Old Friend - beaten...

[hs1]

Hi everyone,

avid player, first-time poster - I just beat the "Old Friend" map from the "Northern Rebirth" campaign on the second-last turn.

• I survived the insane reinforcements the surviving opponents get when one of their fellow Generals kicks dust;
• I survived the 40+ goblin riders that appear when you cross some invisible line in the sand;
• and I survived the heartbreaking losses of several of my best and most battle-hardened units.

Well, and since the strategy guide for the map bluntly states...

This level is not possible to win by beating the leaders in the time available.

... I felt like bragging

Cheers,
hs

[Soliton]

What difficulty and where's the replay?

I'm usually a couple turns late on the highest difficulty level.

[TheGreatRings]

I'd very much like to see a replay, and particularily I'd like to know what your recruits were and what your recall list was like. I vaguely remember this scenario and how horribly unwinable it was in terms of actually killing the enemy leaders, and I'd like to know how you managed to pull off a victory.

In any case, congratulations, I guess. You are clearly a much, much better player than I am.

[HomerJ]

[acronym=Replay or didn't happen]RODH[/acronym]


Greetz
HomerJ

[hs1]

I played on 1.7.2 in (I believe) the second-hardest of four difficulties.
Replay file attached...
The file has some weird errors though, starting from approx. turn 7 - dang...

But anyway, you can see the general tactic:

• First, I had a break out of my fastest units; my plan was a) to prevent the enemy from reaching the northern hills and b) setting up shop there myself (worked almost perfect). This gave me the advantages of a) occupying the villages and b) taking the brunt of the first attack wave in favorable terrain.
• Then, I brought in all (!) level 2 and 3 units to stage my counter-attack (time being the most important resource in this map)...
• ... and finally swarmed the place with newly recruited footpads (dozens of them literally - money no object after plundering the treasury in the previous map). This was a crucial part of my overall strategy - after finishing off the first attackers, I occupied all mountain tiles with footpads and dwarves, thus greatly reducing the number of appearing goblin knights, who just couldn't spawn there.
• After turn 3 or 4, the enemies had spent all their gold and could only recruit 2 or 3 new units per turn. This was part of my second major strategy element: I carefully avoided triggering one of the two events that would have given the opponents virtually unlimited money: a) Killing one of the enemy generals and b) crossing an invisible line that additionaly spawns the goblin knights.
• Instead, I overran the secondary enemy bases (again, without touching their generals!), occupying their keeps and thus neutralizing the later gold inflow; they just couldn't spend it when it came in...
• I sent a considerable force against the primary enemy from the far east - from there, they can approach quite far without triggering the goblin knights.
• At this point, I had occupied all central mountain tiles with footpads; so, when the goblin knights approached, I was positioned in the center as well as on all flanks; I had surrounded the enemy without even moving...
• Element of luck: Ralshak - the main opponent - left his keep (remember, he was basically out of gold) and I managed to block his way back with a fast fugitive; the goblin knights were triggered, Ralshak became awash in gold but couldn't reach his keep, I fought my way through the knights as fast as I could and did it just in time to reach Ralshak and bitchslap him with Tallin's Rod of Justice and others.
• Another major help: I still had the bonus units from previous maps - crazy Arch Mage, Krash the drake, friendly wraith, Elvish druid; and they really meant business, taking names on their own and even healing my units.

I'd very much like to see a replay, and particularily I'd like to know what your recruits were and what your recall list was like. I vaguely remember this scenario and how horribly unwinable it was in terms of actually killing the enemy leaders, and I'd like to know how you managed to pull off a victory.

In any case, congratulations, I guess. You are clearly a much, much better player than I am.

It was horrible and it was unwinnable the first times I played it... But the method detailed above should work in most cases; I don't think that I am an especially good player - I was just seriously miffed that this map beat the crap out of me each time, so I developed a plan that was built on speed, firepower in the right places and lots and lots of expendable units... And hadn't Ralshak left his keep for a cigarette break at the right moment, it still wouldn't have worked.

