Chyrospitals campaign - Feedback and Discussion

[jaeslin]

Hi everyone,
I just finished my campaign Chyrospitals. It has 10 scenarios + 1 dialogue for the moment which is enough to make a complete campaign even if if I have time and enough patience I will add a second part with a dozen scenarios mixing big battles and solo battles with much dialogue to end with an epic conclusion. But that will not be the issue immediately.
First sorry for the artwork. I really wanted to create lots of new units without having the artistic level to draw nice and creative images. If someone with more artistic sense than me wants to redraw or improve some units I would be extreeemely grateful to him. But don't worry I plan to give a new image to Singing Fury, Hogre, Hogre Champion and Keymedian and improve/change Lightning Focuser and Crimson Doctor units.
I write English fairly well but my spelling is quite bad so if you see grammar/spelling mistakes or wrong sentences tell me. I would like this campaign to have a good prose.
I haven't tested the campaign much yet so they are probably some issues with balance. If one scenario is too hard or too easy tell me and I will try fixing it. Note that this campaign is not designed for novice players. You should know the basic tactics before playing this campaign. Also the last scenario is meant to be very hard so don't be afraid to lose huge amounts of veterans.
And last but not least if they are any bugs report them. I am not a very good coder but I will do my best.

Anyway thanks for playing or testing the campaign.

PS : If you are not very comfortable with English you can make a post in French, Dutch (My mother tongues) and German (Which I speak and write relatively well)

Edit: If you are having trouble with Scenario 2 (Raiders) I reckon it is quite hard but it should be quite a big battle to able you to get some xp. Form a good line or you will get swarmed by the level 0's. I added some forest + village on the map which should make it easier not to have units picked by multiple enemies at a time. Also added some turns to Scenario 3 which had too little turns. If they are still issues with those scenarios please tell me.

Edit: Just uploaded the 1.0.5 to the server. Please download it or you will have severe issues with the last scenario making it impossible to finish the campaign. Spelling and grammar mostly corrected. I also added various end_of_turns events till Scenario 6. I'll do the rest of it in the next update.

Edit: Uploaded the 1.0.6. Improved dialogue and more info about the Chyrospital throughout the campaign. The hybrid race now has a description.

Edit: Check out for the 1.07 version. Reamore is now going on from one scenario to another without being randomly recreated each time. Bernen and Aegir are now predefined so I removed blademen highguard and the whole second guardsmen evolve tree. Gwendyl has some amla.

[Konrad2]

Add-on description
themselves faced with a new threath : a -> threath: a
dwarf who fins himself -> finds

[jaeslin]

Thanks Konrad2 also note that their was a fatal error because I forgot to remove an obsolete file in scenario 7. It should be fixed.

[gwen42]

I just barely started this campaign, but in the second scenario (Raiders), I noticed a spelling error in the dialogue: "ennemy" should be "enemy."
So far, it's pretty interesting. Looking forward to the rest of it.

[jaeslin]

Okay I will fix that. You will probably notice more of those spelling mistakes. It is probably due to the fact I am French and I spell some words in a french style. But no excuses it should be corrected.Thanks for the compliment. The story should become more complex as the campaign goes on.

[Konrad2]

Campaign description
ennemy -> enemy

S1
Kidnap -> Kidnapping
empire : Elendyl -> empire: Elendyl
oblirated -> obliterated
Kapoue -> Kapou'e
but the Icewind unables them to invade lands -> Icewind makes it impossible for them
by a counsel of lords -> council
defend ! -> defend!
whe -> we


S2
hab -> had
us ! -> us!
bastards ! -> bastards!


S3
somoene -> someone
it ? -> it?


S4
I'd prefer a less suicidal allied leader.

disgusting creature -> creature.
Whe did it ! -> We did it!
Whe -> We
them ? -> them?
that ? -> that?
whe -> we
whe -> we
materail -> material


S5
Baran lacks a silver crown and he demands upkeep.

Automn -> Autumn
automn -> autumn
rocks ? -> rocks?
let me investigate -> Let
Gwendyl ? -> Gwendyl?
dragon ? -> dragon?
Wwhat ? -> Wwhat?
ages.I -> ages. I
wierder -> weirder
Mordak ? -> Mordak?
Barnvith ? . -> Barnvith?
we ? -> we?
please ! -> please!
tree ? -> tree?
me ? -> me?


S6
Mage : -> Mage:
world ? -> world?
dead ? -> dead?
want ? -> want?
ennemies -> enemies
it ! -> it!
Gwendyl . -> Gwendyl.
ennemies -> enemies
Gwendyl ? -> Gwendyl?
horrors ? -> horrors?
girl ! -> girl!


S7
Mage : -> Mage:
only now Weldyn -> know
become ? -> become?
this ? -> this?
mine ? -> mine?
Assasins -> Assassins
army ? -> army?
whe -> we
defeated ? -> defeated?
this ? -> this?
Die ! -> Die!
Victory ! -> Victory!


S8
Oscar Reamore lost all his xp and gained traits.

not ! -> not!
yourselves ! -> yourselves!
ennemies -> enemies
from ! -> from!
unavenged ! -> unavenged!
Underdark ! -> Underdark!
troll ! -> troll!
banishment ! -> banishment!
winter ! -> winter!


S9
mountains ? -> mountains?
we should stay away -> away.
Gryphon ? -> Gryphon?
Look ! -> Look!
stretch ? -> stretch?
Whe -> We
it ! -> it!
hands ! -> hands!

