Scenario 13: Dwarven Doors

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Scenario 13: Dwarven Doors

Post by Content Feedback » December 7th, 2005, 4:06 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Last edited by scott on March 19th, 2006, 2:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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dtw
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Post by dtw » December 8th, 2005, 12:28 am

scott wrote:I know Dwarven Doors has problems. I request that you playtest the SVN version of the scenario, which I have also attached to this message. Just drop it in your game directory (wesnoth/data/scenarios/Heir_to_the_Throne/).
What changes have you made scott? I have not played the whole scenario but I can see that my troll suggestions have not made it :D
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scott
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Post by scott » December 8th, 2005, 12:59 am

I located your sceptre of fire ideas but not those for dwarven doors. There's only 1 major change, which is that you don't know where the exit is when you start. Someone had already scaled back the AI gold. I diddled with the other parameters a little but nothing major. I want to experiment with different ways of increasing the urgency throughout the level, but it won't happen until other scenarios are treated first.
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Post by Ravenheart » December 8th, 2005, 1:33 am

(1) Just completed Medium.

(2) Pretty easy if you know what you are doing.

(3) Very clear, get to the caves (although i recently started Wesnoth and have already done easy so i knew already, but even then it was very clear as to what i was supposed to do)

(4) I still think the dialog for all of the game needs a lot of work :). Seeing as there were no inter-scenario peices of dialog the story was just straightforward and not much to look at.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?


(6) 10, very fun. Required considerable thought and stratagem to complete profitably and with style.

(7) Less obvious hold out points, just a tiny bit less forest and potential terrain, altogether longer route please!

(8 ) 356

(9) 6

Overall a very well done scenario, id like to see some, well, better dialog :roll: and a longer course to make it more of a challenge. The orcs are the only guys hot on your heels and only when you are two turns away from finishing. The terrain of course is key, alongside screening units, distracting forces etc. But terrain most of all, i think it was overdone just a bit - make it more of a challenge, less trees!
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dtw
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Post by dtw » December 8th, 2005, 8:44 am

scott wrote:I located your sceptre of fire ideas but not those for dwarven doors. There's only 1 major change, which is that you don't know where the exit is when you start. Someone had already scaled back the AI gold. I diddled with the other parameters a little but nothing major. I want to experiment with different ways of increasing the urgency throughout the level, but it won't happen until other scenarios are treated first.
They are here - I thought you had posted in the thread but of course we can't all remember what threads we posted in!

Also my sceptre of fire stuff is here - just to ensure we are talking about the same thing :)
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Post by scott » December 8th, 2005, 3:23 pm

It wasn't even that long ago. :?
Anyway, the funneling concept sounds good to me. I want to make sure I hit all the scenarios before 1.1 comes out then I'll come back to this one. Hopefully there will be some good reviews by then.
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Post by Becephalus » December 10th, 2005, 2:04 am

medium 1.02 (I played the version that is in 1.02 not sure if that is the same as the version at the top of the thread).

8

fairly clear

moderately

Deciding betwen running for it and fighting. After three failed attempts at running for it (lost delf or kalenz 1 to 2 turns before victory each time) I decided to fight it out. Lost that twice due to kalenz or delf dying, but third time was the charm (lost 2 lvl 1 untis and 1 lvl 2). I won with maybe 3 turns left so it was tense and kalenz had maybe 10hp left after taking on blue leader with just a white mage for backup.

9

I think the map shoudl be all snow and spruced up a bit (see my comments in the northern winter thread). I also think the yellow guy could use a bit more gold and blue a bit less, but maybe i'm wrong about that. I sent delfador a lancer, haldiel (paly) and one elvish rider to yellow and killed him while the rest of my army (another 14 units or so) was needed to hold off blue and green. So taking out yellow with a four unit holding force was a surprise.

837

13 lvl 3, 6 lvl 2 (not counting delf/konny/kalenz)
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Post by Dacyn » December 10th, 2005, 7:48 pm

(0.8.3)
1=Easy
2=6
3=um... no? :wink:
4=msg11_1 does not show up
Uncle Somf: 'niece'(msg11_17c); what if it is male? :)
Are the variables "killed_enemies" and "unclesmuggler" going to be used again?
5=turn limit
6=5
7=IMO it would be better if the entrance were not blocked; I don't like levels with one-time secrets, and I think Konrad would be able to see that the entrance was blocked from the beginning.
8=1263
9=14

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Post by scott » December 10th, 2005, 8:14 pm

The dwarven doors config file attached to the first message is NOT the one that comes with 1.0.2. It is the one currently in 1.1, and I am most interested in feedback for that file. If you are using 1.0.x, you can download the config file and drop it into the HTTT scenarios directory to use it. Thanks.
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Skippy
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Re: Scenario Review: Dwarven Doors

Post by Skippy » March 18th, 2006, 8:41 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Medium, 1.1.1 (also 1.0.2)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Of itself, not so much - 3. But with the gotchas at the end it's a pain - see below.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear in spirit, but in practice its completely unclear where you should go.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Relatively interesting.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Pick a door, any door - sorry! Wrong door, you die!

