Kanzil's poetry

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Kanzil
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Kanzil's poetry

Post by Kanzil »

After a brief hiatus from coding my masterpiece, I composed a twelve verse epic for it, written by Dróthriel the great, describing Methurdil, situated in the Lins-elens, fairest of all elven cities and the place where the Ka'lian first sat,though burnt down in the first Great War. Here are the first two verses:

Splendid standard flutters high
And the wind does melancholy sigh
Great portcullis guards the gate
Though nature's long assault does not abate.

O Methurdil! O Methurdil!
Wreathed by river, hid by hill
O Methurdil! O Methurdil!
Though ages pass thou standeth still.

Any comments?
Last edited by Kanzil on October 16th, 2012, 4:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
High over valleys in the red levelling rays -
In din of crowded streets, going among the years, the faces,
May I still meet my memory in so lonely a place
Between the streams and the red clouds, hearing the curlews, Hearing the horizons endure.
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tr0ll
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by tr0ll »

The second verse looks like a refrain, making it singable :) Did you have a tune in mind?
Is Miryaent an elf or a human muse?
Minor quibble: i am not sure elvish strongholds have portcullises - that seems a human or dwarvish way of building with stone and iron.
Lanval
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Joined: September 26th, 2012, 6:20 pm

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Lanval »

I like it and I look forward to more.

The line, "Though nature's long assault does not abate." seems a bit odd. Though, if this city appears in the mainline, I have not played the campaign and am lacking context, but it seems like a bit of a contrast with the tree hugging elves to view a city as holding against an assault by nature. It might be explained later but in isolation it feels wierd.
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Kanzil
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Kanzil »

I'm not sure whether elves had portcullises
They are a great trading nation these elves, and are often in contact with the humans of the emerald plains and the orcs of the north.

As for the city, you will find it on elidell's map in the Lins-elens, first home of the elves. Miryaent was a random name, of Lanval's I believe, that I liked, and wanted to forge a link with.

I agree the meter makes it very easy on the tongue, very flowing and regular, like a song, like time, the slow passing of which I am trying to portray.(No song is planned, yet...)

This poem follows the fall into ruin of great Methurdil after Vaxmos ( the enemy in my campaign) sieges it for six years.
Any comments on the techniques or the poetry itself?Here's another two verses:

The heavenly vaults grant golden dawn
In barren sky a light is born
Methurdil radiant in the morning sun
A sight to awe, a sight to stun.

Forested by soaring spire
Ringing with the music of flute and lyre
And now tower tall and winding wall
Hear once more nature's binding call.
Last edited by Kanzil on October 17th, 2012, 7:08 pm, edited 2 times in total.
High over valleys in the red levelling rays -
In din of crowded streets, going among the years, the faces,
May I still meet my memory in so lonely a place
Between the streams and the red clouds, hearing the curlews, Hearing the horizons endure.
Lanval
Posts: 31
Joined: September 26th, 2012, 6:20 pm

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Lanval »

I think it's really good but if you want I can be really nitpicky;

I love the opening and the only thing I can say about the first two verses is that the "long assault does not abate" is a little long and the alliteration is kind of strained. Weather and Weight might be a an alternative but I can't think of way to put it better using either set of terms, so it's fine as is.

Third Verse: "Grant" might be better than give. Something about "give" feels odd.
"The" can be dropped from before Barren Sky.

Fourth Verse: "Forested" is odd as a verb and the opening seems sort of short. Another verb would be nice there.
The last sentence is also a little stilted.

None of this is fatal or even necessarily needs change, I just thought you'd appreciate the in-depth look.

Over all the fact that this can be picked out at all implies there's a lot of natural flow to it, though I wasn't able to pick out any strict metrical rules (though I'm bad at noticing them unless I'm writing). The Alliteration is really nicely worked in. Hope to see more.
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Kanzil
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Kanzil »

The alliteration, whilst not strong was more by accident than design for " assault" and "abate", whilst abate is just a word I have a particular liking for. As for "gives" I do prefer "grants" and will change it.