To be honest, the description of 'cry of the siren' is rather useless. It doesn't explain anything. ._. Same for furious song. This kind of 'description' belongs into the unit description, not into the ability description. At least not without some actually helpful additional description.

mountains ? -> mountains?
th[else]is -> this


S10
Mage : -> Mage:
whe -> we
whe -> we
gryphons ? -> gryphons?
now ! -> now!

Reamore lost the 'Oscar' in his name and he lost his traits and xp.

roll -> role
Sen ? -> Sen?
comes ! -> comes!
army ! -> army!
General Reamore ? -> General Reamore?
me ! -> me!
Greyfeather ! -> Greyfeather!
it ! -> it!
us ! -> us!
Greyfeather ! -> Greyfeather!
wesnoth -> Wesnoth
Alliance ? -> Alliance?
Frost ? -> Frost?
plan : -> plan:
whe -> we
whe -> we
Thingatel ! -> Thingatel!
whe -> we
whe -> we
land ? -> land?
repell -> repel
habitat.If -> habitat. If
whe -> we
Wesnoth ! -> Wesnoth!
avenged ! -> avenged!
days ! -> days!


S11
easely -> easily
whispers : -> whispers:
whispers : -> whispers:
Wesnoth ! -> Wesnoth!
farmers ! -> farmers!

Code: Select all

<WML> Warning: ignoring duplicate side filter information (inline side=)

(I think the surrounding typo corrections do a good job at pinning down the errors cause.)

men ! -> men!
repell -> repel
easely -> easily
whispers : -> whispers

The whole 'attack the fortress' thing happens whenever Gwendyl moves onto a hex inside the fortress which is within a range of 6 hexes of the side entrance. So my allied army appears multiple times. (I guess you made the mistake not to make sure the event triggers only once?)

Btw, somehow Reamore has reclaimed his firstname 'Oscar', along with some xp.

simple : -> simple:
want ? -> want?
treason ? -> treason?
coward ! -> coward!

Calls it the 'best plan' even though the plan was bad and intentional set up to fail.

Never ! -> Never!
Aegir,Baran,Greyfeather -> Aegir, Baran, Greyfeather

The Scenario Objectives do not update after you move Gwendyl to the 'go here' icon. It still states that I will love if Gwendyl or Reamore dies.
And the win conditions didn't change either.
I still have no idea how I'm supposed to win this. Once I defeat the Keymedian, Baran dies as well and I lose.

The brown leader in this scenario never recruits anything.

Looking at the code I'm starting to think that something went wrong because clearly some events that should have fired, didn't happen at all.

[jaeslin]

Campaign description

Thanks for the complete feedback. I'm sorry you had so many issues. I was working on an update but I had more pressing matters to solve for the past few days so I didn't have time to finish and upload it on the server. I'm quite impressed how quickly you finished. Is it your duty to test and comment new add-ons or did you do this because the campaign sounded interesting ? I guess a bit of both but mostly the first reason.


Post 2:

S4
I'd prefer a less suicidal allied leader.

Spoiler:

I reckon Reamore sends all his troops to battle and they get smashed by the far bigger Chyrospital Army. I made sure now all veterans (level 2/3 archers) have the guard AI in my next update. But his senseless charge is more usual than it seems because it slows the enemy for 1/2 turns enabling you to reach Thingatel and repel the huge army easily because the assault can only come via the bridges. I reckon they would be more effective by just staying inside the walls but then the player would have to fight to get some hexes on the bridges to get the xp. It would probably make the scenario easy but terribly slow and boring. If I get more confident with complicated AI I will improve that but for the moment I think keeping the veterans will be enough.

I was accidentally a bit ambiguous there. A less suicidal AI is of course nice, but I was more specifically hoping for a less suicidal allied leader. Reamore is a fan of going outside of the nice and defensible city walls, which easily gets him killed unless you plan around that and you do your best to manipulate both him and the enemy to deny him a way to leave.

I see. Indeed when I played the scenario Reamore loved to make some risky attack (I suppose the AI gives priority to high level units to attack) but he didn't get killed (maybe I was lucky). Funny is that he is supposed to be a pragmatic but not courageous person. I'll code him so he doesn't leave the well defended walls.


Post 3:

S5
Baran lacks a silver crown and he demands upkeep.

I'll fix that


Post 4:

S8
Oscar Reamore lost all his xp and gained traits.

This is just me being a sloppy coder
I just created a new unit I suppose. I plan to start understanding how [store_unit] works so I can improve this but for the moment it's just me thinking "Too complicated I'll stick to just recreating the same unit". I suppose experienced WML users will argue it is very easy code but when I started coding I was just a newby with no experience so I always tried to make things as easy (and incomplete or incoherent) as possible.


Post 5:

S11
easely -> easily
whispers : -> whispers:
whispers : -> whispers:
Wesnoth ! -> Wesnoth!
farmers ! -> farmers!

Code: Select all

<WML> Warning: ignoring duplicate side filter information (inline side=)

(I think the surrounding typo corrections do a good job at pinning down the errors cause.)

men ! -> men!
repell -> repel
easely -> easily
whispers : -> whispers

The whole 'attack the fortress' thing happens whenever Gwendyl moves onto a hex inside the fortress which is within a range of 6 hexes of the side entrance. So my allied army appears multiple times. (I guess you made the mistake not to make sure the event triggers only once?)

Btw, somehow Reamore has reclaimed his firstname 'Oscar', along with some xp.

simple : -> simple:
want ? -> want?
treason ? -> treason?
coward ! -> coward!

Calls it the 'best plan' even though the plan was bad and intentional set up to fail.

