Roboke's Island
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Roboke's Island
Roboke's Island
Embark from Elensefar on an expedition to the west that will not only change your life but concern the fate of many.
Want a dragon? Sure.
A Queen? Got you covered.
Magic? Right there!
Can I have a Pony? No.
Trolls are not allowed on board, either
But you may enjoy the unique hop-on-hop-off boat-cruise in the cursed southern cliffs of Roboke's Island or fancy a swim with the mermaids up north...
This campaign features dual-layer scenarios (move units between cave and hills on the same map) and ship hop-on/off scenarios.
"Unraveling the mystery of Roboke island is a magic experience."
(Weldyn Gazette)
"Ferocious battles and mysterious riddles await you."
(Wesmere Post)
"The adventures of Roboke and his side-kick are truly stunning."
(Knalga News)
Embark from Elensefar on an expedition to the west that will not only change your life but concern the fate of many.
Want a dragon? Sure.
A Queen? Got you covered.
Magic? Right there!
Can I have a Pony? No.
Trolls are not allowed on board, either
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
This campaign features dual-layer scenarios (move units between cave and hills on the same map) and ship hop-on/off scenarios.
"Unraveling the mystery of Roboke island is a magic experience."
(Weldyn Gazette)
"Ferocious battles and mysterious riddles await you."
(Wesmere Post)
"The adventures of Roboke and his side-kick are truly stunning."
(Knalga News)
Last edited by x42 on October 3rd, 2013, 5:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Roboke's Island
Ahoy everyone,
Welcome to Roboke's Island. Harrrrr.
After dabbling with some lua and writing the storyboard two years ago, this campaign somehow shot out of the ground in the last three (!) weeks, a scenario a day.
The main idea was to create a single large map of an island. Every scenario takes place in a specific section thereof.
Since it is a large volcanic island there are actually two maps: Hills and the caves underneath it, which overlay 1:1.
..and the twist: You can have a unit on the same tile in the mountains and the cave below it - in the same scenario - and switch between them.
This does not only open the door for new battle strategies, but also lays the foundation for various riddles (and hidden treasure).
Naturally, I'm very interested in feedback. As this campaign is very new (and so far only tested on GNU/Linux using wesnoth-git) the most important question first:
(1) Does it load and open without error-messages (it needs BfW >= 1.11.6 for MicroAIs) on your system? (OS, BfW Version)
(NB. As you will have noticed, the current 0.8-beta version still allows to jump to specific scenarios. While this is handy for debugging, you'll have a hard time to complete later scenarios without a recall list.)
I only had the time to play the whole campaign from 01 -> 25 through once so far and have based the number of turns (and minimum start gold and enemies) on that experience.
So I'm particularly interested in:
(2) How many turns did each scenario take you? (just mention unusual large/low counts)
(3) Are there scenarios where you lack initial gold or others with excessive boni?
But back to the basics first:
(4) Do you think the story chapters are too verbose (in particular: 01, 05, 20)?
(5) How clear did you find the dialog and the story? Did anything feel fictionally unnatural?
(6) How entertaining do you think the campaign is? (1: very boring - 10: I could not stop playing)
Now for the fun stuff:
(7) How well done did you find the map for the campaign?
(8) How difficult did you find the battles (overall and/or per scenario)? (1:easy - 10: very hard)
(9) Did you solve the puzzles (10_Southern_Cliffs, 12b_Water_Colors, 16_Southern_Caves)? (1: way too easy - 10: too hard, got stuck)
(10) What were your major challenges in completing the campaign?
As for bugs, errors and spelling mistakes: there likely are many! Please report them.
Actually, any suggestions how to improve this campaign and make it more fun are welcome.
IMHO this campaign could benefit greatly from some screen-writing (revise story, spread out dialogs through the scenarios, proper names of supporting-actors and places), as well as graphic design to give the main actors some visual personality.
Please see the "HELP_WANTED.txt" file that comes with the source.
If you feel creatiave, please have a look at the "TODO" file.. (yes, you can add to it, too!)
(11) What is the most annoying [missing] feature that should be fixed/implemented next?
As always, any feedback is welcome.
Cheers!
robin
PS. Please mention the Version of Roboke's Island that you have played. It can be found in the Add-on manager as well as top-right in the first (00_Test) scenario.
Welcome to Roboke's Island. Harrrrr.
After dabbling with some lua and writing the storyboard two years ago, this campaign somehow shot out of the ground in the last three (!) weeks, a scenario a day.
The main idea was to create a single large map of an island. Every scenario takes place in a specific section thereof.
Since it is a large volcanic island there are actually two maps: Hills and the caves underneath it, which overlay 1:1.
..and the twist: You can have a unit on the same tile in the mountains and the cave below it - in the same scenario - and switch between them.
This does not only open the door for new battle strategies, but also lays the foundation for various riddles (and hidden treasure).
Naturally, I'm very interested in feedback. As this campaign is very new (and so far only tested on GNU/Linux using wesnoth-git) the most important question first:
(1) Does it load and open without error-messages (it needs BfW >= 1.11.6 for MicroAIs) on your system? (OS, BfW Version)
(NB. As you will have noticed, the current 0.8-beta version still allows to jump to specific scenarios. While this is handy for debugging, you'll have a hard time to complete later scenarios without a recall list.)
