[Historical] Orcish campaign

[benj]

Unfortuanately this scenario is incompatibale with latest CVS I do not know why, but it spoiled the game and game does not want to run. SUrely this matter will be soon looked intom probably matter of writing correct game.cfg and terrain.cfg as they have evolved since the time benj has done they're parrarel versions.

In fact, editing game.cfg is not needed anymore as Dave kindly said me how to do that more cleanly. New versions of the campaign don't need this anymore.

Look at http://wesnoth.slack.it/?SonOfTheBlackEye and http://wesnoth.slack.it/?UserScenarios for archive of new version + installation instructions. You may have to remove old files from orcish campaign.

Dave: It might be good idea to try to add a fuction to "manually" load scenario/campaign from file, so that you won't have to edit game.cfg
Of course this would give support only to units and terrains and images already in-game. I think it may be not worth effort to add support for loading campaigns with additional tiles and units.

You can already add units and images, but you have to clutter their files. Perhaps it would be intereesting to work out a way to put all this in a separate directory like scenarios/Foobar/images, scenarios/Foobar/units, etc... to make upgrading easier.

I'm to submit a feature request for this, but sorry if there is a way I don't see.

[methinks]

I was thinking about it but actually I see no reason for it, as new/additional images won't be availble for other campaigns (would have to be dupliacted). I think it is good the way it is now.

Also, updated installation instructions on http://wesnoth.slack.it/?SonOfTheBlackEye

[quartex]

The third level looks cool, but am I correct that there is no dialog text yet at the beginning of the mission? Or did I make a mistake in installation? I have a pretty good idea of what I am supposed to do anyway.

I liked the chief having the shaman picture better and I though having to protect a weaker magical unit made it more challenging (perhaps too challenging). But with the new orcish witch doctors I can see why you made the picture change, and having more than 15 hp means he can fight more himself.

[Insinuator]

I just downloaded and installed the orc campaign, and have beat the first two levels, but on the third, what am I supposed to do? First of all, Gruu died and nothing happened, the game played on even though one of the defeat conditions was his death. Secondly, where is the exit? I went to the end of the silver road. Nothing happened. I went to the other end of the road, and 4 level 4 guys popped up. How do you win? Please RSVP soon. I like the scenario though all-together, and The Siege of Barag Gor is a catchy name.

[benj]

I just downloaded and installed the orc campaign, and have beat the first two levels, but on the third, what am I supposed to do? First of all, Gruu died and nothing happened, the game played on even though one of the defeat conditions was his death. Secondly, where is the exit? I went to the end of the silver road. Nothing happened. I went to the other end of the road, and 4 level 4 guys popped up. How do you win? Please RSVP soon. I like the scenario though all-together, and The Siege of Barag Gor is a catchy name.

This scenario is almost done but I need to do dialogs that give hints on how to win
You are supposed to move the three pilgims to the end of the dirty road, near the farm (yellow village). Then move Kapou'e there. The three pilgrims should disapear as they hit the end of road, but there is a "bug" in my cfg file that prevent that. Just pretend they disapear

it appears that I haven't catched Grüü's death in scenario right now, but it is to be corrected. Thanks to both you and quartex for your comments.

Btw I will completely finish this scenario on tomorrow

[quartex]

It's nice to see campaign developers working to create more non-standard scenarios. The main compaign is great, but does tend to be a lot of kill the enemy missions. I remember the same thing happened with the warcraft series, originally most levels were just kill all enemy units, but they worked on developing more original missions as the series progressed.

Rescuing and escorting units, civilians, healing areas/temples or gates you must guard all look to be interesting ways of making levels more diverse. On a related note, I also think it would also be great to see a unit that can shoot over several hexes. It would greatly change the strategy (and perhaps for the worse), but it would be interesting to experiment with such a unit and see how it changes the game. I can imagine an orcish catapult, which would be slow, and pretty weak, but could target a unit 2 or 3 hexes away. A unit like this might be able to do a lot of damage, but would have to be carefully protected against horseman and other fast units.

[miyo]

Snowy hils and forest has been committed in CVS by Dave, hopefully this helps with Orcish campaign (at least makes enabling the campaign easier for users).

- Miyo

[Feldegast]

Nice idea with Grüü, but maybe a bit too soon for such a strong level 2 Troll to be available, eh?

A great opportunity to let the player choose between one of two followup scenarios. One could be a mission with Grüü's father asking for your spontaneous help to rescue some trolls held as slaves by humans in a nearby copper mine. [Alternatively a mission to kill some beasts in the mountains which threaten a nearby village.] This could be offered after the Orcs bragg about their courage and strength and that they would protect Grüü well.

