My Terrain (Mine!)

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doofus-01
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

zookeeper wrote:I'm not sure. :hmm: On one hand, the simple posts are kind of nice, but if you have nothing but them, it's maybe not clear enough what they are. On the other hand, the masts/crosses work better individually, but if all of them are like that, it might also look weird... and I think they'd need some further alteration (not that I have specific ideas) to make them look a bit less like a perimeter of literal crosses since that might cause it to seem like... a graveyard.
Maybe just using tall rocks would work instead, using the same macro? This example just has two quick variations (and these rock rims are all probably too white right now).
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ForestDragon
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by ForestDragon »

umm, why were my two previous posts ignored? :?
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doofus-01
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

Moving the walls in seems like it might be a good idea. Makes it look more like an overlay, a la the tents or thrones in regular camp and dwarf castle. Need to fix the wood peeking out under the stone rims though.
wercamps-WIP-stoneposts2.jpg
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ForestDragon wrote:umm, why were my two previous posts ignored? :?
We're trying to work this out. People can have constructive input, but there is no need for a general lecture on how keeps are supposed to work.
EDIT: Sorry if that sounds mean, but I don't know what else to say.
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zookeeper
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by zookeeper »

doofus-01 wrote:Moving the walls in seems like it might be a good idea. Makes it look more like an overlay, a la the tents or thrones in regular camp and dwarf castle. Need to fix the wood peeking out under the stone rims though.
Yeah, good idea. :hmm: It looks better that way.

Would those be done as wall/corner tiles, or as regular transitions? If as regular transitions, then convex corners (such as 150,140 in your screenshot) wouldn't be completely covered, but in practise that might not be an issue at all. If as wall/corner tiles, then maybe it'd be simpler to just bake in both the stones and posts into the same tiles and have 2 variations of each one (or no variations at all if they're not actually necessary). Up to you, I'm just thinking out loud.

Actually I'm not sure at all how some parts would work. The stones and posts can be done easily, but I'm not sure how to do the wooden base when it's shrunken like that. The wood can't simply be included in wall/corner tiles, because then the lower slices would obscure units. On the other hand, that's nothing more than a layer number issue and would be easy to solve. Anyway, as said I think it's a good idea, so if it needs some new macros or something then I'll gladly write them.
ForestDragon wrote:umm, why were my two previous posts ignored? :?
Well, I suppose simply because no one agreed, and since you're not directly involved, no one felt the need to say so and/or argue about it either.
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doofus-01
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

I thought these were done, but I'm noticing now that the east corner is clashing with the pillar, so I'll fix that before posting the little PNG images. But I think the brightness is OK now?

I also wanted to ask if a little flame variation would be a good idea (animated of course). Even if the RNG decides to make a clone cluster, like the two-hex thing on the right, it doesn't look that bad.
zookeeper wrote:Would those be done as wall/corner tiles, or as regular transitions? If as regular transitions, then convex corners (such as 150,140 in your screenshot) wouldn't be completely covered, but in practise that might not be an issue at all. If as wall/corner tiles, then maybe it'd be simpler to just bake in both the stones and posts into the same tiles and have 2 variations of each one (or no variations at all if they're not actually necessary). Up to you, I'm just thinking out loud.
They are regular transitions. I think the chaotic nature of it allows some leeway.
zookeeper wrote:Actually I'm not sure at all how some parts would work. The stones and posts can be done easily, but I'm not sure how to do the wooden base when it's shrunken like that. The wood can't simply be included in wall/corner tiles, because then the lower slices would obscure units. On the other hand, that's nothing more than a layer number issue and would be easy to solve. Anyway, as said I think it's a good idea, so if it needs some new macros or something then I'll gladly write them.
I include some blue haze and some reef-pebbles in the outside of the stone rims, it covers the wood. (I think it's working.)
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by vultraz »

