Scenario 6: The Siege of Elensefar

Feedback for the mainline campaign Heir to the Throne.

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Post Reply
User avatar
Content Feedback
Battle for Wesnoth
Location: #wesnoth @ chat.freenode.net
Contact:

Scenario 6: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by Content Feedback » September 24th, 2004, 2:21 am

(1) What difficulty level and version of Wesnoth have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Mainline Campaigns: Scenario FeedbackDevelopment & Overall Feedback
User-made Add-ons: Feedback

User avatar
turin
Lord of the East
Posts: 11662
Joined: January 11th, 2004, 7:17 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by turin » September 24th, 2004, 2:25 am

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
easy, medium.
Dave wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6. most difficult scenario so far, IMHO. (plus, i haven't played it for a while, and i heard it got even harder. :shock: )
Dave wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very... just defeat both enemy leaders.
Dave wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
i don't get how you travel to elensefar by boat if its not on the ocean... maybe there should be a river, or at least a suggestion of a water route to the ocean?
Dave wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Keeping Konrad alive when i sent him out to give people leadership.
Dave wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6. Hard, but pretty fun.
Dave wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

maybe decrease difficulty a tad... not too much, though, or else its not interesting. At this point in the game, i think the user is ready for a challenge.
For I am Turin Turambar - Master of Doom, by doom mastered. On permanent Wesbreak. Will not respond to private messages. Sorry!
And I hate stupid people.
The World of Orbivm

hiryuu
Posts: 26
Joined: September 24th, 2004, 9:00 am

Post by hiryuu » September 24th, 2004, 9:26 am

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Easy, Medium

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7. Took a few attempts and lost some good units, even then.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very clear -- kill the leaders.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Fine.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The undead (which the fighters/archers can't really handle) reaching me while I was still dealing with the orcs (which mages & healers can't handle).

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
5. Most of the others have some rules or more varied terrain. This is pretty much a 'big army moving forward' map. The thieves, while cute, had few hit points and little damage (even backstabbing). They didn't even make good fodder against these enemies.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
As turin said, dial it back just a hair. Maybe a smaller castle or less starting gold for the center boss, so he doesn't have so much level 2 stuff to send your way. Perhaps the thieves should be level 2, where they'd be more effective.

User avatar
Elvish_Pillager
Posts: 8129
Joined: May 28th, 2004, 10:21 am
Location: Everywhere you think, nowhere you can possibly imagine.
Contact:

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by Elvish_Pillager » September 24th, 2004, 9:27 am

(1) Easy, Medium, Hard
(2) 7
(3) Quite
(4) Very
(5) Not remembering to recruit enough/correct units...
(6) 6
(7) no idea
It's all fun and games until someone loses a lawsuit. Oh, and by the way, sending me private messages won't work. :/ If you must contact me, there's an e-mail address listed on the website in my profile.

Dacyn
Posts: 1855
Joined: May 1st, 2004, 9:34 am
Location: Texas

Post by Dacyn » September 24th, 2004, 10:21 am

1=Easy
2=9
3=very
4=very, but I don't understand the part with the thieves... if there is no disadvantage in accepting, why is there an option? I think the thieves should defect sometime :twisted:
5=rangers dying
6=4
7=The long march to Muff Jaanal is boring; maybe he should surrender once you have won the main battle?

Integral
Posts: 244
Joined: December 14th, 2003, 9:36 pm
Location: Pennsylvania

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by Integral » September 24th, 2004, 2:41 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7

This is one of the trickier scenarios, but not especially frustrating.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Perfectly.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The dialog with the thieves should be a real choice. Personally, I like the idea of giving the user a choice between two different units, but that might make later scenarios hard to balance.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The huge number of assassins that the orcs recruit make this level very hard if you don't have any units with "heal" yet. Similarly, getting past the skeletons can be painful if you don't have second-level mages (and worse if you don't think to recruit any mages).

Aside from that, the main challenge is just defeating the "first wave" of attackers without losing valuable units.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
10
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Since I gave it a 10, obviously not many :-).

Daniel

Integral
Posts: 244
Joined: December 14th, 2003, 9:36 pm
Location: Pennsylvania

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by Integral » September 24th, 2004, 2:42 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7

This is one of the trickier scenarios, but not especially frustrating.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Perfectly.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
The dialog with the thieves should be a real choice. Personally, I like the idea of giving the user a choice between two different units, but that might make later scenarios hard to balance.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
The huge number of assassins that the orcs recruit make this level very hard if you don't have any units with "heal" yet. Similarly, getting past the skeletons can be painful if you don't have second-level mages (and worse if you don't think to recruit any mages).

Aside from that, the main challenge is just defeating the "first wave" of attackers without losing valuable units.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
10
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Since I gave it a 10, obviously not many :-).

Daniel

hellerup

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by hellerup » September 27th, 2004, 10:24 am

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Medium

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8. It's pretty difficult allright.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear enough - kill the leaders.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Ok, but as some of the other post say, the bit with the thieves is less than optimal, since there is really nothing to gain by saying no.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Crossing the moat I think. My tactics usualy end up with me in a good defensive possition in the mountains and the orcs fortifying the castle. I then have to attack with units standing in water to create empty spaces in the castle, so I can get inside. I thought this was a particular cool feature of the map - it actually felt like attacking a fortified city. Oh - and the undeads charging up from the south forcing you to hurry up, just made it better and more intensive.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
10 - one of the best in the campain I think.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
None I guess - even though the enourmous amount of assasins the orcs recruits sometimes makes it very difficult. Assasins are pretty deadly and their high defensive values makes them very diffucult to kill with anything but mages or marksmen - and they get poisoned when they attack.

ott
Inactive Developer
Posts: 838
Joined: September 28th, 2004, 10:20 am

Post by ott » September 28th, 2004, 12:11 pm

Relative to wesnoth-0.8:

(1) Levels: medium, easy, hard


(2) Difficulty: 6

(3) Objectives: clear

(4) Dialog/storyline: clear.