Btw, is it possible yet as a reward to alter a unit's attributes, e.g. increase HP or XP a bit?

[benj]

Nice idea with Grüü, but maybe a bit too soon for such a strong level 2 Troll to be available, eh?

Well, consider this unit is unique, as in scenario 3 you will be able to recruit only trolls whelps. Grüü is a hero that will follow Kapou'e during all the campaign, like Delfador or Kalenz. Grüü is lvl 2 troll but his death will result in a defeat in all scenarios, so this unit should be taken care of. And Grüü can't compete with Delfador, a lvl 5 mage !

A great opportunity to let the player choose between one of two followup scenarios. One could be a mission with Grüü's father asking for your spontaneous help to rescue some trolls held as slaves by humans in a nearby copper mine. [Alternatively a mission to kill some beasts in the mountains which threaten a nearby village.] This could be offered after the Orcs bragg about their courage and strength and that they would protect Grüü well.

Nice idea. My priority at the moment is to make scenarios for the main trunk of the campaign, but as they will be made, I will add branches like this one. I like the idea of Kapou'e helping trolls so that they help him after, very interesting as I wanted to add some social antagonism between trolls and orcs, who are allied but a little bit distrustful each other.

Btw, is it possible yet as a reward to alter a unit's attributes, e.g. increase HP or XP a bit?

You mean : this scenario has been beated, so we increase the HP of a character? I don't know if this is possible.

Cheers,
Benjamin

[Feldegast]

You mean : this scenario has been beated, so we increase the HP of a character?

More of a reward like the Flaming Sword in "Snow Plains". An event upon reaching a specific location on the map (e.g. a village where a mighty Mage lives), maybe also as a result of a dialogue, where you pick one of your units and it receives an increase of HP or XP as a reward for accomplishing a mission or part thereof. E.g. think Mermen in Bay of Pearls. When you open the cages, they are free. Now imagine you open a cell in a cave where a great Orc Leader was imprisoned. You could receive a special item, gold or improve the HP/XP of one of your characters slightly (think receive some "training" from the great Orc).

[Dave]

Well you can use the [object] tag to put down items that when picked up will give the unit that picked it up special bonuses.

A more general system that allows giving the unit that matches a certain [filter] tag bonuses would be good.

The actual bonus system is capable of giving a unit almost any bonus one would want to give it....except for assigning it new abilities (so e.g. a ring of regeneration is currently not possible).

David

[Lysander]

I just played the Orcish campaign, with the Jan 09 windows snapshot. In scenario 2, Towards the Mountains of Haag, the Trolls that shows up attacked me! Same happened in the third scenario, the Orc guardians killed off the Priest Doctors before I could do anything to protect them.

Don't know if this a bug in the .cfg files, or some change/bug in CVS version.

[turin]

i just want to comment on this earlier post (i am not responding to the above post)

On a related note, I also think it would also be great to see a unit that can shoot over several hexes. It would greatly change the strategy (and perhaps for the worse), but it would be interesting to experiment with such a unit and see how it changes the game. I can imagine an orcish catapult, which would be slow, and pretty weak, but could target a unit 2 or 3 hexes away. A unit like this might be able to do a lot of damage, but would have to be carefully protected against horseman and other fast units.

But if a unit can only move 6 hexes a turn, and a turn is about 4 hours, then how far would it actually be shooting? catapults MIGHT work. i am not sure how far they shoot in real life. but i would think it would have to shoot over a mile, which they could not do.

[benj]

I just played the Orcish campaign, with the Jan 09 windows snapshot. In scenario 2, Towards the Mountains of Haag, the Trolls that shows up attacked me! Same happened in the third scenario, the Orc guardians killed off the Priest Doctors before I could do anything to protect them.

Don't know if this a bug in the .cfg files, or some change/bug in CVS version.

Yes, this was a change in CVS. Now fixed.

See http://wesnoth.slack.it/?SonOfTheBlackEye for newer snapshots

[quartex]

Lets not get too hampered by reality here turin. In terms of range, a unit like a trebuchet could certainly throw rocks at least a mile, it was one of the longest and largest of the medival siege machines.

However why can't we strech out imagination with some magic, magical catapults could throw as far as you want. Now if a hex is really a mile long, then perhaps it takes several hours for the unit to find all the enemy units in it's range (by sending out magical scouts and the like) that would explain why it might take several hours to find the target, align the catapult and fire.

Anyway, I think we shouldn't take the distance and time requirements too seriously. I don't know how long a turn is, or how long one day is wesnoth is in actual time. And I think a catapult type unit that could shoot over multiple squares would add a lot to the strategy.