Never ! -> Never!
Aegir,Baran,Greyfeather -> Aegir, Baran, Greyfeather

The Scenario Objectives do not update after you move Gwendyl to the 'go here' icon. It still states that I will love if Gwendyl or Reamore dies.
And the win conditions didn't change either.
I still have no idea how I'm supposed to win this. Once I defeat the Keymedian, Baran dies as well and I lose.

The brown leader in this scenario never recruits anything.

Looking at the code I'm starting to think that something went wrong because clearly some events that should have fired, didn't happen at all.

I was sure this huge scenario would have many problems. The main problem you encountered is that I used a bad [filter] tag which didn't work and didn't trigger dialogue and the new objective which is.

Spoiler:

Escape to the bottom west corner of the map with Aegir. This should trigger a final (but not polished) animation and dialogue scenario. This whole event was meant to happen when you attack an enemy unit (whichever) after Reamore betrayed

Indeed, many fire events didn't trigger because the variable after_treachery still equaled no. What should have happened

Spoiler:

If Reamore is killed he escapes. When you approach the Keymedian's keep the brown leader starts recruiting a bunch of level 1s and Greyfeather restates it would be better to flee. When you approach the signpost on the bottom west corner of the map the Keymedian uses his magic to create an abyss around the signpost but Greyfeather builds a bridge of ice so you can still cross.

I hadn't realized the attack the fortress happens multiple times. I guess I hadn't tested this but like you said it can easily be corrected. Just a question:

Spoiler:

Did you succeed in killing the Keymedian whitout debug because normally some centaurs just have appeared near your keep each turn which should make it incredibly hard to defeat the Keymedian. If nonetheless you have succeeded or the scenario is too easy or you are an expert player (which I suppose)

I will shortly upload the whole thing on the add-ons forum and if anyone still has major problems with this scenario check out if you have the latest update available. If this is the case and you still have issues than tell me. Thanks again Konrad 2 for playing and reviewing the whole thing.

[Konrad2]

Thanks for the complete feedback. I'm sorry you had so many issues. I was working on an update but I had more pressing matters to solve for the past few days so I didn't have time to finish and upload it on the server. I'm quite impressed how quickly you finished. Is it your duty to test and comment new add-ons or did you do this because the campaign sounded interesting ? I guess a bit of both but mostly the first reason.

I enjoy playing wesnoth and I like giving feedback. And the 'best' time to give feedback is shortly after an add-on was uploaded, because the author is less likely to have moved on since uploading it. So I give new campaigns priority when I play wesnoth.

Spoiler:

I reckon Reamore sends all his troops to battle and they get smashed by the far bigger Chyrospital Army. I made sure now all veterans (level 2/3 archers) have the guard AI in my next update. But his senseless charge is more usual than it seems because it slows the enemy for 1/2 turns enabling you to reach Thingatel and repel the huge army easily because the assault can only come via the bridges. I reckon they would be more effective by just staying inside the walls but then the player would have to fight to get some hexes on the bridges to get the xp. It would probably make the scenario easy but terribly slow and boring. If I get more confident with complicated AI I will improve that but for the moment I think keeping the veterans will be enough.

I was accidentally a bit ambiguous there. A less suicidal AI is of course nice, but I was more specifically hoping for a less suicidal allied leader. Reamore is a fan of going outside of the nice and defensible city walls, which easily gets him killed unless you plan around that and you do your best to manipulate both him and the enemy to deny him a way to leave.

Spoiler:

Did you succeed in killing the Keymedian whitout debug because normally some centaurs just have appeared near your keep each turn which should make it incredibly hard to defeat the Keymedian. If nonetheless you have succeeded or the scenario is too easy or you are an expert player (which I suppose)

At first I succeeded by using debug, because I was a bit confused about the unchanging scenario objectives.
The second time I exploited that I'm the one that decides when to trigger the enemy counterattack, so I just defeated the weak initial army together with my ally and attacked him. Because unlike storing, 'hide' literally hides the unit. The unit is still there and can be attacked.
I also tried to defeat his army after I trigger the attack instead of defeating himself, but that one ended pretty much with a mutual defeat.
I didn't go through with a third attempt, this time to defeat him fair and without exploiting things, but for one I probably wouldn't be able to do that (pretty much everything is flat, there are no good defensive positions and he recruits lvl 3 units), and after looking at the code it's clear that I don't have to do it anyway.

For the record, please try to avoid posting multiple times in a small timeframe.

EDIT:
S10
whe -> we
whe -> we
roll -> role
comes ! -> comes!
excictement -> excitement
forteress -> fortress
repell -> repel
habitat.If -> habitat. If
whe -> we


S11

Code: Select all

<WML> Warning: ignoring duplicate side filter information (inline side=)

repell -> repel
Whaaat ? -> Whaaat?
How ? -> How?
us ? -> us?
dare ? -> dare?
simple : -> simple:
want ? -> want?
tricks ? -> tricks?
treason ? -> treason?
Aegir,Baran,Greyfeather -> Aegir, Baran, Greyfeather
Council ? -> Council?
Wenoth ! -> Wesnoth!
Linduner ? -> Linduner?
general ? -> general?
from his crossbow -> crossbow.
Aaaah ! -> Aaaah!
dumm -> dumb

Noone says a word about the spawning centaurs, even though there is an event that should have made my leaders talk about it.

Reamore : -> Reamore:

S11a
end ? -> end?
Escaping ? -> Escaping?
last ! -> last!
Why ? -> Why?
farmers ? -> farmers?
be ? -> be?

You forgot to name this scenario.

Whitout -> Without
doors ? -> doors?


EDIT 2:
Your campaign awards a silver laurel on every difficulty, due to this.

EDIT 3:
I've added replay topics for your campaign.