I only had the time to play the whole campaign from 01 -> 25 through once so far and have based the number of turns (and minimum start gold and enemies) on that experience.
So I'm particularly interested in:
(2) How many turns did each scenario take you? (just mention unusual large/low counts)
(3) Are there scenarios where you lack initial gold or others with excessive boni?
But back to the basics first:
(4) Do you think the story chapters are too verbose (in particular: 01, 05, 20)?
(5) How clear did you find the dialog and the story? Did anything feel fictionally unnatural?
(6) How entertaining do you think the campaign is? (1: very boring - 10: I could not stop playing)
Now for the fun stuff:
(7) How well done did you find the map for the campaign?
(8) How difficult did you find the battles (overall and/or per scenario)? (1:easy - 10: very hard)
(9) Did you solve the puzzles (10_Southern_Cliffs, 12b_Water_Colors, 16_Southern_Caves)? (1: way too easy - 10: too hard, got stuck)
(10) What were your major challenges in completing the campaign?
As for bugs, errors and spelling mistakes: there likely are many! Please report them.
Actually, any suggestions how to improve this campaign and make it more fun are welcome.
IMHO this campaign could benefit greatly from some screen-writing (revise story, spread out dialogs through the scenarios, proper names of supporting-actors and places), as well as graphic design to give the main actors some visual personality.
Please see the "HELP_WANTED.txt" file that comes with the source.
If you feel creatiave, please have a look at the "TODO" file.. (yes, you can add to it, too!)
(11) What is the most annoying [missing] feature that should be fixed/implemented next?
As always, any feedback is welcome.
Cheers!
robin
PS. Please mention the Version of Roboke's Island that you have played. It can be found in the Add-on manager as well as top-right in the first (00_Test) scenario.
Last edited by x42 on October 8th, 2013, 2:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Paulomat4
- Moderator Emeritus
- Posts: 730
- Joined: October 16th, 2012, 3:32 pm
- Location: Wesmere library, probably summoning Zhangor
Re: Roboke's Island
hey, recently found your campaign. The introduction text is great. I love it.
some things that i think should be changed:
-In the introduction text in the campaign selection screen, the names of the Newspapers is a bit big. They are a bit disturbing. Perhaps make them a bit smaller?
-in the first story map the flag isn't on elensefar but in the water. I'd change it to pointing to elensefar.
-you seem to use 1.10 story maps. upgrade to 1.11 story maps.
-at one moment governor gray of elensefar says fiveteen years ago. Shouldn't it be fifteen years ago?
(1) Does it load and open without error-messages on your system?
Yes it does
some things that i think should be changed:
-In the introduction text in the campaign selection screen, the names of the Newspapers is a bit big. They are a bit disturbing. Perhaps make them a bit smaller?
-in the first story map the flag isn't on elensefar but in the water. I'd change it to pointing to elensefar.
-you seem to use 1.10 story maps. upgrade to 1.11 story maps.
-at one moment governor gray of elensefar says fiveteen years ago. Shouldn't it be fifteen years ago?
(1) Does it load and open without error-messages on your system?
Yes it does
Creator of Dawn of Thunder and Global Unitmarkers
"I thought Naga's used semi-automatic crossbows with incendiary thermite arrows . . . my beliefs that this race is awesome are now shattered." - Evil Earl
"I thought Naga's used semi-automatic crossbows with incendiary thermite arrows . . . my beliefs that this race is awesome are now shattered." - Evil Earl
Re: Roboke's Island
Hi,
Good catch, thanks for the feedback.
Formatting issues were so far mostly below my radar...
I've updated the description and fixed a few more typos in the dialog & story. - It's actually about seven years :)
As for the flag, strictly speaking the galleon is in the harbor of Elensefar, so placing it in the water seemed the way to go. but it looked odd indeed. Fixed.
Good catch, thanks for the feedback.
Formatting issues were so far mostly below my radar...
I've updated the description and fixed a few more typos in the dialog & story. - It's actually about seven years :)
As for the flag, strictly speaking the galleon is in the harbor of Elensefar, so placing it in the water seemed the way to go. but it looked odd indeed. Fixed.
Code: Select all
2013-10-06 (0.8.4-beta)
* switch to use new wesnoth-1.11 map in stories
* fix various typos in messages and update campaign description
* add cave to scenario 06_Amazon_City
* fix lurker-AI in scenario 10_Southern_Cliffs
Re: Roboke's Island
I have been playing your campaign (B.F.w 1.11.6, 0.8.9 version, third difficulty) and have reached the southern cliffs scenario, so far. Now for your questions:
(1) no errors appeared in my playtrough;
(2) Normally i need almost all of them. I understand the need to have small turns because of the carryover gold, but them you do some scenarios with no turn limit(pirate bay, for example) that allow the player to gain huge amounts of gold. It´s like going from 8 to 80;
(3) The gold in the first 3 scenarios feels right and makes those a challenge. However, the one against the queen of the island should be more difficult. She doesn´t have much units and there are so many villages that the gold carried over is, at least, 2 times higher than what i got before it. Also the "pirate bay" level is the easiest level i have ever played in this game, because the enemies have low income, few units and my ally can crush almost all of them by herself without interference from me;
(4)the story is interesting but you have scenarios with almost no explanation of the situation on the island and then the amount of exposition becomes huge. Maybe things a little more spaced would help it(the writing isn´t perfect but that´s another problem);
(5) Good so far;
PS:finished the level with 832 gold. I get the feeling that you didn´t want players to get that much.