Just a small critique: the contrast seems really low on the interior floor area; it seems quite washed out.
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zookeeper
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by zookeeper »

doofus-01 wrote:I thought these were done, but I'm noticing now that the east corner is clashing with the pillar, so I'll fix that before posting the little PNG images. But I think the brightness is OK now?
Seems okay to me.
doofus-01 wrote:I also wanted to ask if a little flame variation would be a good idea (animated of course). Even if the RNG decides to make a clone cluster, like the two-hex thing on the right, it doesn't look that bad.
I... don't really know? Visually little flames of course look nice, but an aquatic encampment is about the last place I'd expect to see them. I'd recommend spurts of water instead, but those might seem way more magical than simple fires.
doofus-01 wrote:They are regular transitions. I think the chaotic nature of it allows some leeway.
Yeah, shouldn't be a problem for the stones.
doofus-01 wrote:I include some blue haze and some reef-pebbles in the outside of the stone rims, it covers the wood. (I think it's working.)
Right, but then it'll also cover the water. And it might be problematic when meshing with the camp walls, I couldn't say. In any case, if you do have separate files for all elements like that, please post them too, so I can restructure things if necessary.

P.S. I'd suggest less jpg compression on your screenshots, or simply using png for small ones like these. The details become a fuzzy mess when zoomed in.
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doofus-01
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

vultraz wrote:Just a small critique: the contrast seems really low on the interior floor area; it seems quite washed out.
That was intentional, and seems right to me, since it's all waterlogged.
zookeeper wrote:... don't really know? Visually little flames of course look nice, but an aquatic encampment is about the last place I'd expect to see them. I'd recommend spurts of water instead, but those might seem way more magical than simple fires.
Well, I was thinking that everyone who might use this has metal, so they have to have fire. Since the fire could be set to only burn at night, the outlaws would appreciate the drying warmth (in the wet, clammy night) and the lawful merfolk would appreciate the light. But if it brings some cognitive dissonance, then perhaps we should just forget about it. If someone wants fire, they can use a campfire.
zookeeper wrote:Right, but then it'll also cover the water. And it might be problematic when meshing with the camp walls, I couldn't say. In any case, if you do have separate files for all elements like that, please post them too, so I can restructure things if necessary.
If it's translucent, it shouldn't be too obvious - at least it seems OK to me as I look at the wave motion. A blue clash with the camp walls should be similarly avoidable, though I might have missed some instances. As for the separate element images, I did have them once, but past a certain point, I merge layers as I get tired of the switch-image-change-layer-whoopswronglayerundotryagain clickfest.
zookeeper wrote:P.S. I'd suggest less jpg compression on your screenshots, or simply using png for small ones like these. The details become a fuzzy mess when zoomed in.
I was worried about mobile bandwidth, I have no idea why, in this case. Not sure if "spoiler" tag helps in that regard, in general, but in case it does...
Spoiler:
This is the WML I used for the stone borders, I wasn't sure what layer was best.

Code: Select all

{TRANSITION_COMPLETE_LF    (Cme)       (Kme)    0  pool_edge  castle/merfolk/camp-new/keep-rim}
camp-new.tgz
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ForestDragon
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by ForestDragon »

i like the idea with fires, but as zookeeper said that they don't fit in water envieroment, i think maybe phosphorous lights will fit better (the animation will maybe be pulsing (aka growing and then shrinking, and then again...)) btw, maybe you can make the stone circle less hexagonical, and more circular, maybe?
keep up the good work :D
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by zookeeper »

I'm working on it. Might take a while, I'm not sure what all I need to tweak.
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

I've got a really minor "contribution"... At least in BfW 1.13.4, the reef/deep water transition looks terrible with the new water graphics (especially grey variant with {UNDERGROUND} time-of-day). I think the blue pixels were the biggest problem, using the images in the attached file makes things look better to me. A real set of transitions might be better ultimately, but for now...
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by doofus-01 »

I started what I think is an improvement on the (wooden floor)/(chasm) transition. The current (wooden floor)/(flat) transition images won't really work, but I'm thinking something similar with more of a vertical dimension that just overlays the chasm rock images (earthy chasm in the attached image) would work. But maybe something else should replace the chasm walls, especially if there is some transition that isn't chasm that could also benefit (possibly water?). Don't worry about the small details just yet, I only penciled most of the needed images in for now.

The little three-hex "v" thing at the bottom edge of the image is the current transition status, which I can't imagine is useful to anyone. It could be considered a bug, as this is not that silly a transition case.
screen-shot image
wood-chasm1.jpg
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by bumbadadabum »

I like this.
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ForestDragon
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by ForestDragon »

me too, also, it's nice to know doofus is back in action :)
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Re: My Terrain (Mine!)

Post by FelixMage »

It looks awesome, like the floor is really being consumed by the abyss, really atmospheric.
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