1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

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Sire
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1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

Notice: I am not affiliated with the mainline team or any of the ongoing campaign reworks. This campaign was simply made on a whim, and serves as an alternative telling of the existing story.
* * * * *
This is the general feedback thread for A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework. You can download the latest version using Battle for Wesnoth's Add-On Server using the 1.18 branch.
-- For the latest information on this campaign, such as changelogs, please check the latest posts.

The campaign is considered complete. Bug fixes and balance tweaks will be made if needed, but otherwise no further work is planned.
-- If this version is desired to make mainline, feel free to create a copy and make whatever modifications are desired. However, I will likely keep this version separate on the Add-On server.

= = = = = Description = = = = =

A retelling of the story of A Tale of Two Brothers. I have remade the campaign from scratch and tried to remain faithful to its original story. While the number of scenarios are the same, the story and setting has been expanded.

There's honestly not much else to say since AToTB already exists, so if you played that, you should know what to expect.

At any rate, I hope you enjoy my take on AToTB!
Last edited by Sire on August 18th, 2024, 12:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Current Projects: [Red Winter Reborn] || [A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework]
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Sire
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

Version 1.1.0 has been uploaded to the Add-On server! Of note, the final scenario has been made more difficult by an increase in enemy gold as well an an addition of a new enemy faction.
-- This was done as the final scenario was deemed to be "too easy/basic," and it didn't really land the hype for being a final battle. Hopefully this change will make the finale more climatic and enjoyable of a scenario!

As an aside, I have only personally tested the campaign on Normal difficulty. I hope Easy is suitable for new players, while Hard provides an acceptable challenge for Wesnoth veterans. As always, any and all comments/feedback are welcomed!

Version 1.1.0 Changelog
-- Scenario 2 now has a more detailed note about the Elf Leader's death.
-- Scenario 3 now has a note explaining how the two map sections work.
-- Scenario 4 is now harder on all difficulties.
=== A new enemy has been added to Scenario 4.
=== Fixed a bug where Baran would say his lines when Arvith attacked.
Current Projects: [Red Winter Reborn] || [A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework]
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fishrose
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by fishrose »

Excited to try this!
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holypaladin
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by holypaladin »

That's a nice rework of classic story. I would give leadership for Arvith and replace Brena's foolish behavior.
Last edited by holypaladin on June 20th, 2024, 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
„Ad Maiorem Dei Gloriam"
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fishrose
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by fishrose »

I played this and enjoyed it a lot! Personally, I prefer this reworked version over the current mainline one. Unfortunately, I did not have a chance to write detailed feedback because life got in the way; but I still remember many of the key impressions :)

I liked the more well-defined/recognizable personality for Arvith. His younger brother was comparatively less memorable -- probably because we don't spend as much time with him -- but the contrast between the brothers made them memorable as a pair.

I also really enjoyed exploring the map. It was obviously done with care, and many of the details around the brothers' village were excellent for both thematic and gameplay purposes. For example:
Spoiler:
There were a few jarring or silly moments that stuck with me, for which I have these suggestions:

1. In the first scenario, I remember being all hyped up for Arvith to show his men how to take down a ghoul. He had very robust dialogue with much bravado, so I was under the impression that he would have a special advantage against ghouls -- or at least a guaranteed hit for the first charge. As it turned out, he had neither and missed all of his charges while getting hit hard in return. It wasn't a big issue for gameplay, but did elicit big eye rolls from me lol.

Suggestion: give Arvith guaranteed hit for his charge against the first ghoul, so that he would actually succeed in showing his men "how it's done".

2. Dialogues were sometimes triggered without visibility of the person speaking. For example, a key enemy unit in the northwest corner of an early scenario was guarded by two undeads at a river crossing; dialogue with this enemy unit was triggered upon sighting the undead guards, but I had no idea where the speaker was. In the final scenario, the southeast leader also began to speak without the player being given visibility.

Suggestion: grant area visibility around the speaker whenever dialogues are triggered.

3. The entrance to the Dark Sanctuary could become blocked. On my first attempt at that scenario, I spent too much time exploring the (excellently made) map. As a result, enemy units started coming out of the sanctuary. Since there was a single teleport tile, it was not possible to strike enemy units without entering the sanctuary, but it was also not possible to enter the sanctuary while an enemy unit stood on the destination tile. This meant that I had to wait for each enemy unit to come out on their own, resulting in many wasted turns and ultimately caused me to have to restart the scenario.

Suggestion: unsure -- perhaps prevent enemy units from stepping directly on the teleport tile within the sanctuary? Or perhaps a larger teleport area?

4. The many flavour dialogues (triggered by stepping on different map features) were great! The triggers themselves, however, were sometimes easy to miss, as they were all one tile in size.