(6) 6 -> The first 3 scenarios are very good, with a fitting difficulty and had a blast with them. However, after them and until the one i am currently, i can just faceroll all the levels because there´s almost no enemies to face my forces. I think you should really see that;
(7) Good enough;
(8) See point 8. Also i don´t see the difficulty of the campaign as being expert, it really seems more like intermediate level;
(9) Haven´t still finished the level but, until now, this level is becoming something of a chore. I started with the mermaid leader and one loyal at level 3, one mermaid healer at level 2 and 2 fighter mermaids at level 1. The time needed to explore all villages with the dwarf is so huge that all of the 5 mermaids are now level 3. That wouldn´t be so bad if at least i faced some difficult enemies, instead of a a swarm of tentacles that spawn all turns and doesn´t pose threat.
(1) no errors appeared in my playtrough;
(2) Normally i need almost all of them. I understand the need to have small turns because of the carryover gold, but them you do some scenarios with no turn limit(pirate bay, for example) that allow the player to gain huge amounts of gold. It´s like going from 8 to 80;
(3) The gold in the first 3 scenarios feels right and makes those a challenge. However, the one against the queen of the island should be more difficult. She doesn´t have much units and there are so many villages that the gold carried over is, at least, 2 times higher than what i got before it. Also the "pirate bay" level is the easiest level i have ever played in this game, because the enemies have low income, few units and my ally can crush almost all of them by herself without interference from me;
(4)the story is interesting but you have scenarios with almost no explanation of the situation on the island and then the amount of exposition becomes huge. Maybe things a little more spaced would help it(the writing isn´t perfect but that´s another problem);
(5) Good so far;
PS:finished the level with 832 gold. I get the feeling that you didn´t want players to get that much.
(6) 6 -> The first 3 scenarios are very good, with a fitting difficulty and had a blast with them. However, after them and until the one i am currently, i can just faceroll all the levels because there´s almost no enemies to face my forces. I think you should really see that;
(7) Good enough;
(8) See point 8. Also i don´t see the difficulty of the campaign as being expert, it really seems more like intermediate level;
(9) Haven´t still finished the level but, until now, this level is becoming something of a chore. I started with the mermaid leader and one loyal at level 3, one mermaid healer at level 2 and 2 fighter mermaids at level 1. The time needed to explore all villages with the dwarf is so huge that all of the 5 mermaids are now level 3. That wouldn´t be so bad if at least i faced some difficult enemies, instead of a a swarm of tentacles that spawn all turns and doesn´t pose threat.
Re: Roboke's Island
Currently the only difference between easy, normal and hard, is just the number of turns available per scenario (give or take a few extra recruits or enemy-loyal units). Since you play it in hard, using up almost all of the turns seems right.ahmannar wrote: (2) Normally i need almost all of them. I understand the need to have small turns because of the carryover gold
Interesting. You're a better player than I am, then. I anticipated the queen will remain owning most of the villages (and therefore get more recruits).ahmannar wrote: (3) The gold in the first 3 scenarios feels right and makes those a challenge. However, the one against the queen of the island should be more difficult. She doesn´t have much units and there are so many villages that the gold carried over is, at least, 2 times higher than what i got before it.
I also just reached this level (playing though from start). One strategy here is to just sit things out.. while I intended the mer-men allies to only come in later into the battle. This level will need major balancing work.ahmannar wrote: Also the "pirate bay" level is the easiest level i have ever played in this game, because the enemies have low income, few units and my ally can crush almost all of them by herself without interference from me;
Most likley other levels that follow will need that too.
Right, screen-writing is on the ToDo and wish-list. With English not being my first language I found it easier to write the story in blocks. I'm confident that there are opportunities to spread things out and weave more of the story into the non-story scenarios.ahmannar wrote: (4)the story is interesting but you have scenarios with almost no explanation of the situation on the island and then the amount of exposition becomes huge. Maybe things a little more spaced would help it(the writing isn´t perfect but that´s another problem);
LOL, no. Which level was that? 06_Amazon_City?ahmannar wrote: PS:finished the level with 832 gold. I get the feeling that you didn´t want players to get that much.
Likely caused by me mainly unit-testing individual scenarios rather than playing start to end. I'll look into making it harder. hehehe.ahmannar wrote: (6) 6 -> The first 3 scenarios are very good, with a fitting difficulty and had a blast with them. However, after them and until the one i am currently, i can just faceroll all the levels because there´s almost no enemies to face my forces. I think you should really see that;
![Twisted Evil :twisted:](./images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif)
fair enough.ahmannar wrote: (8) See point 8. Also i don´t see the difficulty of the campaign as being expert, it really seems more like intermediate level;
mmh that's a bug. There should also be Sea Serpents and Naga Fighters spawning randomly if all enemies are defeated. I'm also thinking about speeding up the galleon a bit to make it less of a chore.ahmannar wrote: (9) Haven´t still finished the level but, until now, this level is becoming something of a chore. I started with the mermaid leader and one loyal at level 3, one mermaid healer at level 2 and 2 fighter mermaids at level 1. The time needed to explore all villages with the dwarf is so huge that all of the 5 mermaids are now level 3. That wouldn´t be so bad if at least i faced some difficult enemies, instead of a a swarm of tentacles that spawn all turns and doesn´t pose threat.
