non-castle "keep"

deoxy · Post by **deoxy** » June 4th, 2007, 7:08 pm

Split from another thread.

I suggest making a non-defensive (that is, not "castle") point to recruit from.

Call it a "muster point", for instance - normal grasslands, in terms of defense, but functions as a "keep" for a leader to recruit from.

This could be particularly useful for campaigns (where having a castle lying around might not fit with the story), but it could also be useful for MP maps - "king of the hill" style, for instance, might put a castle in the middle as the ONLY castle on the map, with the players each starting at a non-castle recruitment point.

Biggest difficulty: graphical differentiation. To do this, it would probably be best to have a visually differentiated hex, both for the "keep" and for the "castle" spaces (this second could bee done away with - just allow recruitment to either all 6 adjacent hexes or all adjacent hexes of the same terrain type).

Post by **turin** » June 4th, 2007, 8:30 pm

I'd like to have this. For a lot of scenarios it doesn't make any sense for them to have a castle set up already, and often when that is the case the castle is never the locus of combat, so it not being castle, just a "mustering point", wouldn't make a lick of difference.

Post by **Noyga** » June 4th, 2007, 8:58 pm

Definitely doable through terrain WML.
The problem looks more like the lack of distinct graphics.

Woodwizzle · Post by **Woodwizzle** » June 4th, 2007, 9:52 pm

I think it would be important to distinguish "mustering point castle" tiles from say grassland. Otherwise (if you were simply allowed to recruit in adjacent tiles). Map designers would not have the flexibility with "mustering points" as they would with castles. The amount of tiles you can recruit in and where they are situated has big effects on the balance of the map, and to pidgeon hole designers into only one option would be a real shame since it would limit their creativity. Perhaps if a building or tent tile was used for the "keep" then a simple fence could outline the recruitable area instead of castle walls. It would use the same or very similar WML I bet. Then you could use whatever terrain tiles you want, and the only new graphics needed would be the fence and of course the "keep". Lot less work than making a Grassland Mustering Point, Snow Mustering Point, Forest Mustering Point, Mountain Mustering point... etc. etc.

Also, Mustering point is a horrible name =) But I can't think of much better. Recruiting Station? Or if instead of a building and fence, maybe a magical portal and some ancient structures (think Stonehenge, Easter island, or Obelisks) to outline the area. It could them be called a summoning zone or some such.

Simons Mith · Post by **Simons Mith** » June 4th, 2007, 10:02 pm

I quite like 'mustering point' as a generic term. May I suggest, though, rather than trying to differentiate the terrain in order to make it clear that this is where recruits arrive, you use an icon such as a banner, a flag, a pile of skulls, a great tree, a gallows, or some other graphic overlay as the mustering point indicator. Don't need new terrain then, and something moveable/an identifiable geographic feature makes better in-game sense.

[Edited for clarity: 'turn' should have been 'term']

deoxy · Post by **deoxy** » June 4th, 2007, 10:06 pm

Simons Mith wrote:I quite like 'mustering point' as a generic turn. May I suggest, though, rather than trying to differentiate the terrain in order to make it clear that this is where recruits arrive, you use an icon such as a banner, a flag, a pile of skulls, a great tree, a gallows, or some other graphic overlay as the mustering point indicator. Don't need new terrain then, and something moveable/an identifiable geographic feature makes better in-game sense.

Yay! A smart person comes along and gives us a smart idea.

I like it!

Radament · Post by **Radament** » June 6th, 2007, 7:38 am

nice idea. I like "rallying point" better, though.

Post by **Velensk** » June 6th, 2007, 9:13 am

Rallying point to me sounds like the leader is recovering the moral of disheartend trooops. Mustering points sounds like a place to muster forces thus seems more apt to me.

Post by **Kestenvarn** » June 6th, 2007, 10:24 am

Simons Mith wrote:I quite like 'mustering point' as a generic term. May I suggest, though, rather than trying to differentiate the terrain in order to make it clear that this is where recruits arrive, you use an icon such as a banner, a flag, a pile of skulls, a great tree, a gallows, or some other graphic overlay as the mustering point indicator. Don't need new terrain then, and something moveable/an identifiable geographic feature makes better in-game sense.

Dang, someone got there before me. I was going to suggest a great war standard.

Post by **irrevenant** » June 6th, 2007, 12:09 pm

Simons Mith wrote:I quite like 'mustering point' as a generic term. May I suggest, though, rather than trying to differentiate the terrain in order to make it clear that this is where recruits arrive, you use an icon such as a banner, a flag, a pile of skulls, a great tree, a gallows, or some other graphic overlay as the mustering point indicator. Don't need new terrain then, and something moveable/an identifiable geographic feature makes better in-game sense.

Such an indicator would differentiate the 'keep', but how will the 'castle' hexes be identified? Presumably there's still a limit to the hexes that you can recruit to.

P.S. I like the term 'mustering point' too...

PingPangQui · Post by **PingPangQui** » June 6th, 2007, 12:40 pm

I actually like this idea. We could call simply it simply "Camp" - "Muster point" sounds some how odd to me.

So the recruiting point could be the very same tent we have in wooden castles. One could only recruit units on adjacent hexes, and only if there is "flat" area (grassland, dirt, street etc.).

Simons Mith · Post by **Simons Mith** » June 6th, 2007, 12:45 pm

Either: Hexes adjacent to a 'banner' hex are recruiting hexes. Or: Each 'recruiting hex' is marked with a smaller banner of some kind. In fact, a nice plain simple marker post would probably be sufficient.

The first option could allow for irregular recruitment areas just by using more than one banner - although that would also give multiple 'keep' hexes. If there was a need to restrict the number of recruitment hexes, you'd have to position the banner against some impassable terrain. Option 2 requires some extra graphics but would probably still be preferable.

Troy · Post by **Troy** » June 6th, 2007, 1:03 pm

this was already made though

it was dirt that you could move on and recruit, and there was no need for a keep.

Post by **Kestenvarn** » June 6th, 2007, 1:22 pm

PingPangQui wrote:I actually like this idea. We could call simply it simply "Camp" - "Muster point" sounds some how odd to me.

Why not go with "Rally Point"? Simple, easy to understand.

PingPangQui · Post by **PingPangQui** » June 6th, 2007, 1:27 pm

Ok lets summarize it more clearly.

1.) Only the "keep" (lets call it Camp from now on) will be indicated by a tent, a banner, etc. recruiting will only be possible on adjacent hexes, and only if there is "flat" area (grassland, dirt, street etc.).
Pro: no new graphics are needed
Con: probably more programming work than 2nd idea (not sure though)

2.) The Camp will be indicated by a tent, a banner, etc. Hexes were units can be recruited will be explicitly indicated.
Pro: same pattern as normal castles
Con: graphical work has to be done

I like idea one more than two, as already indicated, since idea two is much more like the usual castle. However the original idea, having a recruiting point "where (not) having a castle lying around", thus a point where has been no time to build even the simplest wooden castle, for instance, sounds more like idea one to me.