YEESSSSSS!

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 10th, 2005, 8:36 pm

Ankka wrote:You mean you loaded the start save for the scenario many times? Why would that be cheating?

Not really cheating, just collecting biased results. Lucky sequences are more likely to win, so if you farm sequences, the one you win with will be a lucky one, which is not really luck because that was what was guaranteed to happen anyway. Thus, my 'luck' was more like 'optomization'.

PDF wrote:Tell me : how do you level up those darn Elvish Shamen ? Mine always get killed, and I don't understand how they can gain sufficient xp to level with their awfully weak attacks (3/2 ...)

The Valley of Death is helpful, surprisingly. If you have a leader, especially, (Konrad L3 or a Marshal, preferably) then they do a real decent amount of damage to those Revenants and level up quick. In general, it's as easy to kill any one unit with them as any other, so waiting until late scenarios with level 2 enemies can give advantage.

Also, recruit a load of them. With a horde, you have plenty of low-damage units to help optomize the enemy's HP for a kill (especially if you can regulate it with leadership.)

Awkward Syntax wrote:Heh... I'll have to watch that sometime. Good luck with The Lost General...

Lost General is being a bunch harder than I expected, for two reasons:
1) It's not safe to let a Dwarvish Fighter (except if it's Resilient and not Quick) be attacked by so much as two of those Orcish Warriors, and that's pretty hard to achieve. (I'll be fighting in the hidden south tunnels[1] with the undead, and there I can send one unit at a time and not be able to be attacked twice. The Orcs are the problem.)
2) The results with the allies are really random. I end up with anywhere from one to six Warriors opposing me, so I never know how much force to recruit.

[1]: One of the worst pieces of WML in HttT, (along with the hidden gold in PITD,) there aren't even any hints as to their existence, and they're very useful. Hidden things are worse than surprises, because they can go unnoticed, while surprises cannot.

Ankka · Post by **Ankka** » January 11th, 2005, 8:04 pm

In the Dwarven Doors he had awesome luck, a hero (IIRC) was about to die, about 1 hp left and two units attacked him but missed.

Some people have awesome luck. Sometimes you gotta love it. It gives the little nice randomness to games.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 11th, 2005, 9:45 pm

Ankka wrote:In the Dwarven Doors he had awesome luck, a hero (IIRC) was about to die, about 1 hp left and two units attacked him but missed.

Some people have awesome luck. Sometimes you gotta love it. It gives the little nice randomness to games.

Yeah. One of my premises for good playing is "If you're getting defeated, rely on luck!" It's really useful when it works, much better than optomizing your effeciency. This is becuase it's better to have a 33% chance of winning and a 67% chance of losing than a 100% chance of almost winning, and similar situations.

Another nice battle tactic is "Enter as a coward at night and recklessly win in the Day", which works because you wear down the enemies at first, and then day comes at the crucial point in the battle, the point at which it's being decided. Then, you can use the "Recklessly kill everyone" strategy without worrying so much about the remaining risk.

Actually, the "Recklessly kill everyone" strategy combined with the "Rely on luck when losing" is an extremely powerful tactic. I often defeat enemies of almost twice my force who are surrounding me with these methods.

They tend to work less well against human enemies, though.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 17th, 2005, 9:36 pm

Ha! I beat the Sceptre of Fire!

It wasn't actually difficult. Which scenarios are difficult really fluctuates between normal and this mode.

For instance, I didn't had five Elvish Avengers, four Elvish Champions, two Elvish Sharpshooters, a Silver Mage, a Dwarvish Lord, and two Instant Dwarvish Lords (steelclads who need 1 XP) last time I got to Snow Plains, did I? That makes some things much easier.

On the other hand, when you're forced to use cannon-fodder, it's much harder to win without using cannon fodder, eh? Fortunately, there were other ways to win Dwarven Doors, Lost General, and Siege of Elensefar...my three major challenges so far. (Even Bay of Pearls was easier... and if I were to try it again at my current skill level, I would probably not even have to save/load.)

The Sceptre, now, the difference between now and last time I played it is that I was using two super-duper stupid exploiting strategies. (I was also more skilled and had more levelled units...)