Cheers,
hs

[HomerJ]

I cannot check the replay right now but since you give a good explanation for your victory... Good job!

How about adding this to the Campaign Challenges Thread


Greetz
HomerJ

[Soliton]

• Instead, I overran the secondary enemy bases (again, without touching their generals!), occupying their keeps and thus neutralizing the later gold inflow; they just couldn't spend it when it came in...

Ah, I usually kill both generals at the same time so the bonus wouldn't help the other one but since Rakashas also gets a bonus that is indeed a good idea.

PS: I've made Rakshas a passive leader now so he won't leave his keep again.

[hs1]

• Instead, I overran the secondary enemy bases (again, without touching their generals!), occupying their keeps and thus neutralizing the later gold inflow; they just couldn't spend it when it came in...

Ah, I usually kill both generals at the same time so the bonus wouldn't help the other one but since Rakashas also gets a bonus that is indeed a good idea.

PS: I've made Rakshas a passive leader now so he won't leave his keep again.

AARRGH! My beautiful battle plan lies shattered in the dust...

This means war (well, duh)! I'll take up the fight again until I find another weakness
Can I download the amended campaign somewhere?

[Soliton]

Can I download the amended campaign somewhere?

You can just add "passive_leader=yes" in Rakshas' [side] [ai] tag. (http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth/trun ... 6&r2=37635)

[hs1]

Can I download the amended campaign somewhere?

You can just add "passive_leader=yes" in Rakshas' [side] [ai] tag. (http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth/trun ... 6&r2=37635)

Alright, I'll dive into that!

Can I change the attribute in mid-game, or do I have to start the map all over? Or worse, the campaign?

[Soliton]

Can I change the attribute in mid-game, or do I have to start the map all over? Or worse, the campaign?

If you can find the place(s) to change in your savefile you can change that otherwise you have to start at least from the start-of-scenario savegame.

[hs1]

PS: I've made Rakshas a passive leader now so he won't leave his keep again.

HA!



Okay, it was a little tricky, but this works:

• Basically, I used the same tactic as above, with following modifications:
• I upgraded my far eastern expeditionary force to a full battle group and stuffed it with all the big guns.
• I especially put in all flying units - drake, shyde, wraith. If I have to make a house call at Rakshas' place with only two regular entrances, I'll want to bring in everything that can cross the deep water (mixed results, though: I jumped too early, and shyde and drake had to stay on the moat; the wraith made it across, though, and saved the day by giving Rakhas the coup de grâce - phew!)
• The central force is now mainly my footpad army, mingled with some dwarves, fugitives et. al. to give that group a backbone. When my eastern force triggers the goblin knights, I just rush them in with full speed ahead and more or less only try to bog down the goblin knights with my central army.
• Coordination is crucial: I almost blew it when I had to use the great mage and some other top-notch units for mop-up operations and couldn't rush them in on Rakshas. Fortunately, Tallin himself was still available and could reach him. This almost played out as a major SNAFU: Tallin's Rod of Justice misfired constantly on the well-covered enemy, and it took me two rounds and a little wraith help to take that scalp... The great mage with his magic attack is preferable here.

Unfortunately, the replay file is corrupted again - is this a 1.7.2 beta issue? Can I turn some screws and repair it somehow?

[HomerJ]

Unfortunately, the replay file is corrupted again - is this a 1.7.2 beta issue? Can I turn some screws and repair it somehow?

As it seems, replays get corrupted when you loaded a savegame at some point, even a turn1 save that is.


Greetz
HomerJ

[Soliton]

As it seems, replays get corrupted when you loaded a savegame at some point, even a turn1 save that is.

No, that's only for multiplayer replays.

[HomerJ]

As it seems, replays get corrupted when you loaded a savegame at some point, even a turn1 save that is.

No, that's only for multiplayer replays.

Is that for sure? Because I have a campaign replay that is corrupted and I recall to have loaded the turn 1 autosave instead the beginning of scenario save. Could be coincidental though.

Greetz
HomerJ