Also, just asking, is the 'The Keymedian's Lair' designed to be a

Spoiler:

deathtrap? I didn't manage to save any units beyond my leaders.

[Yellowsilver]

I played your campaign!
This is exactly the type of campaigns I like, and the type I'm actually coding, with strong heroes having specials abilities and custom units. So I love yours. Actually one of the only one I (nearly) finished in BfW 1.14 (why nearly? read further on...). Can't wait to play second part...
There are nevertheless a few improvements I would suggest:
For the heroes, you can use the [base_unit] tag, instead of creating new units for each of them.
It would be cool if Gwendyl and Aegir had amlas too.
Greyfeather lacks an animation for blizzard, otherwise he's pretty cool. I like him. Perhaps not very resilient though....
The last scenario,

Spoiler:

I was not able to finish it, one of my heroes died 2 turns before I was able to flee. Please disallow the recruit of Singing Furies for the enemy, they have 9 movement points (!!!!) + berserk, it is impossible to escape or to survive a few of them, and Baran has absolutely no chance to survive. I would probably have managed without them. It's the most difficult scenario, it is impossible not to lose all your units...

I think the chyros race has not been well defined, as it is not found. I think (without much experience of WML) that you have to put the _main_units.cfg defining it into the units directory, and without the [unit] tag. Just like this:

Spoiler:

Code: Select all

[race]
    id=chyros
    male_name= _ "race^Hybrid"
    female_name= _ "race+female^Hybrid"
    plural_name= _ "race+plural^Hybrid"
    description= _"Those strange creatures are not natural races of the Old Continent. They are made in horrific factories called Chyrospitals. Using various sort of flesh they are made of minor and major creatures alike. Mostly they are a combination of human, elf, saurian or drake which they combine with animal flesh to lower the cost. The mental possibilities of the chyros are very limited and they live only for a precise role either for hunting more creatures, for war or tho help building even more hybrids. The excact method the Chyrospital uses to build them is unknown. Maybe for the best."
    num_traits=0
[/race]

I saw many typos, but sorry if I didn't have the courage of noting them down. I'll take some time sometime to hunt them down The principal one that I saw at many places was : threath → threat
Actually just noticed two in the chyros race description: excact→exact ; tho→to
And I also agree with what Konrad2 said.

Ah oui, je suis français moi aussi , mais je préfère parler anglais pour que tout le monde comprenne et parce que c'est plus simple, la campagne étant en anglais. Et les fautes que tu fais en anglais sont pour certaines typiquement françaises, je fais les mêmes

Yellowsilver


EDIT1:
A few typos in the three first scenarios:

S1
Wesnoth Kingdom → Kingdom of Wesnoth (?)
Elsenfar → Elensefar
threath → threat
The Icewind as it was later called → The Icewind, as it was later called, ; (actually thinking there are really many times where there are some comas missing, and where the sentences don't feel natural because of this)
The elves manage → The elves managed
The orcs have retreated north and have settled → The orcs retreated north and settled
remains of the former glory → remains of its former glory
Othins → Othin's
What is happening ? → What is happening?
What are those things ? → What are these things?
tell about ? " → tell about?"
advise → advice

S2
other the command → under the command
who enters Carmin ? → who enters Carmin?
by sort of → by some sort of
cut your throath → cut your throat
their patrol ? → their patrol?
more of them ? → more of them?
undead ? → undead?

S3
menace → threaten ; (would perhaps be better)
does it ? → does it?
to foot → on foot
carminals to collect → carminals collect (?)
at first → first
We did it ! → We did it!
of them ? → of them?
whe → we

EDIT2:
More typos in the fifth scenario

S5
the woodsman → the woodsmen
As if it is not → as if it weren't
abandonned → abandoned
Their seems → There seems
in those woods → in these woods
easely → easily
I think you should add more time to discover Barnvith in this scenario. Perhaps one or two more turns. It's hard to manage it otherwise.

Question as well:

Spoiler:

If ever Bernen (I suppose the update with him being loyal will come) dies, what happens in the last scenario? His death is not marked in the objectives as a defeat, he hasn't got a death event, but he's important in the last scenario. I think as well that he should be recalled with the other heroes in all scenario, for some of them it's not the case.

[jaeslin]

Also, just asking, is the 'The Keymedian's Lair' designed to be a

Spoiler:

deathtrap? I didn't manage to save any units beyond my leaders

Spoiler:

Yes it is actually. Don't be afraid

I've added replay topics for your campaign.

Thanks for that. I still have much to learn to be a good moderator/forum manager

I played your campaign!
This is exactly the type of campaigns I like, and the type I'm actually coding, with strong heroes having specials abilities and custom units. So I love yours. Actually one of the only one I (nearly) finished in BfW 1.14 (why nearly? read further on...). Can't wait to play second part...

Thanks a lot for this nice feedback. Always nice to hear on an evening
Indeed I thought making a campaign concentrating on a few characters and a whole new enemy. However, they are already add-ons figuring this with more units, amla, art... The only way I can do as well or better is by placing my units in an interesting story. I have many things going on in my life (even if I'm not an adult yet) so it will take some time before second part will be available mostly because I want it to be quite impressive and not too repetitive. But this kind of comment makes me want to start soon enough. I think I'll upload it bit by bit on the server but first I need to improve the first part in many ways.
Tell me when you have released your add-on so I check it out.

There are nevertheless a few improvements I would suggest:
For the heroes, you can use the [base_unit] tag, instead of creating new units for each of them.
It would be cool if Gwendyl and Aegir had amlas too.

