a rousing backing track. I also agree that epic denotes a battle that is in some way special or climactic. I certainly didn't mean to give the impression that "not epic"=bad!

All I was saying was that I didn't really like the tune, it wasn't to my taste.
That said, if I were actually playing a game with this as the backing track (rather than listening to it out of context "in cold blood" as it were) I might not even notice the music that much

I certainly wouldn't omit it just because it so happens I don't particularly like that style of music, I can see it would fit in in battle and have no problem it going there, it just ain't a track that engages me.

If the universe permits, will hopefully crack open MB08 sometime this week.

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

User:Knyghtmare · Post by **Lord-Knightmare** » October 16th, 2023, 11:48 am

Where is the currently updated list? Is there a google sheet/github link of this to see?

Spannerbag · Post by **Spannerbag** » October 16th, 2023, 8:45 pm

Lord-Knightmare wrote: ↑October 16th, 2023, 11:48 am Where is the currently updated list? Is there a google sheet/github link of this to see?

The first link in this post might have what you're after?
AFAIK this lists the current tracks in each mood, up to music book 7 I think.

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag

egallager · Post by **egallager** » October 18th, 2023, 7:51 am

Spannerbag wrote: ↑October 16th, 2023, 8:45 pm
Lord-Knightmare wrote: ↑October 16th, 2023, 11:48 am Where is the currently updated list? Is there a google sheet/github link of this to see?
The first link in this post might have what you're after?

...or, to shorten that chain from two clicks to one: https://github.com/cooljeanius/The_Earths_Gut/blob/master/utils/music.cfg

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Categorizing UMC music by moods

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB06

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Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB06

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB06

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Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB07

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB07

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB07

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods: MB07

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods

Re: Categorizing UMC music by moods