The first: My force was split into two groups: A large group, and a tiny group. The tiny group (6 L1 dwarfs, Konrad and Kalenz) made a complete barricade across their passage, with Konrad behind it. The other group kept to the tunnel walls, always letting there be a complete path with no ZoC's on it from one end of the tunnel to the other. All the enemies saw only one way to reach Konrad, so they usually took the 'open' passage.

The second: The large force was mainly a hoax. I would have needed about half as many units to defeat the enemies. The force was excessive because I recruited as many units as possible, to get as many Resilient dwarfs as possible. The added benefit was that the enemy saw a huge amount of units, even though most of them were often not actually able to attack, but since the AI thought they could, it was scared off.

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 17th, 2005, 11:00 pm

So, I beat Snow Plains, and I'm on to the Home of the North Elves...

I aim to come out of the upcoming scenario with the following plethora of level 3 units:

5 Dwarvish Lords
5 Elvish Avengers
4 Elvish Champions
2 Silver Magi
2 Elvish Sharpshooters

and maybe 5 champions instead of 4, or 3 sharpshooters instead of 2, or maybe a Shyde.

Ankka · Post by **Ankka** » January 18th, 2005, 4:12 pm

Pretty impressive... you're halfway through. At least IIRC the number of scenarios here...

I'll just have to try HttT again now. Just to see how far I get.

I guess I just have to be a little more careful with my units so I don't lose for instance a paladin to a troll or something...

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 18th, 2005, 7:45 pm

Ankka wrote:Pretty impressive... you're halfway through. At least IIRC the number of scenarios here...

Elves Besieged
Blackwater Port
Isle of Anduin
Bay of Pearls
Muff Malal's Peninsula
Siege of Elensefar
Crossroads
Princess of Wesnoth
Valley of Death
Gryphon Mountain
Ford of Abez
Northern Winter
Mountain Pass
Dwarven Doors
Plunging Into The Darkness
The Lost General
Hasty Alliance
Sceptre of Fire
A Choice Must Be Made
Snow Plains

Home of the North Elves
Valley of Statues
Return to Wesnoth
Test of the Clans
Battle for Wesnoth

I seem to be 4/5 of the way through, not 1/2.

Ankka wrote:I guess I just have to be a little more careful with my units so I don't lose for instance a paladin to a troll or something...

I wouldn't worry about that. Paladins resist impact and have comparitavely strong melee vs. trolls. I would worry, though, if you decided to risk a paladin by charging against a troll...

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 31st, 2005, 9:59 pm

Well, Bay of Pearls in Hard, as in Easy, appears to be of nigh-impossible difficulty.

I beat it last time, didn't I?

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » January 31st, 2005, 10:50 pm

For those interested, here's my latest replay.

What lost me the game was my mistake in recalling the Druid too early, which gave the Orc the chance to recruit the two Warriors that killed Konrad.

Simons Mith · Post by **Simons Mith** » February 1st, 2005, 1:24 am

[EP] When you get to the end of this quest of yours, I challenge you to complete the entire campaign using only your recruits from the first scenario. And if you can manage that, how about trying it from the Bay of Pearls onwards with only mermen.

Ankka · Post by **Ankka** » February 1st, 2005, 8:23 am

I think the best challenge would be to beat the campaign without recruiting a single unit...

Let's see... you get the horseman in Balckwater port, the mage at the isle of anduin... and some mermen at the bay of pearls.

Oh, and that white mage at the isles of the damned if you go there..

Elvish_Pillager · Post by **Elvish_Pillager** » February 1st, 2005, 10:12 am

Simons: Six units, even level 4 units, cannot win the Battle for Wesnoth.

Ankka: You lose in the Lost General if not before.

Ankka · Post by **Ankka** » February 1st, 2005, 1:43 pm

Elvish Pillager wrote:Simons: Six units, even level 4 units, cannot win the Battle for Wesnoth.

Ankka: You lose in the Lost General if not before.

I didn't even think it was doable... for instance the Siege of Elensefar would be propably impossible. Unless the mermen get really lucky..

Simons Mith · Post by **Simons Mith** » February 1st, 2005, 6:16 pm

[Ankka] No recruits at all other than freebies? Ouch, that certainly trumps my idea for the ultimate impossible challenge! On the bright side you'd probably die rich.

Elvish_Pillager · February 12th, 2005, 12:52 pm

Well, I'm in the middle of a Bay of Pearls game, winning, but I've gotten myself in a *really* bad state of mind doing it, and can't finish at this time.