WSAS: Milestone Three

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Turuk
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by Turuk »

The next person to make a post in an Art Contributions thread which shows that they have failed to actually read through that thread, highlighted by the fact that their question was already asked, concern already addressed or critique already noted, will be banned from posting in Art Contributions until further notice.


As noted previously, an entire unit line (the Clashers) has been deemed complete without them, so the artists did not miss an entire animation.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by SouthernOracle »

If you are referring to me, I humbly apologize. I have been following this thread, and the new inhale animations. This is the first I have seen of a south-facing fire frame. Perhaps I didn't read the genesis of the drake makeover, but I am not one to ask smart aleck questions when someone has recently asked the same. I genuinely respect all artists being one myself, and I was just curious to the reasoning behind the decision.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

It would have been logical, having seen the whole thread, to have noted that all of the clashers had been committed with their directional attacks sharing most if not all of the same wind-ups (the Warden line had all of them shared, the Enforcer line had one frame of directional wind-up each for the spear anims, cos the change in direction was just too jarring. ]

It's not a huge issue, but it's usually the case that if we commit something, as Jetrel did with the Glider fire animations, and if I post something which you think is odd and Jet posts without saying anything about it, and it's something as major as that... it's probably intended.

EDIT: Jet, re the wings in the inhale: I thought about the motion when I was doing it, and when you raise and move your arms apart, your shoulder blades, to which the wings are attached, move closer together. Moving the wings apart would compress the chest, not expand it. This motion made more sense to me.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by melinath »

Not to mention the minor discussion of why more frames for north are bad...
TSI: About the fire breath. Take a deep deep breath. Do your arms move in or out when your chest expands?
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by Turuk »

melinath wrote:TSI: About the fire breath. Take a deep deep breath. Do your arms move in or out when your chest expands?
He answered this one above when he noted that his shoulder blades move closer together. It's not a matter of in or out, but if your arms are in front of you and you take a deep breath, they are going to move backwards, which is what he meant by them moving apart from each other in front of the body.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by melinath »

Turuk wrote:
melinath wrote:TSI: About the fire breath. Take a deep deep breath. Do your arms move in or out when your chest expands?
He answered this one above when he noted that his shoulder blades move closer together. It's not a matter of in or out, but if your arms are in front of you and you take a deep breath, they are going to move backwards, which is what he meant by them moving apart from each other in front of the body.
No, he didn't answer this... what he said was
thespaceinvader wrote:EDIT: Jet, re the wings in the inhale: I thought about the motion when I was doing it, and when you raise and move your arms apart, your shoulder blades, to which the wings are attached, move closer together. Moving the wings apart would compress the chest, not expand it. This motion made more sense to me.
He *thought* about it. He didn't try it. Of course this would be hard, since he doesn't have wings...

TSI was saying that if you raise your arms and move them apart, your chest contracts. Which is true. But this is because your shoulder blades (to which the wings are attached) move closer together. So the wings moving together on the inhale implies closer shoulder blades, which implies smaller breath. Wings moving apart == shoulder blades moving apart == bigger rib cage space == bigger breath. Apologies. I was unclear and cryptic, even though TSI's complained about other people doing that recently.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by Turuk »

melinath wrote:No, he didn't answer this... what he said was

----

He *thought* about it. He didn't try it. Of course this would be hard, since he doesn't have wings...
Actually, I know for a fact that he did physically try to emulate it as best he could, which would be to the same limitations you have as well, unless you suddenly sprouted wings?

melinath wrote:TSI was saying that if you raise your arms and move them apart, your chest contracts. Which is true. But this is because your shoulder blades (to which the wings are attached) move closer together. So the wings moving together on the inhale implies closer shoulder blades, which implies smaller breath. Wings moving apart == shoulder blades moving apart == bigger rib cage space == bigger breath. Apologies. I was unclear and cryptic, even though TSI's complained about other people doing that recently.
He said that moving your arms apart, moves your shoulder blades closer together to which the wings are attached, thus meaning that the wings move closer together on an inhalation.