Anyway, many thanks for the feedback!
There is very valuable information in there.
More updates are in the queue. (note that I only started writing this campaign on sep. 16 - it's barely 4 weeks old)
Re: Roboke's Island
Roboke Island was just updated to version 0.9.0
Without spoiling too much, the most prominent changes are:
have fun!
Without spoiling too much, the most prominent changes are:
- updates for Wesnoth 12.x, 13.x-git (microAIs, WML)
- fix typographic errors, update stories and dialog
- re-balance scenarios, increase difficulty of later levels
- small tweaks to make solving riddles less of a chore
- dedicated Amazon units based on Elves
- add campaign music & sound effects
- allow to properly complete level variant 12a
- add embellishments and decorations to maps
have fun!
Re: Roboke's Island
hey, just a really quick feedback since I am still playing the campaign:
(played current version on 1.12, normal difficulty):
- the first few levels are fun and not too hard (some even really easy) but the difficulty seems to be to make it before running out of time (the one where I first meet the Mermen I used up 18 out of the 20 turns)
- love the "mapping the island" idea and also the levels are rather well-designed in terms of layout and objectives so far.
- the one where I have to defend my ship for 10 turns was by far the most difficult (if you want to keep some units besides the Captain alive). I also didn't figure out that the Drakes are my allies until halfway through (not that the do much anyway, but then I'd have maybe moved towards them instead of away from them). I feel like a unit shouting out "Look out! Those Drakes are also fighting the sea creatures, lets show them we mean them no harm" or something like that.
- The one where the Dwarf has to visit all the villages:
Idea is cool but it gets rather tiring after a while.
Issues in this level:
1. when the Dwarf visits a village that was already claimed by the Merfolk, he says "I've been here already", does this mean that claiming villages with Merfolk might cause me to miss out on map parts?
2. when reaching a certain village he says "There's no map here, but I found a tunnel". However there is no possibility for me to use that tunnel (no switching between hill/cave-mode like earlier). is that intentional? seemed really weird.
3. Also: no turn limit and gold+units get carried over? I haven't seen the following scenarios maybe this will be countered by removing the gold soon but I think a turn limit or not getting to keep the gold would be better (in that case the starting gold for the next scenario should probably be higher)
(played current version on 1.12, normal difficulty):
- the first few levels are fun and not too hard (some even really easy) but the difficulty seems to be to make it before running out of time (the one where I first meet the Mermen I used up 18 out of the 20 turns)
- love the "mapping the island" idea and also the levels are rather well-designed in terms of layout and objectives so far.
- the one where I have to defend my ship for 10 turns was by far the most difficult (if you want to keep some units besides the Captain alive). I also didn't figure out that the Drakes are my allies until halfway through (not that the do much anyway, but then I'd have maybe moved towards them instead of away from them). I feel like a unit shouting out "Look out! Those Drakes are also fighting the sea creatures, lets show them we mean them no harm" or something like that.
- The one where the Dwarf has to visit all the villages:
Idea is cool but it gets rather tiring after a while.
Issues in this level:
1. when the Dwarf visits a village that was already claimed by the Merfolk, he says "I've been here already", does this mean that claiming villages with Merfolk might cause me to miss out on map parts?
2. when reaching a certain village he says "There's no map here, but I found a tunnel". However there is no possibility for me to use that tunnel (no switching between hill/cave-mode like earlier). is that intentional? seemed really weird.
3. Also: no turn limit and gold+units get carried over? I haven't seen the following scenarios maybe this will be countered by removing the gold soon but I think a turn limit or not getting to keep the gold would be better (in that case the starting gold for the next scenario should probably be higher)
Re: Roboke's Island
Hi Chep,
Thanks for the feedback,
However currently I'm not actually sure if the drakes should stay. They don't exactly fit in the original storyline at this point and were an early somewhat futile attempt to re-balance the difficulty of that off-shore interlude while adding some spice. I'll sleep it over.
Either way it works here (the unit can 'jump' north/south).
Either way. The gold is separated for each leader, so no worries there. I'll add that to the Objectives as notes.
I'll push an update out hopefully tomorrow, but latest by the end of the week.
Cheers!
Thanks for the feedback,
That level is indeed one of the weak-spots. It need balancing.Chep wrote: - the one where I have to defend my ship for 10 turns was by far the most difficult
Spoiler:
Good point. It should be made clear that no units are retained from this scenario.Chep wrote: (if you want to keep some units besides the Captain alive).