There is no exact metric rule, save the fact it is all in trochaic meter, though the amounts of syllables per line varies slightly. I am glad you like the alliteration, in particular, the sibilance, the constant repetition of Ss.
High over valleys in the red levelling rays -
In din of crowded streets, going among the years, the faces,
May I still meet my memory in so lonely a place
Between the streams and the red clouds, hearing the curlews, Hearing the horizons endure.
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tr0ll
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Joined: June 11th, 2006, 8:13 pm
Location: canada

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by tr0ll »

Kanzil wrote:I am glad you like the alliteration, in particular, the sibilance, the constant repetition of Ss.
Might be Lanval's ssaurian rootss sshowing :wink: :lol2:

I am curious how well poetry translates. That must be a great challenge! (perhaps offtopic)
Lanval
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Joined: September 26th, 2012, 6:20 pm

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Lanval »

As someone who's tried even for a fairly similar language it's incredible tricky. English and most Western European countries tend to have similar [definitely not identity though] ideas of what a rhyme is, and it's true, different stuff sounds pretty in different ways. Even French has slightly altered rules [words we might think are too alike to rhyme are considered a "strong" rhyme by them].

I've looked at Irish as well as some other langs and even conlangs casually and rules there can be insanely radical since if you just go by what makes words sound nice together in English you're going to get an awkward sounding monstrosity. Irish for example, what matters is that the stressed syllable rhymes and vowels after that agree, this just doesn't work in English [Contract and Donald] cause Irish has special rules that don't exist in English. Personally I really love some of the complicated rules the Welsh have in their poetry [I think it's great for ideas on how the Elves would write; Beauty from the Abstract and Mathematical] but in English, these are much too confining so the few poets who tried to emulate it wouldn't follow it systematically or loosen up the rules enough to make it possible.

Basically, you're going to either give up on it sounding pretty [or at least rhyming/whatever] or writing some that's pretty much completely new except keeping the general idea and maybe some of your favourite lines mostly intact.
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TheScribe
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by TheScribe »

tr0ll wrote:
Kanzil wrote:I am glad you like the alliteration, in particular, the sibilance, the constant repetition of Ss.
Might be Lanval's ssaurian rootss sshowing :wink: :lol2:

I am curious how well poetry translates. That must be a great challenge! (perhaps offtopic)
Well, with Latin at least, translated poetry has the same feel. Though all rhyming goes down the tubes...

Incidentally, I think it sounds pretty good.
Sorta on a break from the forums ATM, have been for a while. If I was doing something for/with you and I haven't recently, that's why, I will be back soon hopefully.
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Kanzil
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Kanzil »

Glad you liked it :) .
Another verse:

In its age of glory it shone as the sun
A haven of refinement, rivaled by none
It was, within its leafy realm of river and of bark,
An isolated island in the surrounding sea of dark.
High over valleys in the red levelling rays -
In din of crowded streets, going among the years, the faces,
May I still meet my memory in so lonely a place
Between the streams and the red clouds, hearing the curlews, Hearing the horizons endure.
alluton
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by alluton »

I like it.
"This game cured me of my real life addiction."
-Flameslash
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Kanzil
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Kanzil »

I've decided to place it at intervals in the story as it doesn't feel like a single poem though it does feel thematically related. Glad you like it :D.
High over valleys in the red levelling rays -
In din of crowded streets, going among the years, the faces,
May I still meet my memory in so lonely a place
Between the streams and the red clouds, hearing the curlews, Hearing the horizons endure.
Lanval
Posts: 31
Joined: September 26th, 2012, 6:20 pm

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Lanval »

Good, though I think it could use a few less articles. Two "it"s in a single line sort of comes at the cost of flow. Poetry lets your do wierder syntax to avoid that sort of thing. Again not fatal, it just didn't feel like the same flow as first four verses.

I'd also recommend "Resplendance" over "Refinement"

I think this verse does a really good job on imagery.
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TheScribe
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Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by TheScribe »

Slightly off topic, but 'it' actually is a pronoun, not an article. 'a', 'an', and 'the' are the only articles.

I do agree that it could use less pronouns though.

Still looking good though. ;)

I've decided to place it at intervals in the story as it doesn't feel like a single poem though it does feel thematically related
That sounds like a good idea.

What campaign is this for again?
Sorta on a break from the forums ATM, have been for a while. If I was doing something for/with you and I haven't recently, that's why, I will be back soon hopefully.
Lanval
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Joined: September 26th, 2012, 6:20 pm

Re: Kanzil's poetry

Post by Lanval »

I didn't divide it clearly enough, but they were intended as different points. There are is an "a" and an "an" there I'm not sure about in there along with a lot of "it"s. I would have said both but "too many articles and pronouns" sounds odd because generally, "it" isn't thought of with the term 'pronoun'.

Also, it's related to the campaign in his Signature; http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=36295
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