Your shoulder blades go back slightly when you take a deep breath, which makes for bigger rib space, which means that in making a bigger breath your shoulder blades would be both moving upwards and back. You are making the assumption that the shoulder blades are being pulled all the way back.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

Melinath, please don't tell me what I didn't do. When i sit or stand up straight with my arms loosely in front od me, and take a deep breath, my arms and shoulders move up, out and back. The wings are attached to the shoulder blades which move up, IN and back, since the shoulder blades move in the opposite direction to the shoulders when you move the arms. Therefore, I think the wings ought to move up, in and back with the shoulder blades - it leaves the ribcage more space, and makes more kinematic sense. But I prefer to wait and see if Jetrel agrees with me.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by Jetrel »

thespaceinvader wrote:Melinath, please don't tell me what I didn't do. When i sit or stand up straight with my arms loosely in front od me, and take a deep breath, my arms and shoulders move up, out and back. The wings are attached to the shoulder blades which move up, IN and back, since the shoulder blades move in the opposite direction to the shoulders when you move the arms. Therefore, I think the wings ought to move up, in and back with the shoulder blades - it leaves the ribcage more space, and makes more kinematic sense. But I prefer to wait and see if Jetrel agrees with me.
:augh: Lots of drama in this thread, eh?

I think the question of kinematic accuracy can arguably go either way, and side-by-side, I think the wings moving outward looks better. I think most of the upper body should visually 'dilate' in order to make the impression of inhalation look more powerful.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

Fair enough, I'll make that change. When I get home from work, of course. And I've had lunch. And a shower...

*swooning melodramatic sigh*
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

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thespaceinvader wrote:Melinath, please don't tell me what I didn't do.
You're right. Sorry. I'll try to avoid doing this in the future.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

Not to worry. I probably came down just a little hard, but this sort of thing has been happening a lot recently. I guess that's what happens when we innovate. It's worth remembering, by the way, that when I say I've thought about a motion or movement, what I usually mean is that I've thought about it, then got up and done it to the best of my ability in the space available. Just to clarify.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

Bumpery - prelminarily completed burner frames - all of them apart from flying.

EDIT: I call the burner complete, now, pending final discussions with jet of course.

Frames attached.

EDIT: Complete set of Sky Drake frames, not yet including melee attack, since that's not finished.

EDIT: new version, forgot the defence anims.
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burner.zip
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by thespaceinvader »

Bumpery. New lines/flats for Burner. To explain the colours a bit, the light orangey stuff is going to be ceramic, possibly glazed, definitely decorated. The yellow is bronze, mostly bronze wire to hold the ceramic on to the leather base - I used wire rather than any form of specifically manufactured fixing because the caramic is likely to need constant replacement (they'll have moulds at home...) since well, it's ceramic, and you don't want to be constantly replacing buckles and things like that when you can just hold it on with twists of wire. The brown is leather, the red is cloth.

I might put in a little bit of fire effect visible inside the mouth, too, at the end. if it doesn't look too corny.
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Re: WSAS: Second milestone begins

Post by Valkier »

Rather than have fire coming out of his mouth, which I don't think is possible to do without it being corny no matter how good you are, is maybe have a bit of a fire swirl within his eyes? Not smoldering up out of them or anything, just maybe a fire-like effect as the color of his iris. This would also give you an excuse to make a cool orangy glow around his eye area, but that may just be me being a sucker for lighting.

My only crits about him at the moment is the hand on the left seems to be in a bit of a mid movement, either going to clench or unclench his fist. Personally, I'd like to see his hand open and tense with some angry looking claws ready to clash someones throat out, but if you're happy with what you got then it may work out just fine in the end. Also, it looks like you intended for him to be in a walking type pose? If that's the case, my second crit would be to make his other arm look like it's swinging back a bit further. All you'd need to do is make the top part of his arm look foreshortened, and then bring his forearm up a bit and show some hand. Keep in mind if you do this however, you may want to change the perspective of the shoulder guard to be angled a bit more towards us to match the arm movement.

Either way, this one seems to be looking pretty strong so far.
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