That's a great idea.Chep wrote: I also didn't figure out that the Drakes are my allies until halfway through (not that the do much anyway, but then I'd have maybe moved towards them instead of away from them). I feel like a unit shouting out "Look out! Those Drakes are also fighting the sea creatures, lets show them we mean them no harm" or something like that.
However currently I'm not actually sure if the drakes should stay. They don't exactly fit in the original storyline at this point and were an early somewhat futile attempt to re-balance the difficulty of that off-shore interlude while adding some spice. I'll sleep it over.
Mmh, no. Only the Dwarf searches villages. Are you certain he has not visited that village before? If so that's a bug. Which version of Roboke Island did you play? 0.9.4 ?Chep wrote: - The one where the Dwarf has to visit all the villages:
Idea is cool but it gets rather tiring after a while.
Issues in this level:
1. when the Dwarf visits a village that was already claimed by the Merfolk, he says "I've been here already", does this mean that claiming villages with Merfolk might cause me to miss out on map parts?
Spoiler:
It's a default "wesnoth teleport" tunnel. I see now that this can be confusing. I'll clarify (or remove) it.Chep wrote: 2. when reaching a certain village he says "There's no map here, but I found a tunnel". However there is no possibility for me to use that tunnel (no switching between hill/cave-mode like earlier). is that intentional? seemed really weird.
Either way it works here (the unit can 'jump' north/south).
Spoiler:
That is a tricky part. The level is predominantly a riddle and if you know where to look, you can finish it rather quickly. It also depends a bit on luck, the sea creatures are spawned randomly.Chep wrote: 3. Also: no turn limit and gold+units get carried over? I haven't seen the following scenarios maybe this will be countered by removing the gold soon but I think a turn limit or not getting to keep the gold would be better (in that case the starting gold for the next scenario should probably be higher)
Either way. The gold is separated for each leader, so no worries there. I'll add that to the Objectives as notes.
I'll push an update out hopefully tomorrow, but latest by the end of the week.
Cheers!
Re: Roboke's Island
hi, thanks for the quick answer ![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
In Pirate Bay (at least I think thats the name of the scenario where I have to steal the ships) I took one ship (from the Nagas I think) and then killed the Pirate Leader for an immediate end. (maybe that could also be listed as an alternative win-condition).
So I got the "bonuslevel" despite killing the Pirate Leader![Wink ;)](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
Not being able to keep any of the units from the ship-defense is sad, I was so looking forward to using my beloved Iron Maulers in this campaign, but probably good for balancing.
Yes telling the player that this level has no influence on the rest of the campaign (if gold/units are not kept) would be a good thing to do.
---
I am certain that he never visited the village before, only Merfolk (blue player) did. He was the first unit from red player to visit it (it's the non-merfolk-village ~1-2 screens east of blue's keep on a small island, sorry am not ingame right now thus no coordinates)
Playing the version of the campaign that was online ~12 hours ago for 1.12 (that's when I downloaded it, again dont have any numbers right now, but should be the most recent)
--
I still don't understand the "Teleport-Tunnel". Should my unit be transported automatically? Or does it work like the Silver Mages ability to teleport to a friendly village?
I thought it might lead me to the Hammer that is on one of the islands.
edit: okay I got it, it's similar to the Silver Mage ability. Maybe you could change the message to "I found a tunnel that leads to the (village in the) north"?
--
In one of the first maps (I think the one with the first Cave/Mountain-switch) there was an armor that none of my units could use (tried Spearmen, the Dwarf, my Leader and the Seargent/General) is that for one of the later scenarios?
--
edit:
So, I solved the water-puzzle (though I feel like taking the other route is better since it allows you to level more units, but then maybe you'd lose out on gold...) and liberated the Mage.
Why is he STRONG & Resilient?
Shouldn't he be loyal? also quick or intelligent would be much better for a mage than f*cking strong -.-
makes me hate the guy immediately^^
-
East Again
uhm...this scenario just seems broken.
no turn limit. no real enemies, lots of huts.
Green can't even recruit after her initial burst of Rangers, the beasts fight each other and 1-2 mages + the unit with the holy water dispatch the Undead easily while the Saurian skirmishers might be annoying but no problem at all.
The level can be quickly finished with the Galleon but why should one? It's nice to have an opportunity to level some mages but I feel like there should be more of a threat to the player from the North.
Either undead or some slow-moving units from the green player should be swarming the player from the north forcing her to end the game in a timely fashion and not milk it for XP&Gold. Or there should be a turn limit (~30 I'd say on Normal)
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
In Pirate Bay (at least I think thats the name of the scenario where I have to steal the ships) I took one ship (from the Nagas I think) and then killed the Pirate Leader for an immediate end. (maybe that could also be listed as an alternative win-condition).
So I got the "bonuslevel" despite killing the Pirate Leader
![Wink ;)](./images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
Not being able to keep any of the units from the ship-defense is sad, I was so looking forward to using my beloved Iron Maulers in this campaign, but probably good for balancing.
Yes telling the player that this level has no influence on the rest of the campaign (if gold/units are not kept) would be a good thing to do.