Yes, they're is still some work with units to do. I made the code as easy as possible for me when I started but it is a bit sloppy. Speaking of amla my brother had coded an assassination amla for Gwendyl but it was buggy and didn't work properly so we removed it. Maybe adding some "soft" amla like 50% on flat, a little resistance or so but I don't want her to get too strong (her backstab is deadly enough I think). Aegir can level up to level 4 so he doesn't really need amla for the moment but in Part 2 it would be nice to improve him a bit. I had issues with artifacts but my brother will rework on them so they could be another another option apart from amla to improve characters. But don't worry I plan on making Aegir, Baran and Greyfeather quite overpowered in the end.

Greyfeather lacks an animation for blizzard, otherwise he's pretty cool. I like him. Perhaps not very resilient though....
The last scenario,

Spoiler:

I was not able to finish it, one of my heroes died 2 turns before I was able to flee. Please disallow the recruit of Singing Furies for the enemy, they have 9 movement points (!!!!) + berserk, it is impossible to escape or to survive a few of them, and Baran has absolutely no chance to survive. I would probably have managed without them. It's the most difficult scenario, it is impossible not to lose all your units...

I'll rework on him when I have time. It is also one of my favorite (for gameplay as well as character).
Speaking of the last scenario

Spoiler:

Yes. I soon realized this problem (Singing Fury's are the personal guard of a Keymedian so they are tremendously powerful). I've changed quite some things. Keymedian no longer recruits them (nice for Baran) and has a limited number of veterans to increase the number of units on the map. Centaurs have also slightly been reduced in numbers. But remember this : the whole point of the mission is to destroy your whole army so you get a fresh start (apart from your heroes not including Bernen (sorry)) in the second part. But don't worry you will have a replacement for Bernen and a very interesting new unit in your army. Just download the latest version (should be 1.05) to fix all of this.

I think the chyros race has not been well defined, as it is not found. I think (without much experience of WML) that you have to put the _main_units.cfg defining it into the units directory, and without the [unit] tag. Just like this:

Spoiler:

Code: Select all

[race]
    id=chyros
    male_name= _ "race^Hybrid"
    female_name= _ "race+female^Hybrid"
    plural_name= _ "race+plural^Hybrid"
    description= _"Those strange creatures are not natural races of the Old Continent. They are made in horrific factories called Chyrospitals. Using various sort of flesh they are made of minor and major creatures alike. Mostly they are a combination of human, elf, saurian or drake which they combine with animal flesh to lower the cost. The mental possibilities of the chyros are very limited and they live only for a precise role either for hunting more creatures, for war or tho help building even more hybrids. The exact method the Chyrospital uses to build them is unknown. Maybe for the best."
    num_traits=0
[/race]

I saw many typos, but sorry if I didn't have the courage of noting them down. I'll take some time sometime to hunt them down The principal one that I saw at many places was : threath → threat
Actually just noticed two in the chyros race description: excact→exact ; tho→to
And I also agree with what Konrad2 said.

This is an important topic. I will fix that soon enough. Thanks for trying to find my mistakes (my WML level is pretty casual but I'm improving (at least I hope so )). Thanks for searching the spelling and typo mistakes but I recommend that you download the latest version (1.05 for now) or you will probably find things already corrected. I wouldn't want you to waste your time.

Ah oui, je suis français moi aussi , mais je préfère parler anglais pour que tout le monde comprenne et parce que c'est plus simple, la campagne étant en anglais. Et les fautes que tu fais en anglais sont pour certaines typiquement françaises, je fais les mêmes

Yellowsilver

Eh oui, il y en a plus que je pensais sur Wesnoth. Je compte traduire la campagne en français quand j'aurais le temps mais bon revenons comme tu dis à l'anglais que tout le monde comprend.

I think you should add more time to discover Barnvith in this scenario. Perhaps one or two more turns. It's hard to manage it otherwise.

Think I fixed that as well as many things till scenario 5 for the moment which make the campaign a bit easier (because it was quite hard without much load-game tactics for the moment).

Question as well:

Spoiler:

If ever Bernen (I suppose the update with him being loyal will come) dies, what happens in the last scenario? His death is not marked in the objectives as a defeat, he hasn't got a death event, but he's important in the last scenario. I think as well that he should be recalled with the other heroes in all scenario, for some of them it's not the case.

Yes that update will come. Besides :

Spoiler:

I will add him a die event but he is no hero (and dies in the end even if he survived the whole campaign like I said above). But for the moment he reappears even after being dead which of course would not happen with a recall. I'm not sure of recalling him in each scenario because he isn't a hero so a player who has lost him would find some scenarios (5,8,9) extremely hard if they were balanced for people who have got this buffed royal guard with them. My theory of special units is that a good player should keep them to exploit their powers but they should not be necessary or that would diminish the freedom of the player. I reckon having him makes it a lot easier but you played the campaign on a harder difficulty than the end result.

Anyway thanks again for all this feedback. It's nice to have a new devoted tester and feedback giver. When I uploaded the campaign I hoped to receive nice feedback but now I realize the wesnoth community is more of giving very clear and helpful feedback that takes time and effort, not just flattery, this is, sadly, rare in our modern world.

[Yellowsilver]

Thanks a lot for this nice feedback. Always nice to hear on an evening
Indeed I thought making a campaign concentrating on a few characters and a whole new enemy. However, they are already add-ons figuring this with more units, amla, art... The only way I can do as well or better is by placing my units in an interesting story. I have many things going on in my life (even if I'm not an adult yet) so it will take some time before second part will be available mostly because I want it to be quite impressive and not too repetitive. But this kind of comment makes me want to start soon enough. I think I'll upload it bit by bit on the server but first I need to improve the first part in many ways.

