Scenario 9: The Valley of Death

[secal]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.6.5 - easy (1st time 4 me)

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
depends upon difficulty and your objective:
surviving on easy: 2
killing all liches on easy: 6

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
clear, with one exception: the holy water flasks should be explained to new players

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
clear, average dialog and storyline

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
As I played on easy I decided to hunt all liches down. The major challenges for me were deciding:
-Which troops to recruit?
-Where to send them to confront the enemy?

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
I had much fun playing it - 8.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Hmm, difficult question. I found the Skeleton Archers very mighty, as one of them may blast 45 points of damage into you at night. But that may be OK. I think the scenario is well done.

----

As mentioned above I killed all 3 liches in round 9 in an open battle (no assassination). There were no enemy units left on the field, and I had lost only one inexperienced non-loyal elven archer by then (see attachement).
OK, after all, I played it on easy. And it cost me around 550 gold

[Sam-Lloyd]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Challenging 1.8.1

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It's quite confused about the holy water, the rest is ok

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Attract the hordes of undead and let the assassination team do the job in time

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
9, I found it's very interesting and pressing all the time

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The mage from Isle of Damed is totally useless here

[Ineluki]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Challenging 1.8.2

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
It's ok

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Everything was a major challenge in this scenario

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7, It's fun but I had to repeat it so many times to figure a strategy that works and it was a little bit frustating.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
So many Wraiths and those chocobo skeleton things make the scenario harder than it should be, in my opinion if the AI recruited less fast units the scenario would be funnier and easier.
Killing the 3 liches is very hard (in challenging difficulty) and it doesn't have any reward, I killed them all in turn 10 with an army of shamans at the woulds acting as a decoy, with knights armed with holy water killing the liches and with the help of Moremirmu and his mages.

[Eleazar]

in 1.9 the holy water no longer seems to give units arcane melee attacks (or if it does, no part of the interface is aware of it). The damage preditced for my holy-water knight is identical to another knight with the same traits.

[BubbleScreen]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Medium, 1.6

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario?
8: you need leveled units to break into the southern castle, but you also need to protect these assets from the waves of undead. I don't think I had a very imaginative strategy (run for the south with my main army, send off a couple knights to wreak havoc with holy water, leave a token diversion force to hold the central woods).

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I think you should spell out Holy Water a little more. And explain why it is there. And why there is a really vast amount of undead in the middle of "civilized" Wesnoth.

More importantly, explain why the turn limit changes everything. There is quite possibly a substantial undead army breathing down your neck by the end. Maybe the Undead can only survive for a brief time (which resolves the above problem). I understand killing the Liches is supposed to be a difficult puzzle for the best of players, but a canon explanation for why our party does not pursue them at the end of the scenario is lacking.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Breaking into the southern base quickly, protecting leveled units (Kalenz, I'm looking at you), avoiding the zombie chain of death

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is?
9

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

[roman_sharp]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

Normal, 1.8.2-1.8.3

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

8

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Crystal clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Good.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Come to "attack, don't defend and survive" conclusion.
Defeat one enemy army before the next one come close
Deal with level 2 undead
Capture the villages to not get big minus on money

Maybe this scenario was created with idea to get the player sacrifice some units and/or all money - but I didn't get it.


(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

8

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Increase turn limit a bit (2 turns?) for player to get some gold for defeating the liches.

[Jozrael]

Keep in mind that increasing the turn limit makes the scenario massively harder for those just looking to survive. I'd recommend increased additional rewards; perhaps some unit or gold or other tangible benefit.

[Orcus_Christ]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

(1) Medium. Version 1.8
(2) 8. I only managed to kill one of the liches. I'll keep trying, until I crush them all!
(3) Crystal.
(4) It's alright.
(5) Surviving wave after wave of the undead, while trying to destroy the liches.
(6) 7. Fighting off hordes of the undead is always fun.
(7) None.

[Moriturus]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.8.5 Hard
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4, 2 Grand Knights with holy water and Palladins leaves no chance to undead
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Perfectly clear!
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear, but not very interesting
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Avoid losing important units
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
NEED MORE UNDEAD!!!

[Ferox]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Easy on 1.9.1
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Crystal
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Clear, yes. Interesting, no.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Getting the last lich (north). I needed one more turn to defeat him with Delf.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
None.

[GMastaMath]

(1) Medium on 1.8.5
(2) Difficulty - 7
(3) Instruction Clarity - Clear.
(4) Clear - Very, Interesting - Yes (Storyline), Could have been better (Dialog).
(5) Major Challenge - Eliminating all 3 Liches, while having all units survive with Delfador used only to weaken and not kill. (Was successful in all of these on Turn 11).
(6) Very Fun.
(7) An outcome change for killing all three Liches (perhaps finding a Lich Weapon or Congratulatory Dialog from Moremimu to Konrad)

Strategy used: Rush East with all units and eliminate Eastern Lich, push NW a little bit to meet NW Lich troops first, Stand Ground in N while units from S and NW converge, Rush three units both NW and S to eliminate both Liches. Liches will make tactical error by exiting their keep to meet your troops on the field.