---
I am certain that he never visited the village before, only Merfolk (blue player) did. He was the first unit from red player to visit it (it's the non-merfolk-village ~1-2 screens east of blue's keep on a small island, sorry am not ingame right now thus no coordinates)
Playing the version of the campaign that was online ~12 hours ago for 1.12 (that's when I downloaded it, again dont have any numbers right now, but should be the most recent)
--
I still don't understand the "Teleport-Tunnel". Should my unit be transported automatically? Or does it work like the Silver Mages ability to teleport to a friendly village?
I thought it might lead me to the Hammer that is on one of the islands.
edit: okay I got it, it's similar to the Silver Mage ability. Maybe you could change the message to "I found a tunnel that leads to the (village in the) north"?
--
In one of the first maps (I think the one with the first Cave/Mountain-switch) there was an armor that none of my units could use (tried Spearmen, the Dwarf, my Leader and the Seargent/General) is that for one of the later scenarios?
--
edit:
So, I solved the water-puzzle (though I feel like taking the other route is better since it allows you to level more units, but then maybe you'd lose out on gold...) and liberated the Mage.
Why is he STRONG & Resilient?
Shouldn't he be loyal? also quick or intelligent would be much better for a mage than f*cking strong -.-
makes me hate the guy immediately^^
-
East Again
uhm...this scenario just seems broken.
no turn limit. no real enemies, lots of huts.
Green can't even recruit after her initial burst of Rangers, the beasts fight each other and 1-2 mages + the unit with the holy water dispatch the Undead easily while the Saurian skirmishers might be annoying but no problem at all.
The level can be quickly finished with the Galleon but why should one? It's nice to have an opportunity to level some mages but I feel like there should be more of a threat to the player from the North.
Either undead or some slow-moving units from the green player should be swarming the player from the north forcing her to end the game in a timely fashion and not milk it for XP&Gold. Or there should be a turn limit (~30 I'd say on Normal)
Re: Roboke's Island
okay, I hope it is accepted that I double-post, but if I keep editing the old post I'll just confuse myself.
I really like your campaign so please keep that in mind for all of my complaints in this thread.
Maps without turn limits are just bad campaign design.
It works for pure puzzles like the one with the water colours, but for all other levels it is something that needs to be remedied/fixed.
Bug: Captain Roboke had Leadership in the first few maps but now on Southern Caves he doesn't have it anymore. It might be caused by him taking up the potion of strenght but either way it seems unwanted.
Southern Caves:
Hooray, another (endless) map for the dwarf (and only him) to explore. Wait, did I say another? It is basically the same he already explored earlier. Only this time with a harder puzzle to solve -.-
1. The Bats just seem superflous: they get killed within the first ~5-6 turns by the Cuttle Fishes and have virtually no player interaction
2. Does the amount of units purple spawns per turn scale with the number of turns passed or something? Because purples troops are okay in the earlygame but get increasingly frustrating to deal with about 20-25 turns into the map. I'd suggest lowering the randomly spawned troops or replacing a few of the hundreds of cuttle fish he gets with lvl 2 naga warriors. And/or limit the amount of troops purple can have at the same turn so they don't accumulate in areas where you can't reach them.
3. When a unit that is not the Dwarf/Galleon reaches an important tile (like the valves) please have them say something like "Hm...what is this? Maybe Monsieur Canoneer should come here" or so.
How do I cross the chasm? I assume thats where the 2nd valve is, but I can't find a way past it. I got the Armor, the Ring and the Cloak plus the 2 treasures but can't find the 2nd valve.
I really like your campaign so please keep that in mind for all of my complaints in this thread.
Maps without turn limits are just bad campaign design.
It works for pure puzzles like the one with the water colours, but for all other levels it is something that needs to be remedied/fixed.
Bug: Captain Roboke had Leadership in the first few maps but now on Southern Caves he doesn't have it anymore. It might be caused by him taking up the potion of strenght but either way it seems unwanted.
Southern Caves:
Hooray, another (endless) map for the dwarf (and only him) to explore. Wait, did I say another? It is basically the same he already explored earlier. Only this time with a harder puzzle to solve -.-
1. The Bats just seem superflous: they get killed within the first ~5-6 turns by the Cuttle Fishes and have virtually no player interaction
2. Does the amount of units purple spawns per turn scale with the number of turns passed or something? Because purples troops are okay in the earlygame but get increasingly frustrating to deal with about 20-25 turns into the map. I'd suggest lowering the randomly spawned troops or replacing a few of the hundreds of cuttle fish he gets with lvl 2 naga warriors. And/or limit the amount of troops purple can have at the same turn so they don't accumulate in areas where you can't reach them.
3. When a unit that is not the Dwarf/Galleon reaches an important tile (like the valves) please have them say something like "Hm...what is this? Maybe Monsieur Canoneer should come here" or so.
How do I cross the chasm? I assume thats where the 2nd valve is, but I can't find a way past it. I got the Armor, the Ring and the Cloak plus the 2 treasures but can't find the 2nd valve.
Re: Roboke's Island
Hi Chap,
No worries about double-post. Your criticism is just and to the point, I'm very grateful for that and am glad you enjoy the campaign.
I've uploaded a new version just now.
I opted for "There is a secret tunnel leading directly to the village (north|south) beyond the strait here." and added various notes to the objectives regarding gold and recallable units/sides.