You're welcome, I like being helpful! And I'm not an adult either, but this doesn't mean I haven't other things to do.

Tell me when you have released your add-on so I check it out.

In a looong time, I haven't finished the first scenario yet and I'm a perfectionist...

Speaking of amla my brother had coded an assassination amla for Gwendyl but it was buggy and didn't work properly so we removed it. Maybe adding some "soft" amla like 50% on flat, a little resistance or so but I don't want her to get too strong (her backstab is deadly enough I think).

I actually don't get why she hasn't the elusive movement type... Smallfoot doesn't fit at all with the unit.
And for her assassination amla:

Spoiler:

Why don't you simply kill second.unit? I'm not an expert in WML, probably as you getting to understand it and trying to improve, but it doesn't seem logical to me that you check if there is a unit on x,y=$x2,$y2, and if it is on the unit's side. I'd suggest:

Code: Select all

#define WEAPON_SPECIAL_ASSASINATION
    # Canned definition of the assasination ability to be included in a
    # [specials] clause.
    [damage]
        id=assasination
        name= _ "assasination"
        description= _ "When used offensively, this attack kills the enemy unit if it is of level 0 or 1 and  if there is an enemy of the target on the opposite side of the target, and that unit is not incapacitated (turned to stone or otherwise paralysed)."
        apply_to=self
        backstab=yes
    [/damage]
#	[/specials] # This is not correct
#			defence_weight=0 #this has to go into the [attack] tag
#	[/attack] # This is not correct
		[event]
			name=attacker_hits
			first_time_only=no
			backstab=yes
			[filter_attack]
				special=assasination
			[/filter_attack]
            [if]
                [variable]
                	name=second_unit.level
                	numerical_equals=0
                [/variable]
                [or]
                	[variable]
                		name=second_unit.level
                		numerical_equals=1
                	[/variable]                
                [/or]
            	[then]
                	[unstore_unit]
                    		variable=second_unit
                    		find_vacant=no
                    		text="assasination"
                    		{COLOR_HARM}
                	[/unstore_unit]
                [if]
                	[variable]
                        	name=second_unit.level
                        	numerical_equals=0
                	[/variable]
                [then]
                	[set_variable]
                        	name=unit.experience
                        	add=4
                	[/set_variable]
                [/then]
                [/if]
                [if]
                	[variable]
                        	name=second_unit.level
                        	numerical_equals=1
                 	[/variable]
                	[then]
                    		[set_variable]
                        		name=unit.experience
                        		add=8
                    		[/set_variable]
                	[/then]
                [/if]
                [unstore_unit]
                   	variable=unit
                [/unstore_unit]
                [kill]
                    id=$second_unit.id
                    animate=yes
                [/kill]
            [/then]
            [/if]
		[/event]
#		[+attack] #These two don't seem correct either
#		[+specials]
#enddef

It may not work, I haven't tested it, I will let you do that, but I inspired myself from other campaigns and it seems more logical (I think the unit and second_unit weren't used properly in your code). But it is very probable that my code doesn't work...
I also put as commentaries what I think are mistakes. Some of them aren't, but it makes a very archaic code... So I'd suggest you create a separate macro file, with the abilities events, as it is done for example in LotI. It's clearer.
By the way, assassination is with twice double s, so I'll let you correct the mistake in the code.

Spoiler:

Yes. I soon realized this problem (Singing Fury's are the personal guard of a Keymedian so they are tremendously powerful). I've changed quite some things. Keymedian no longer recruits them (nice for Baran) and has a limited number of veterans to increase the number of units on the map. Centaurs have also slightly been reduced in numbers. But remember this : the whole point of the mission is to destroy your whole army so you get a fresh start (apart from your heroes not including Bernen (sorry)) in the second part. But don't worry you will have a replacement for Bernen and a very interesting new unit in your army. Just download the latest version (should be 1.05) to fix all of this.

I already have version 1.05, it's the one on which I played and did the feedback But indeed I think it is better this way.

Je compte traduire la campagne en français quand j'aurais le temps

N'hésite pas à me demander de l'aide, je serai ravi

Anyway thanks again for all this feedback. It's nice to have a new devoted tester and feedback giver. When I uploaded the campaign I hoped to receive nice feedback but now I realize the wesnoth community is more of giving very clear and helpful feedback that takes time and effort, not just flattery, this is, sadly, rare in our modern world.

I think it is actually the philosophy of wesnoth and what makes it great. You took some time to offer us a campaign, and we take ours to help you improve it.

About the story:

Spoiler:

I feel a bit "thrown into battle' sometimes, we discover the new enemy, it's like: "Guys, mutants, take them down, they're chyrospitals". I'm exaggerating, but sometimes, I just don't get why my units are fighting... I'm just killing hybrids, that apparently are Chyrospitals, I don't know why. Then I'm sort of fighting their army, and trying to find their fortress... But why? I think you have to polish a bit the story, it's cool, but as it is, you're just getting strange "things" down, not really knowing what they are, you just encounter people that want to kill you, and... Okkk... Of course I'm exaggerating, and it is still pretty well explained, but for example, in campaigns like HttT or LotI, you know perfectly what and why you are doing something. I know both are campaigns that are very old and that are really well done and had a lot of feedback, I'm hard with your story, but I would probably not have done better, and the fact that I understood what Chyrospitals were is already a good thing. I'm just pointing this out so that you can work on it on the long term

EDIT1:

Yes that update will come. Besides :

Spoiler:

I will add him a die event but he is no hero (and dies in the end even if he survived the whole campaign like I said above). But for the moment he reappears even after being dead which of course would not happen with a recall. I'm not sure of recalling him in each scenario because he isn't a hero so a player who has lost him would find some scenarios (5,8,9) extremely hard if they were balanced for people who have got this buffed royal guard with them. My theory of special units is that a good player should keep them to exploit their powers but they should not be necessary or that would diminish the freedom of the player. I reckon having him makes it a lot easier but you played the campaign on a harder difficulty than the end result.