Suggestion: bigger trigger areas for flavour dialogues, so that players wouldn't miss them.
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Sire
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

fishrose wrote: June 20th, 2024, 8:36 pm I played this and enjoyed it a lot! Personally, I prefer this reworked version over the current mainline one. Unfortunately, I did not have a chance to write detailed feedback because life got in the way; but I still remember many of the key impressions :)
Apologies for the late reply, been feeling rather unwell lately. That aside, I'm glad you enjoyed the campaign!

As for the suggestions...
1. Arvith vs Ghoul
-- Hmm, I could try to raise the Hit Chance for Arvith, or make it a guaranteed hit as described. A part of me wonders how this will impact Hard Difficulty, although I could just have the set chance on Normal and Easy.

2. Dialogues and Invisible Speakers
-- I personally don't mind the "hidden speakers," and revealing their locations would somewhat impact some of the Fog of War/Shroud gameplay.
-- That said, I probably could do it for Scenario Two as he's right there already. The fourth scenario will likely remain hidden.

3. Dark Sanctuary - Block Problems
-- This is a difficult issue indeed. In the end I decided to try and expand the entrance (two more keep tiles that go above and below the interior entrance/exit tile).

4. Flavour Dialogue Triggers
-- The flavour dialogues are typically triggered wherever there are "named locations/map labels" on the map. So, in the first map, going to the "Southern Farmsteads" tile will trigger the extra fluff dialogue. Otherwise, I'm not sure how they will be missed.
-- The only real exception to this (off the top of my head) is Scenario Three with some two bonus books that can be read.

Once again, thank you for playing through the campaign! Hopefully I'll be able to put out the minor update sooner rather than later.
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Sire
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

It's been way, way too long, but the new patch has finally arrived! You can obtain it off of the 1.18 Add-Ons Server!
-- As an aside, any feedback on the gameplay and story are still appreciated, especially on Hard Mode!

Version 1.2.0a
-- Scenario 1, Arvith now properly shows off if he fights the Ghoul/Necrophage.
-- Scenario 2, Bug Fix for Elves as they didn't have Ambush on Hard Difficulty.
-- Scenario 3 now has an expanded entrance to Mordak's sanctum (three tiles instead of one).
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holypaladin
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by holypaladin »

Bug sighted in 1st scenario. If Arvith come too late there is no defeat even if Barran already died
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Sire
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

holypaladin wrote: August 22nd, 2024, 6:44 pm Bug sighted in 1st scenario. If Arvith come too late there is no defeat even if Barran already died
Not sure what version you are on, but the one I have no such bug exists.

I tested this using debug (remove shroud, remove fog, kill Baran, defeat occurs). I also just ran the game without moving Arvith, and when Baran died on Turn 8, it gave the standard game over.

Do you have a replay of this?
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

Version 1.3.0 has been finally released! It is more of a polish patch, so there is no significant gameplay changes for the campaign.
-- I did some basic testing to see if everything works, but didn't properly do another playthrough. Based off of memory, Normal should be okay, but I haven't tested Hard Difficulty.

----- Version 1.3.0 -----
-- Various typos fixed, thanks to Konrad2 for pointing them out!
-- Various Map Changes, Primarily Aethestics
-- Scenario 1: The Deodd sighting now has alternative dialogue if a unit reached Maghre first.
-- Scenario 1: Minor backend code changes referencing Arvith's mercenary company (unit type + side -> role).
-- Scenario 2: Brena is no longer counted as a leader unit (this was an oversighted bug).
-- Scenario 2: Minor Map Changes around Brena's Camp (Deep Water).
-- Scenario 2: The Orcs are now hidden in the UI menu.
-- Scenario 3: The Paladin is mentioned at the beginning if doing the Challenge route.
-- Scenario 4: Enemy Leaders are now hidden in the UI menu.
-- Scenario 4: Story Revisions and Expansion
-- Scenario 4: Reeve Hoban no longer joins at the start of the scenario. He needs to be found.

= = = = = = = = = =
With that, aside from tinkering with balancing and fixing bugs, "AToTB, SR" should be finished. I'll be focusing my attention back to Red Winter Reborn and actually try to finish version 1.0 of that campaign sometime this year.
-- In hindsight, technically there are Achievements missing, and while I could write down a list, I don't know how to code them in. Also, a part of me really wants to wrap up the project and move onto other things, so adding Achievements myself is unlikely.

As for potential mainline status, I'll leave that up to Dalas. I personally don't mind either way (mainlined or remain UMC), but I'm probably gonna take the "hands-off" approach and just let you guys do whatever you want with the campaign. I just hope the campaign proved to be an enjoyable and fun experience!
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Spannerbag »

Sire wrote: August 24th, 2024, 5:15 pm
holypaladin wrote: August 22nd, 2024, 6:44 pm Bug sighted in 1st scenario. If Arvith come too late there is no defeat even if Barran already died
Not sure what version you are on, but the one I have no such bug exists.

I tested this using debug (remove shroud, remove fog, kill Baran, defeat occurs). I also just ran the game without moving Arvith, and when Baran died on Turn 8, it gave the standard game over.