..not quite done, yet, but pushing this out before you progress further. Over-xmas I did various tweaks to the later scenario which were not yet uploaded. Also in the scenario where you're currently stuck at (#16, Southern Caves) it was already possible to move players on foot around most of the islands there.
I cannot reproduce this "I already searched" message. Reading the code, I can't explain it either. Could you please send me a replay?
The silver armor in the goblin's cave - that was a stupid typo, fixed. Ive also removed the random_traits from the mage. Quick/intelligent makes indeed a lot more sense. Those will come with the next update, soonish. I want to look into re-balacing the East-Again first.
regarding the "16. Southern Caves" feedback
1) Yep the bats just add ambience. Without them the eco-system and food chain would not be preserved. Hey, cuttlefish need to eat something after all :)
2) The amount and strength of the enemies increases over time (which is how I intend to work around the missing time limit). To be specific, in turn 12, 20, 25, 30. Also for every defeated enemy leader an extra random sea monster is created per turn.
Same in scenario10 (first dwarf/ship, "Southern Cliffs") there's a message at turn 28 "The ocean is stirring. Beware, those huge waves will drive wilder beats closer to the shore soon.", and starting turn 30 Sea Serpents are added to the mix... This message is not yet in scenario 16.
3) good idea.
Wow! good job in finding the cloak. That's a secret item worthy of a good explorer (there's a story about how it ended up there, but that's for later).
As for the 2nd valve, a small hint: there are tiles common to the land and cave map.
No worries about double-post. Your criticism is just and to the point, I'm very grateful for that and am glad you enjoy the campaign.
I've uploaded a new version just now.
I opted for "There is a secret tunnel leading directly to the village (north|south) beyond the strait here." and added various notes to the objectives regarding gold and recallable units/sides.
..not quite done, yet, but pushing this out before you progress further. Over-xmas I did various tweaks to the later scenario which were not yet uploaded. Also in the scenario where you're currently stuck at (#16, Southern Caves) it was already possible to move players on foot around most of the islands there.
No, you're not :) They're waaaay to slow to be of good use on the island. Though strategically recruiting them along the way.. mmh I'll sleep over it. That will need some serious re-balancing, though.Chep wrote: I was so looking forward to using my beloved Iron Maulers
I cannot reproduce this "I already searched" message. Reading the code, I can't explain it either. Could you please send me a replay?
The silver armor in the goblin's cave - that was a stupid typo, fixed. Ive also removed the random_traits from the mage. Quick/intelligent makes indeed a lot more sense. Those will come with the next update, soonish. I want to look into re-balacing the East-Again first.
Yep. That is indeed the whole point of this scenario.Chep wrote: ... The level can be quickly finished with the Galleon but why should one? It's nice to have an opportunity to level some mages...
The absolute minimum time here is: 15 turns ship-movement + 3 turns rest at the wreck.Chep wrote:...Or there should be a turn limit (~30 I'd say on Normal)
Arguably true. Turn limits in general are really giving me headaches. With only a few exceptions, the story itself does not impose any time-restrictions. There's no explanation why things should be done within a certain timeframe other than "because that's how BfW works". In hindsight was is a major flaw in the original storyboard and one that will need to be fixed before the 1.0 release.Chep wrote:..Maps without turn limits are just bad campaign design...
regarding the "16. Southern Caves" feedback
1) Yep the bats just add ambience. Without them the eco-system and food chain would not be preserved. Hey, cuttlefish need to eat something after all :)
2) The amount and strength of the enemies increases over time (which is how I intend to work around the missing time limit). To be specific, in turn 12, 20, 25, 30. Also for every defeated enemy leader an extra random sea monster is created per turn.
Same in scenario10 (first dwarf/ship, "Southern Cliffs") there's a message at turn 28 "The ocean is stirring. Beware, those huge waves will drive wilder beats closer to the shore soon.", and starting turn 30 Sea Serpents are added to the mix... This message is not yet in scenario 16.
3) good idea.
Wow! good job in finding the cloak. That's a secret item worthy of a good explorer (there's a story about how it ended up there, but that's for later).
As for the 2nd valve, a small hint: there are tiles common to the land and cave map.
Spoiler:
Re: Roboke's Island
thanks for the answers.
I just started "The Library of Kratemaqht" while waiting for your answer and this campaign also features many levels with no turn limit. However there (just like in your water puzzle) there are no recruit/gold-income options for the player.
Maybe Allowing the player to recruit 1-2 keeps full of units at the start of the scenarios and then removing the keep/income (I dont know how that would work, you'd probably have to set the income from villages to 0 and give the player a decent amount of starting gold) would work for you. This way there is no real downside to not having a turnlimit (however then the amount of enemies that spawn per turn should be toned down).
Regarding time limits: Well every month your quest takes means another sacrifice!^^
--
I'll have a look later if I find a save/replay where the "visited already"-bug occured.
--
For "Reddie": Loyal seems to be a logical trait (considering you freed him from imprisonment!) plus 1-2 useful non-strength-attributes.