Ok, I get it.

Spoiler:

But indeed, for the moment if he dies he reappears, and in the last scenario there is no alternative if he is dead... I thought that, as you use him as a hero, i.e he is used in special events, is sometimes recalled, has special amlas, and is necessary for the story, I thought he should be one. But I suppose you're going to rework this.

[jaeslin]

I actually don't get why she hasn't the elusive movement type... Smallfoot doesn't fit at all with the unit.

I understand it would seem more logical because she looks like a custom kind of thief. But elusive foot creatures have bad resistances (else they would be near impossible to kill without marksman or magic). If Gwendyl had elusive foot that would mean she gets less often hit but when she's hit she's dead
High percentage and bad resistance makes luck very important which is fun but not when it is your leader

Spoiler:

If she is still level 1 in scenario 3 a raider could probably one-shot her with the slow attack

. But I reckon giving her elusive foot (with one amla level up per terrain (flat, castle-village, mountain-forest)) would be nice to make her more thief-like in the end.

Spoiler:

Why don't you simply kill second.unit? I'm not an expert in WML, probably as you getting to understand it and trying to improve, but it doesn't seem logical to me that you check if there is a unit on x,y=$x2,$y2, and if it is on the unit's side. I'd suggest:

Code: Select all

#define WEAPON_SPECIAL_ASSASINATION
    # Canned definition of the assasination ability to be included in a
    # [specials] clause.
    [damage]
        id=assasination
        name= _ "assasination"
        description= _ "When used offensively, this attack kills the enemy unit if it is of level 0 or 1 and  if there is an enemy of the target on the opposite side of the target, and that unit is not incapacitated (turned to stone or otherwise paralysed)."
        apply_to=self
        backstab=yes
    [/damage]
#	[/specials] # This is not correct
#			defence_weight=0 #this has to go into the [attack] tag
#	[/attack] # This is not correct
		[event]
			name=attacker_hits
			first_time_only=no
			backstab=yes
			[filter_attack]
				special=assasination
			[/filter_attack]
            [if]
                [variable]
                	name=second_unit.level
                	numerical_equals=0
                [/variable]
                [or]
                	[variable]
                		name=second_unit.level
                		numerical_equals=1
                	[/variable]                
                [/or]
            	[then]
                	[unstore_unit]
                    		variable=second_unit
                    		find_vacant=no
                    		text="assasination"
                    		{COLOR_HARM}
                	[/unstore_unit]
                [if]
                	[variable]
                        	name=second_unit.level
                        	numerical_equals=0
                	[/variable]
                [then]
                	[set_variable]
                        	name=unit.experience
                        	add=4
                	[/set_variable]
                [/then]
                [/if]
                [if]
                	[variable]
                        	name=second_unit.level
                        	numerical_equals=1
                 	[/variable]
                	[then]
                    		[set_variable]
                        		name=unit.experience
                        		add=8
                    		[/set_variable]
                	[/then]
                [/if]
                [unstore_unit]
                   	variable=unit
                [/unstore_unit]
                [kill]
                    id=$second_unit.id
                    animate=yes
                [/kill]
            [/then]
            [/if]
		[/event]
#		[+attack] #These two don't seem correct either
#		[+specials]
#enddef

It may not work, I haven't tested it, I will let you do that, but I inspired myself from other campaigns and it seems more logical (I think the unit and second_unit weren't used properly in your code). But it is very probable that my code doesn't work...
I also put as commentaries what I think are mistakes. Some of them aren't, but it makes a very archaic code... So I'd suggest you create a separate macro file, with the abilities events, as it is done for example in LotI. It's clearer.
By the way, assassination is with twice double s, so I'll let you correct the mistake in the code.

I'll work on that but not in the 1.06 (where I plan on improving prose and talk/animation events). I must say I'm not the pro on this domain. My brother coded this so he is more likely to understand how or why it does/doesn't work. But thanks for deepening yourself in WML (I have little patience when it comes to this type of coding which progresses very slowly and is harder than just scenario code so I'm always impressed how much patience other people have)

About the story:

Spoiler:

I feel a bit "thrown into battle' sometimes, we discover the new enemy, it's like: "Guys, mutants, take them down, they're chyrospitals". I'm exaggerating, but sometimes, I just don't get why my units are fighting... I'm just killing hybrids, that apparently are Chyrospitals, I don't know why. Then I'm sort of fighting their army, and trying to find their fortress... But why? I think you have to polish a bit the story, it's cool, but as it is, you're just getting strange "things" down, not really knowing what they are, you just encounter people that want to kill you, and... Okkk... Of course I'm exaggerating, and it is still pretty well explained, but for example, in campaigns like HttT or LotI, you know perfectly what and why you are doing something. I know both are campaigns that are very old and that are really well done and had a lot of feedback, I'm hard with your story, but I would probably not have done better, and the fact that I understood what Chyrospitals were is already a good thing. I'm just pointing this out so that you can work on it on the long term

Spoiler:

Yes. The big problem is no one knows anything about them so it's just "battle against the nasty monsters" most of the time. It should become clearer with some revelations in the second part but I think I'll add some dialogue or some random character who can give the Chyrospital a bit more depth during the first adventure. Problem is most hybrids (apart from Flame Lords and Centaurs and of course the human Slavers) are almost speechless so they can't give a lot of information while dying. This is why Reamore is important. His treachery shows that the Chyrospital is not just a senseless destructive force but a well organized army, ready to make alliances if it can hasten their victory. I could add a part about the "Flesh-Law" which Reamore pretty much explains in the last scenario: "We give them material support including some of our men and women and they let us live and provide us with some help to defeat our own rivals and/or assist them in their war. Editing the race description will also make things easier to understand. The hard thing is to make an interesting new very powerful enemy which isn't mainline or "super powerful demons like in LotI".