Do you have a replay of this?
I think I might've seen that too, due to a combination of incompetence and bad luck (but mainly incompetence :) ) I spent too long getting to Baran and I think if he is killed by ai forces whilst shroud is still in force (i.e. hasn't been revealed) then it may be there is no defeat.
To be fair I didn't explore fully: the nearby hexes were all swarmed with undead and I restarted - Baran might've been in a village still under shroud.
If I get chance I'll run the scenario with Baran starting on 1 hp but it won't be for awhile due to rl.

I'm playing v1.18.2 on Windows 11, normal difficulty.


Also I'm stuck on scenario 3: Mordak the Mage
[tunnel] doesn't work for my units?
It worked for ai units but when I took control of them it didn't work.
Also restarted the campaign and used debug :n to hop to scenario: still didn't work.
Created a unit in underground area and that couldn't move the other way either.
Tried other bits and bobs but no luck.
Nothing in logs and no errors.
The dialogue triggers (and I tried commenting that out amongst other things).
It seems to be an issue with player controlled units...

I'll nuke your add-on and reinstall - that might work...
...
... Just tried that, used debug :n again, no change.

I don't think it's your WML.
I've deleted a few add-ons and removed my campaigns but still no luck.

Unfortunately I won't be able to spend any more time on this just now.


Finally I think scenario 2 might be a little too awkward for novice players?
A few random thoughts:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
These are my initial impressions: as usual I'm out of time and have to return to rl, sadly.

Hope my witterings help.

Nice campaign, as far as I got.

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag
SP Campaigns: After EI (v1.14) Leafsea Burning (v1.18, v1.16)
I suspect the universe is simpler than we think and stranger than we can know.
Also, I fear that beyond a certain point more intelligence does not necessarily benefit a species...
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Sire
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Sire »

Spannerbag - Baran Bug wrote:I think I might've seen that too, due to a combination of incompetence and bad luck (but mainly incompetence :) ) I spent too long getting to Baran and I think if he is killed by ai forces whilst shroud is still in force (i.e. hasn't been revealed) then it may be there is no defeat.
To be fair I didn't explore fully: the nearby hexes were all swarmed with undead and I restarted - Baran might've been in a village still under shroud.
If I get chance I'll run the scenario with Baran starting on 1 hp but it won't be for awhile due to rl.
Odd, when I tested it on 1.18.0 (Windows 10) I didn't run into any issues. I downloaded the latest stable version (1.18.3) to test, and when Baran dies again on Turn 8 when I don't bother moving Arvith, the defeat screen triggers even though Baran is not seen in the shroud or fog.
Spannerbag -Tunnel Bug wrote:Also I'm stuck on scenario 3: Mordak the Mage
[tunnel] doesn't work for my units?
Also just tested on 1.18.3, no issues. Are you landing on the tile in the hopes of it moving your unit, or are you actually moving between the inner/outer versions of the map using your standard movement points? (Imagine a Silver Mage teleporting between villages, that is essentially how the Tunnel works.)
-- I have a replay showing how it works, although I used debug to make units. It should function without the command.
Spannerbag -Scenario 2 Feedback wrote:Finally I think scenario 2 might be a little too awkward for novice players?
===== Spoiler Stuff =====
Spoiler:
At any rate, thanks for playing the campaign! I hope you'll be able to finish the playthrough someday.
Attachments
AToTB SR-Mordak The Mage replay 20250207-125100.gz
Tunnel Test
(24.03 KiB) Downloaded 4 times
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Re: 1.18 SP Campaign - A Tale of Two Brothers, Sire's Rework

Post by Spannerbag »

Sire wrote: February 7th, 2025, 7:16 pm Odd, when I tested it on 1.18.0 (Windows 10) I didn't run into any issues. I downloaded the latest stable version (1.18.3) to test, and when Baran dies again on Turn 8 when I don't bother moving Arvith, the defeat screen triggers even though Baran is not seen in the shroud or fog.
Guess he was hiding in a shrouded village. :)

Sire wrote: February 7th, 2025, 7:16 pm
Spannerbag -Tunnel Bug wrote:Also I'm stuck on scenario 3: Mordak the Mage
[tunnel] doesn't work for my units?
Are you landing on the tile in the hopes of it moving your unit...
Yep. :doh: :augh: :doh:
Can't believe it never crossed my mind to try and simply move the units "manually" as it were...

Sire wrote: February 7th, 2025, 7:16 pm ===== Spoiler Stuff =====...
Fair enough. :)

Sire wrote: February 7th, 2025, 7:16 pm At any rate, thanks for playing the campaign! I hope you'll be able to finish the playthrough someday.
Will update to 1.18.3 and restart from scratch.

Thanks for your time and trouble.

Cheers!
-- Spannerbag
SP Campaigns: After EI (v1.14) Leafsea Burning (v1.18, v1.16)
I suspect the universe is simpler than we think and stranger than we can know.
Also, I fear that beyond a certain point more intelligence does not necessarily benefit a species...
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