--
Southern Caves:
- adding a creature per turn for each killed leader means it would be best to keep the Naga leader alive? Oo
While it is indeed a good effort to balance the timeless map I really do think there should be a unit limit for purple. having 3-4 scuttle fish spawn around your units every 2 turns means you hardly have enough time to remove the poison. Sea Serpents and Nagas could make up a larger portion of the random creatures, imho.
--
East Again, yeah this can be done in ~15 turns, but since it's purpose is to allow you to train mages I suggested making it ~30 turns, giving you over 2 days for the training.
Also: I found Southern Caves to be ideal for Mage-training (however the missing leadership from Roboke hurts a bit): just place them on the mountains south of your keep and fight the sea creatures, retreating to the village whenever necessary. Getting Silver Mages is really really neat for this map^^
I just started "The Library of Kratemaqht" while waiting for your answer and this campaign also features many levels with no turn limit. However there (just like in your water puzzle) there are no recruit/gold-income options for the player.
Maybe Allowing the player to recruit 1-2 keeps full of units at the start of the scenarios and then removing the keep/income (I dont know how that would work, you'd probably have to set the income from villages to 0 and give the player a decent amount of starting gold) would work for you. This way there is no real downside to not having a turnlimit (however then the amount of enemies that spawn per turn should be toned down).
Regarding time limits: Well every month your quest takes means another sacrifice!^^
--
I'll have a look later if I find a save/replay where the "visited already"-bug occured.
--
For "Reddie": Loyal seems to be a logical trait (considering you freed him from imprisonment!) plus 1-2 useful non-strength-attributes.
--
Southern Caves:
- adding a creature per turn for each killed leader means it would be best to keep the Naga leader alive? Oo
While it is indeed a good effort to balance the timeless map I really do think there should be a unit limit for purple. having 3-4 scuttle fish spawn around your units every 2 turns means you hardly have enough time to remove the poison. Sea Serpents and Nagas could make up a larger portion of the random creatures, imho.
--
East Again, yeah this can be done in ~15 turns, but since it's purpose is to allow you to train mages I suggested making it ~30 turns, giving you over 2 days for the training.
Also: I found Southern Caves to be ideal for Mage-training (however the missing leadership from Roboke hurts a bit): just place them on the mountains south of your keep and fight the sea creatures, retreating to the village whenever necessary. Getting Silver Mages is really really neat for this map^^
Re: Roboke's Island
Aah, since you called him "Reddie", well that explains some things. Since v0.9.4 (released Dec/24 2014) he has a proper name and is no longer called that :)
That also explains the bug with the leadership (there was a bug fixed in that version) and to some extent the ease of "East Again" (dramatically reduced village count with a twist).
Just to confirm: You also had "Speedboats" (which are now called "Gaff Cutters").
There was also a bug in earlier 0.8.x about visiting the towns with the dwarf, but that was fixed Nov/2014.
Keeping the Naga (or any) leader alive is a funky trick (I was slightly wrong earlier - when all enemies are defeated, there's an extra random monster every turn, plus one after turn 12, plus two after turn 20,..) Operating each of the valves also (somewhat inconsistently) adds a few. But since players on foot are now in the game that's manageable.
And yes, something will have to be done about the turn limits/gold carryover. but not anymore tonight.
Cheers!
That also explains the bug with the leadership (there was a bug fixed in that version) and to some extent the ease of "East Again" (dramatically reduced village count with a twist).
Just to confirm: You also had "Speedboats" (which are now called "Gaff Cutters").
There was also a bug in earlier 0.8.x about visiting the towns with the dwarf, but that was fixed Nov/2014.
Keeping the Naga (or any) leader alive is a funky trick (I was slightly wrong earlier - when all enemies are defeated, there's an extra random monster every turn, plus one after turn 12, plus two after turn 20,..) Operating each of the valves also (somewhat inconsistently) adds a few. But since players on foot are now in the game that's manageable.
And yes, something will have to be done about the turn limits/gold carryover. but not anymore tonight.
Cheers!
Re: Roboke's Island
![Image](https://blogvonundzulama.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/wesnoth-roboke1.png)
this is the version I have.
and if you meant the Saurian villages...well I don't want to spoil anything for other readers but yeah the villages in East Again were already reduced.
Thanks for pointing me towards that hill tile, I managed to find the 2nd valve (however still haven't found a way to the village behind the chasm).
But it was too late. I opened the 2nd valve on turn 32 or 33. The amount of monsters spawning by the time my brave dwarf wanted to reach the exit was too high and my Merfolk units were just getting slaughtered. (that each turn 1-3 units appeared between the Galleon and the goal post just helped slowing me down which in turn meant losing more Merfolk...) So I debugged myself to the next level after opening the 2nd valve.
Southern Caves is just too friggin hard if you don't know how it works and go about it quickly. Unless you recruit something like 30+ units but all that just to act as bodyguards for the 1 unit that has to move around the map? seems excessive.
--
But that just lead me to "Through the Hills".
I am sorry but that scenario was absolutely pointless in my opinion.
Yet another "move the Galleon around the map"-scenario but this time it just meant getting lucky and getting past the monsters without getting tied down in the narrow waters. Yeay....sure it works in the sense that it decreases the gold the player has from the previous scenario but...thats it. It could have just as easily been replaced by text telling you that the Dwarf & Merfolk are going to the northern part.