EDIT: as pointed out, thieves are available whether or not any of the original three survive.

(5) Challenges: keeping my horsemen from being killed by skeletons after taking out the undead leader.

(6) Fun: 7

(7) Changes: the AI doesn't recruit to the weaknesses of one's army; if you have lots of healers the AI will still recruit assassins instead of crossbows or grunts. The undead leader is too vulnerable to attack by knights (travelling along E boundary of map, W along the bottom edge, then into the castle), and this removes most of the sting of the skeletons, since many return to the castle instead of advancing north, and are then slaughtered by the knights while reinforcements arrive.
Last edited by ott on October 2nd, 2004, 12:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Dacyn
Posts: 1855
Joined: May 1st, 2004, 9:34 am
Location: Texas

Post by Dacyn » September 28th, 2004, 12:38 pm

ott wrote:thieves can be recruited later if and only if at least one thief survives the scenario.
I don't remember anything like this...

daloser
Posts: 17
Joined: September 13th, 2004, 2:26 pm

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by daloser » September 29th, 2004, 9:32 pm

Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
1 - E
2 - 6
3 - Clear
4 - Alright, but I had no idea that ya need to keep at least 1 thief alive so that you can recruit more until I read this topic.
5 - Rushing to kill the Orc leader and then getting slammed by the skeletons. Once you learn to send a force north and around the lake to draw out the orcs, be a little careful, and recruit/recall a lot of mages, tis not so bad. I hate those assassins though.
6 - 8
7 - Not much, I like this one alot. Maybe clarify the whole thief subject.

Glowing Fish
Posts: 855
Joined: October 3rd, 2004, 4:52 am
Location: Portland, OR
Contact:

Post by Glowing Fish » October 4th, 2004, 11:36 pm

1. Easy
2. 8 or 9. This is the scenario that I had to turn around and go back to the beginning of the campaign, because I hadn't properly leveled up my units. This is the first campaign that you need Level 2 or 3 units to win.
3. Very clear, a straight forward attack of the enemies.
4. The storyline makes sense, besides I think the story about the orcs and undead forming an alliance was made because of the scenario designer wanting the two as a tactical challenge, not the other way around.
5. Mostly, time. Oh and money. (not enough money or time...just like real life!) The first time I won it (the second campaign) was on the last turn. In my third campaign, I won it four turns early. You don't really have any units yet that can effectively deal with the skeletons, yet.
6. 7 or 8. Although it gets a -4 when all your forces get cut up and poisoned!
7. I might include more villages closer to your starting castle, so you can continue to recruit throughout the game. Also, maybe give it 4 more turns.

pjr

Re: Scenario Review: The Siege of Elensefar

Post by pjr » October 11th, 2004, 3:16 am

(Comments based on 0.8.4)
Dave wrote:(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
Easy, medium.
Dave wrote:(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
7
Dave wrote:(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Very clear.
Dave wrote:(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I can't remember any dialogue. Either there isn't any or it isn't very memorable.
Dave wrote:(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Resisting the fatal temptation to attack at night.
Dave wrote:(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
6
Dave wrote:(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Perhaps either the map or the AI's behaviour could be changed so that the two enemies' forces don't mingle. The orcs are far more difficult to beat than the undead, and I find that the big fight against the undead always happens in and around the central castle, Once this battle is won, the undead leader is left as a rather boring afterthought, taking up a couple of turns when victory is certain. Maybe he could summon reinforcements (like Lis'ar in a later scenario) when the orc leader is killed?

whynot
Posts: 4
Joined: January 3rd, 2005, 3:14 pm
Location: Wiesbaden (Germany)
Contact:

Post by whynot » January 3rd, 2005, 3:26 pm

1: medium
2: 10
3: clear, as every objective
4: the storyline is fine so far, the dialogues are sometimes a little long... for guys who just want to play... nevertheless i support this dialogues, because they give sense to the game, in contrast to many ego-shooting-games
5: to stay alive and to avoid frustration
6: 8, less fun and more challanging
7: it should be more balanced. If you have not much gold or high levelled units you are without chance. Often the enemy-units have only 1 point left. Is this just random ?! the orcish leader too had only 1 point left and was surrounded with 6 units of mine. I had to fight him 2 rounds to steal his last live point. It looked to me as if there was a machenizm which made the orcish leader harder to fight while his live was nearly over...

and 8: i must say i had to cheat to solve this level. :oops: After having played it more than 20 times (and always seen my units being slaughtered by the mighty orcs) i gave up and cheated about 3.000 gold to have a VERY big army and to have a chance to win. Okay, cheating is not the way this level should be solved, but without it i would have given up and wouldn't have seen the other scenarios...

STEFAN aka whynot

Awkward Syntax
Posts: 4
Joined: January 4th, 2005, 6:27 am
Location: Michigan

Post by Awkward Syntax » January 4th, 2005, 6:43 am

Hi, I'm new... nice to meet you all[/size]

1. Easy.

2. Oh, I'd say 6, 6.5.

3. Crystal.

4. Not incredibly stirring dialouge.

5. Keeping all my units alive. I hate losing units. Especially experienced ones. Didn't much care about the thieves, though.

6. I'd say 6 or 6.5, now that I know what is a gigantic 15-minutes-spent-reloading mistake.

7. I have no ideas.

Post Reply