[Yellowsilver]

Spoiler:

If she is still level 1 in scenario 3 a raider could probably one-shot her with the slow attack

Spoiler:

Actually, only by night. She has 28 hitpoints, and raider would deal 24 as base damage. Second, it actually wouldn't change much because personally, she did die (had to load) with both raiders on her. For smallfoot, I consider that she should then have more hitpoints. Between a 20% better defence but bad resistance and normal defence and resistance, I choose better defence. The thief adv. tree was a good part of my army, they're really strong I find. And elusive is also faster on most terrains. Currently, it's a pain in the neck to get Gwendyl through hills... Also, the fire spitter and its adv. tree would hit her less for the same damage. And I actually don't think there are units in your campaign with magical or marksman, apart from Keymedian and Rogue Mage adv. tree (am I mistaken?).

As amlas you could give her also better physical resistance, It would be good.

I'll work on that but not in the 1.06 (where I plan on improving prose and talk/animation events). I must say I'm not the pro on this domain. My brother coded this so he is more likely to understand how or why it does/doesn't work. But thanks for deepening yourself in WML (I have little patience when it comes to this type of coding which progresses very slowly and is harder than just scenario code so I'm always impressed how much patience other people have)

It's actually the contrary for me, I find writing texts somehow boring, but I can spend hours reading the code of an add-on to inspire myself. I read nearly the entirety of the files of LotI for example.

Once I finished reading your scenarios looking for typos, I shall read the units' descriptions, I saw many there too.

EDIT1:
Typos in scenarios:

S6
of the grandchidren → of the grandchildren
We are surrounded by them → We are surrounded ; (might be better)
horse-man → horse-men ; (perhaps saying clearly "centaurs" would be better, I don't know)
to our enemies progress → to our enemies' progress

S7
talk later for the moment → talk later. For the moment
You will recieve → You will receive
You are a foul to think little mage those are necromancers. → Little mage, you are a foul to think they are necromancers.
The South Folks → The southern Folk (?)
the Keymedian my troops → the Keymedian. My troops
those bloody plains → these bloody plains

S8
since they had fought to protect Thingatel the last time → since the last time, when they had fought to protect Thingatel ; (sounds better)
been attacked till what was left → been attacked until what was left ; (try not to use "till" too much, I saw it many times, it sounds logical for the dwarf's rough language, but not in the story)
Ennemies of the spirits → Enemies of the spirits
we have fought ennemies → we have fought enemies

S9
lead a small force → led a small force
a threath to us → a threat to us
Northen Creatures → Northern Creatures
Whe → We
by foot → on foot
For the sloppy code: you can use the [object] tag and set duration=scenario. It's still a bit sloppy to do it for each new turn but I think it's already better.

Code: Select all

    [event]
        name=new turn
        first_time_only=no
        [modify_unit]
            [object]
            	[filter]
                    side=1
                    [not]
                        id=Greyfeather
                    [/not]
            	[/filter]
                duration=scenario
                [effect]
                    apply_to=movement_costs
                    replace=yes # replace=yes → replace=true (?)
                    [movement_costs]
                        frozen=2
                    [/movement_costs]
                [/effect]
            [/object]
        [/modify_unit]
    [/event]

Isn't it replace=true and not replace=yes?

If you plan to redo texts in the 1.06 update, please read carefully and put commas where they are needed. Otherwise, the texts don't feel natural. For the moment, I have the impression that 90% of the sentences are missing commas somewhere. I didn't mark them as typo (you'll notice I did for the missing periods), because it would make me correct nearly the full text.

[jaeslin]

If you plan to redo texts in the 1.06 update, please read carefully and put commas where they are needed. Otherwise, the texts don't feel natural. For the moment, I have the impression that 90% of the sentences are missing commas somewhere. I didn't mark them as typo (you'll notice I did for the missing periods), because it would make me correct nearly the full text.

Done. I didn't add commas everywhere but I put a lot more in the background story between scenarios. I also added dialogue (scenario 4 but mostly 6) that improve comprehension and add details about the Chyrospital (check it out). Thanks for your thread on "race" issues. The hybrids now have a description which I may complete later but I don't want to give too much detail. For the moment I explain vaguely how hybrids are created, the hierarchy and their army composition.
Next update 1.07 will be about improving custom units (Bernen and Gwendyl mostly) and slightly improve dialogue if still needed.

[Yellowsilver]

Done. I didn't add commas everywhere but I put a lot more in the background story between scenarios. I also added dialogue (scenario 4 but mostly 6) that improve comprehension and add details about the Chyrospital (check it out). Thanks for your thread on "race" issues. The hybrids now have a description which I may complete later but I don't want to give too much detail. For the moment I explain vaguely how hybrids are created, the hierarchy and their army composition.
Next update 1.07 will be about improving custom units (Bernen and Gwendyl mostly) and slightly improve dialogue if still needed.

Right, I'll check it out sometime, and play the campaign again. But I just started TSL, so

Do you plan adding different difficulties as well?