[GagarinGambit]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
Hard, 1.8.4

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8, it's the most difficult scenario so far.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Crystal

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The dialogue is very good during the first few scenarios, but I get the feeling that gradually it becomes poorer and poorer. Not that it's bad (it's fine, and it does its work), but many scenarios offer the opportunity for very good dialogue/storyline, but it's average at best. In this case, for instance: why do the undead retreat after two days? What are they doing in the middle of Wesnoth? Why doesn't anyone mentions Lisar (after all she suggested going north)? Etc...

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping the key characters alive. You can't afford to hold them back, but no matter how good you place them, a couple of lucky attacks can take them down; the undead chargers in particular are a pain. In general, I use the save-reload cheat only if a key character dies (no point replaying from the beginning if a lucky attack kills Konrad or Delfador). I had to do it 2-3 during all the past scenarios combined, but for this scenario alone I had to reload a total of 2-3 times.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
9, very fun. It's a good challenge, and I love the feeling of having to survive a siege. If only the dialogue were better, it would be absolutely perfect.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Dialogue, see above.

[shadowblack]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
1.9.4, Normal

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8 because I wanted to not lose any unit above level 1 and kill the Liches; if I had been willing to lose high-level units or not kill the Liches (or if I had just recruited a few more level 1s since I had the money) it would have been easier

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Fine

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Not losing any units above level 1. There were a LOT of undead and most of my forces were on 40% def, so this proved harder than it looked

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8 – I had sufficient forces, so the battle wasn’t too hard, and killing all three enemy leaders was very satisfying

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Hard to tell. With enough gold and units to recall it’s not too hard, but not everyone will have the right units…

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
My carelessness in the placement of units resulted in unacceptable deaths, so I had to replay a few turns.

Thoughts:
This was definitely the hardest scenario so far. Fortunately the enemies did not recruit any Chocobones, so I didn’t have to worry about enemies charging my low-defense and low-HP units. Not spending all my gold and recruiting a few more meat shields caused me some trouble in the second half of the battle, but not too much. And it was very satisfying to kill all enemies instead of just surviving.

[Maiklas3000]

(1) What difficulty level and version? Challenging (hard); 1.9.5; 275 starting gold
(2) How difficult? (1-10) 8. Surprisingly less difficult than expected, due to past experience.
(3) How clear? Clear.
(4) Dialog? Fine.
(5) Challenges? With only 275 gold, it's not possible to field both a large army and a large diversionary force.
(6) How fun? (1-10) 9
(7) Changes? None.
(8) Restarts/reloads? A couple of restarts from start due to death of critical units. No save-reloads here or earlier in the campaign.

Replay attached. Graphically, here was my strategy:



In words, I sent a five unit diversionary force to the forest to the northeast, while my main army moved southwest to kill the Lich there and take his position for defense. This is pretty standard for this scenario, except that my diversionary force was so small, due to lack of funds. Even so, I got a short-lived Hero and Druid out of those five brave raw recruits! Meanwhile, a loyal Champion got the holy water in the northwest, while a Horseman picked up the holy water in the southeast. The Champion single-handedly killed a couple units as it struggled to return to the main army, while the Horseman succeeded in only an easy killing blow. It may be that the Horseman's arcane-enhanced attack did not do extra damage, as per a post above, but I did not pay close attention. I killed the southwest Lich, and I didn't try to kill the other two. So, it really wasn't that hard, though poor Kalenz got down to 1 HP in one turn from full health after a long onslaught of Walking Corpses backed up by Revenants. The lesson learned is to not line up at the edge of the hills but rather further back, so that the Walking Corpses can't move far.

[Faello]

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?

Challenging (Champion), 1.9.6, no saves/reloads, 341 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

5.

I don't think this scenario deserves a lot of meritorious feedback. Li'sar convinced our naive heroes that "northern path is safe" or smthng like that and ofc it wasn't. Player is ambushed and no matter how much gold he has, it won't be enough against a combined 1440gp UD high level army mixed with tons of walking corpses. Best way is to rush Galga (Lich, blue, [SW] keep) asap and recruit strong anti-UD force ( I recommend to recruit as many lvl1 mages as you can get together with your strongest anti UD loyal units). Once blue UD is finished, you can defend in his castle and pray for low chocobone efficiency.

Not that difficult, but quite annoying scenario.

10 losses, 45 kills.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Crystal clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Ok, nothing exceptional tho'. I was laughing hard when HttT heroes discuss at turn 12/12 that UD finally gave up their assault, while I was already almost overwhelmed by them

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Keeping my veterans alive.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

3.

I hate being forced to one, correct tactic and I don't like the "Run Forest, run!!!!" type of scenarios. Alternative objective is obviously for some wannabe lancer save/loading-assasins.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

There's nothing that can be done. This scenario lives it'ss own, miserable life

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

One restart, no saves/reloads.

Replay attached: