Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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dwarftough
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Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by dwarftough »

Hi everyone! Glad to introduce Hordes of the Other World - a multiplayer campaign, a remake of LotI's scenario "Hordes of the Other World" split into 5 scenarios. Only 1.14 for now, as there is no stable LotI for 1.16.

The original scenario had an enormous 200x200 map, logically it was separated in 4 acts. Alas, the 200x200 map proved too big to be played in terms of performance, even on strong machines. Moreover, as it was rarely played, bugs weren't really reported, so it was very buggy.

To make it playable I decided to turn acts into distinct scenarios. The map for the first act turned out to be too big, so I had to split the first act in two halves. I'm not really happy with how I distorted the geometry of the cave (the second scenario), but I had to in order to reduce the linear size of the map. Also I fixed teleportation to keeps, added leader deaths as a lose condition (in the original scenario you were supposed to be teleported back if you leader fell, but it didn't work properly) and added soundtracks (with some music from UMCs).

What I haven't implemented is the respawns, as I didn't understand how original code worked. I guess that it was supposed to respawn some enemies every turn, but in the current version enemies are spawned only once, so you can really clean the map before proceeding to next scenario. I dunno if it makes it too easy, but probably it shouldn't as leaders' death are now a lose condition, and the campaign is enough long (I'd say it's really huge). I just completed it myself and find it playable. But I wonder what players think

Also I fixed it at 5 players, maybe it makes sense to allow playing with 1-4 players too (as the original scenario). I doubted because of dialogues integrity, but many people don't read dialogues in LotI-like campaigns I guess...

Glad to hear any feedback, thank you!
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bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

I couldn't find this newer Hordes of the Other World in the Add-ons Directory.

I've been playing the older 200x200 version on my iPad Pro 5th generation, and it mostly performed OK, except sometimes it would bog down on the AI turns when there are a lot of units doing things in the dark parts of the screens. This hit especially hard after reaching Act 3 and 4, with all those solid black lethargy units traffic jammed in those passageways of Act 3. During those times, I just go do something else waiting for the AI to complete their turn.

Bug (?) report: Stormrider's potions never wear off. Maybe this is a feature, not a bug. My Stormrider has over 9000 HP, after giving up on having follower units, and just running around in Act 2 by himself consuming hordes from the other world. He's been drinking a lot of potions and has a nice combo of magic items that make him invulnerable to everything except lethargy. Book of Vindictiveness helped with that, having the triggerable ability...but lethargy in this game seems more intense than in the normal LotL. I've seen lethargy numbers in the 80-100 range after being hit only once. But then, the character is mostly recovered from lethargy on the next turn. Not sure if this lethargy behavior is a bug or intentional, but I kept playing anyway. At turn 260 on my iPad.
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

Also: leadership doesn't seem to work across allies. For example, Argan with leadership level 5 standing next to one of Ephraim's orcish archers doesn't factor into damage calculations for that allied unit.
dwarftough
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by dwarftough »

bolderaft wrote: February 26th, 2024, 2:17 am I couldn't find this newer Hordes of the Other World in the Add-ons Directory.
Which version of Wesnoth do you play?
bolderaft wrote: February 27th, 2024, 3:40 am Also: leadership doesn't seem to work across allies
Yeah, but that's standard Wesnoth behaviour, standard leadership affects only the leader's own side, not allies
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by Lord-Knightmare »

Yeah, but that's standard Wesnoth behaviour, standard leadership affects only the leader's own side, not allies
Maybe you can implement some feature where you check for leadership and substitute for allied leadership? Would actually make leadership very optimal to use.
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dwarftough
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by dwarftough »

Lord-Knightmare wrote: February 27th, 2024, 9:20 am Maybe you can implement some feature where you check for leadership and substitute for allied leadership? Would actually make leadership very optimal to use.
It makes no sense because each of other heroes (except Stormrider maybe) can unlock leadership advancements
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bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

> Which version of Wesnoth do you play?

On iPad where I played up to turn 262, it looks like version 1.14.13. I guess it's been a long time since anyone volunteered to make a build available in the Apple App Store. I'll probably eventually finish that one, because there's not much left on the map. But it takes 10-15 to get through the AI turn.

I also recently started a Hordes of the Other World on Mac laptop running Wesnoth 1.16.10. It is much slower than on the iPad, maybe because it's pre-M1, a Macbook Pro 2019 model running 1.4 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i5. But, it's still playable in the Act I part of the game, and really fun. I'm a bit sad that it will eventually bog down and I won't be able to finish the game.
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

> Yeah, but that's standard Wesnoth behaviour, standard leadership affects only the leader's own side, not allies

Oh! I've never noticed that. I guess most of my experience is with single player campaigns.

I'm glad healing affects allies! I've found that to be essential, and it's especially helpful to park an injured unit next to two different allied healers to "double dip" on the healing benefits.
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

Here’s another oddity I noticed: When Stormrider earned enough XP for multiple level-ups in a single turn of being attacked by AI hordes, I would see the prompt to choose the advancement once Stormrider’s turn arrived. That would be followed by repeated prompts to choose additional advancements, but once they were all resolved, it was as if only one of the advancements actually applied. I didn’t do the math to check if Stormrider lost any XP, and it didn’t matter much in game turns. He was already indestructible and mostly destroyed everything that attacked him, except those units which deal enough lethargy to slow him down.

This game’s Stormrider is easily the most invincible unit of all the “invincibles” I’ve ever played, and I’ve played most of the LotI single player campaigns all the way through at least twice each.
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

I'm continuing to have fun with Hordes of the Other World, mostly after having started over on Wesnoth 1.16.11 , hoping to see the new version you mentioned with the smaller maps broken into separate scenarios. But, it's still the 200x200 map, so whatever is in the community add-ons that I downloaded doesn't seem to be the version you mentioned at the top of this thread, dwarftough.

Maybe I should try cloning the GitHub repo into my local add-ons directory? Mostly I like playing solo, though I play all five teams.
dwarftough
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by dwarftough »

I will probably release it on 1.16 today or tomorrow. Stupid, I wanted to improve it and release early, and in the end I haven't released it yet
Co-founder and current maintainer of IsarFoundation, Afterlife Rated and overall Wesnoth Autohost Project
Developer and maintainer of my fork of World Conquest, Invincibles Conquest II
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

It doesn't sound stupid to me; I'm just glad you made this and am looking forward to trying out the release. It's a fun scenario with a lot of replayability, and is great to revisit these LotI main characters.

Will this be the version that has higher levels available for the Saurians? It seems like I saw that in the blurb when I downloaded the add-on, but the saurians don't seem to level past the standard max level (ie soothsayer level 2).
dwarftough
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by dwarftough »

I don't know if it's bug-free but Hordes of the Other World 1.1.0 are released on 1.16
hotow.png
bolderaft wrote: March 8th, 2024, 1:21 am Will this be the version that has higher levels available for the Saurians? It seems like I saw that in the blurb when I downloaded the add-on, but the saurians don't seem to level past the standard max level (ie soothsayer level 2).
Here saurians don't have extra levels because you can never get their units to play, you only face them as enemies. There are, however, high level saurians, drakes and some other units in two other my addons, Invincibles Conquest and The Greatest Quest
Co-founder and current maintainer of IsarFoundation, Afterlife Rated and overall Wesnoth Autohost Project
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bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

Thank you dwarftough! Looking forward to playing it this weekend! I will post back here if I spot any issues.
bolderaft
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Re: Hordes of the Other World: a multiplayer LotI

Post by bolderaft »

I installed the new HotOW 1.1.0 for Wesnoth 1.16 on Mac, but could not get it to create a new game.

“Failed to create scenario” was the error that presented, after I selected Hordes of the Other World in multiplayer local game, and chose “Create Game”.

Also, it was still describing a 200x200 map in the documentation for the add-on.
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