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
2

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
If you run, which most people will, you are in no position to change your target after you find that you chose poorly. Gotcha!

(8 ) How much gold did you have at the start of the scenario?
~450

(9) About how many higher level units did you have in your recall list? Don't list them out.
Lots , 10-15?

Comments: I played it in 1.0.2 and got caught by the gotcha when you get to the main entrance (didn't get any advice from Uncle). I played 1.1.1 and got some advice and followed Uncle whoever's advice and got caught by the gotcha trying to go through the mine. Thanks a lot uncle. Basically this scenario generates the same feelings as Sceptre of Fire generates only this one is quicker (thank heavens for small mercies). Can you get rid of the gotchas? There is no way to recover from them in this scenario.

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Re: Scenario Review: Dwarven Doors

Post by scott » March 18th, 2006, 11:35 pm

Skippy wrote: (5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Pick a door, any door - sorry! Wrong door, you die!

Comments: I played it in 1.0.2 and got caught by the gotcha when you get to the main entrance (didn't get any advice from Uncle). I played 1.1.1 and got some advice and followed Uncle whoever's advice and got caught by the gotcha trying to go through the mine. Thanks a lot uncle. Basically this scenario generates the same feelings as Sceptre of Fire generates only this one is quicker (thank heavens for small mercies). Can you get rid of the gotchas? There is no way to recover from them in this scenario.
So you're saying the uncle gave you advice and you followed it, but it was wrong? If so, that's a bug. Could you tell me what his advice was or post a replay?

I don't have it in front of me right now, but the nature of the problem could be better described in dialog. Sometimes the mine is right, and sometimes the door is right. The advantage repeat play gives you is that you know to scout ahead. Therefore, we'll tell the player this in the beginning. But, if there are bugs in how this works I need to know.
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Skippy
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Post by Skippy » March 19th, 2006, 1:41 am

I don't have a replay - sorry. Nonetheless, I will try to replicate it.

When I first played it again I got told to go to the main entrance and that was the correct place to go. This has made me doubt my reading skills the first time through. I am, nonetheless, 80% confident that I was told to go to the mine and when I got there was told that it was blocked. I reached the mine with Konrad first.

I don't know WML, but a quick read through the scenario file didn't reveal any obvious flaws in its logic that would apply in my particular game.

We'll see if I can replicate this.

EDIT: I've tried a few more times through and can't seem to replicate my initial experience. So, I should change my review to something like:
I much prefer the new arrangement - I really disliked the gotcha in 1.0.2. I still worry what might happen if you don't have an outlaw type unit in your party.

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Post by drachefly » March 20th, 2006, 6:57 pm

Well, you can still send up an elvish rider to see if the main door works. Still, that's an army slot you won't be using for something beefier.
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Post by sparr » March 21st, 2006, 11:14 pm

the doors actually worked for me once. was that random or did i trigger some condition or what?

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Post by Shakiko » March 27th, 2006, 10:39 pm

1) medium 1.12a

2) I chose to run, not to fight, so it was "just" the effort to keep my trrops alive while Konrad runs for it --> 4

3) I guess pretty clear - found the bandit hiding, he pointed out the exit ...thats it

4) Its nice - a nice twist... but i have to admit that I dont know remember from playing on easy diffivulty what happens when you choose the wrong door ^^;

5) Troop choices - As I decided to run for it but didnt want to buy cannon fodder to protect Konrad I had a hard time choosing between the right balance between fast troops to help in the beginning and resilient trrops to fend off the onslaught from 2 sides for 6 turns while Konrad was escaping.

6) 9
Lots of choices how to play the scenario, lots of different terrains allowing different troop chioices = :D
And on top of that i really enjoyed it that its like one of two scenarios where the first clash with the histlie armies actually happen during DAY =)

7)
None... imho its perfect the way it is


8) 511 Gold

9) w/o Storylinecharacters: 26 Advanced troops

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