Elvish Pillager's Comprehensive Guide to the Horseman

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Post by toms » May 30th, 2006, 11:11 am

Elvish Pillager wrote:As to the Dark Adept, the cheap chaotic mage with potentially no drawbacks: Good suggestion. I'll do it when I have time/energy.
No melee is actually a drawback, even if the other mages have very little melee damage. But he luckily gets a real nice melee attack both as lich and level Soceror.
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Post by Ailurus » May 30th, 2006, 3:54 pm

Haldiel has a line of dialog. When you first get him he says "greetings young master. I pledge myself to your service"

I actually made him a paladin first time through HttT, simply because, in my opinion, you can never have too much healing. But then, I personally like large cavalry forces to begin with, so by the end of the campaign I think it was 4-5 grand knights with Haldiel as a supporting healer for them when they charged ahead of my shydes.

Liked the guide a lot, Elvish Pillager.

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Post by Cuyo Quiz » May 30th, 2006, 4:31 pm

Hehe, "MP Comprehensive Guide to Adept Pimping", most definitely.

*slowly walks away from thread*
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Post by Sly » May 30th, 2006, 6:30 pm

Ailurus wrote:Haldiel has a line of dialog. When you first get him he says "greetings young master. I pledge myself to your service"
One funny thing is that sometimes I had another knight that was autiomaticaly recalled in his place at the begining of a scenario :)

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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 30th, 2006, 7:05 pm

FYI: In Northern Winter and several other scenarios, if you have the right advanced units, you can get Haldiel to show up as the random guy from your army who says stuff.
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Post by unsung » May 31st, 2006, 11:33 am

you seem to have forgotten the horseman assasin attack of death.

A lot of players leave their leader (relatively) open o their keep. If you can get a horseman to them, and they are using say, a red mage as their leader, you may well be able to kill him.

Very usefull in mp, but its not a strategy you should actively pursue- people will notice the oddly behaving horseman who doesn't enter combat. Just look for the opportunity.
Oh no look out its a ray gun.
You should move to avoid the rays
the rays are coming out of the gun
if you are hit by the rays
you will be shot by the rays
the rays are fast so you should be fast to
can you win against the fast rays from the gun?

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Post by Elvish_Pillager » May 31st, 2006, 12:03 pm

Good point. I've added a comment to that effect to the guide.
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Post by neroden » July 7th, 2006, 5:04 am

Sounds like the Lancer should be removed or rebalanced.

If you should always upgrade to the Knight, the Lancer shouldn't be in the game.

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Post by Xandria » July 7th, 2006, 7:09 am

Maybe a third upgrade option should be added to the horseman: a mounted standard bearer, giving leadership where it is needed.
As for the lancer: why exactly can't it advance?
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Post by toms » July 7th, 2006, 7:19 am

Xandria wrote:Maybe a third upgrade option should be added to the horseman: a mounted standard bearer, giving leadership where it is needed.
As for the lancer: why exactly can't it advance?
There was once a topic about it, but I haven't found it now. :?
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Post by Elvish_Pillager » July 7th, 2006, 11:02 am

Actually, there've been about half a dozen topics about the lancer advancing, strewn in all different forums.
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Re: Elvish Pillager's Comprehensive Guide to the Horseman

Post by appleide » July 15th, 2006, 1:24 pm

Very detailed guide! Certainly has more depth than one of those other whole faction guides, though this covers only one unit.

Just to nitpick:
Elvish Pillager wrote: In multiplayer, still always get the Knight. If you want to deal lots of damage, the Knight still does more charging damage than the Horseman, it does more damage per hit, and it is less likely to be killed first on the counterattack.
"the knight does more charging damage than the horseman." Of course! What did you think? But I assume you mean more damage on the first hit than the lancer. I think lancer should have a 18-2 attack instead, if it is completely obsolete to the knight.

Also, even against loyalists they are still useful. Against bowman they are good if attacking. Remember, if they have a group of spearman and bowman perched up on some mountaiins, and you can remove them in one go by horseman and your army, you can safely do so. Fencers are also one hit kill things. Very nice target even in 70% terrain, especially if they are jumping around your villages. Horseman have the strategical advantage of popping up everytime in the opponent's mind everytime he makes a plan with it visible. Comparing horseman to cavalry, I always have one at the beginning of mp game with fog, as even if my opponent is undead, all i lost is a measly 5 gold, isn't it? You also have to consider that all good players recruit only ghouls DAs ghosts and bats in turn 1. And it can all be made back if a DA accidentally stepped out of the forest, or when a bat saw your quick horseman and couldn't quite fly back.
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Re: Elvish Pillager's Comprehensive Guide to the Horseman

Post by Elvish_Pillager » July 15th, 2006, 5:43 pm

appleide wrote:Also, even against loyalists they are still useful. Against bowman they are good if attacking. Remember, if they have a group of spearman and bowman perched up on some mountaiins, and you can remove them in one go by horseman and your army, you can safely do so.
It's not that safe. A bowman has a 6-2 melee attack even if it is blade, so it can leave your horseman half dead. Plus, you need a significant number of other units to wipe them out, even besides the 23 gold Horseman. It's too costly to use it effectively in this way.
appleide wrote:Fencers are also one hit kill things.
Good point. Risky, but a 50% chance to get a *kill* is always useful. ;)
appleide wrote:Comparing horseman to cavalry, I always have one at the beginning of mp game with fog, as even if my opponent is undead, all i lost is a measly 5 gold, isn't it?
Nah, more than that - against Undead, the Horseman is actually weaker than the Cavalryman. Pierce damage, less cold resistance... (Unless they leave their Dark Adepts open anyway.)
appleide wrote:You also have to consider that all good players recruit only ghouls DAs ghosts and bats in turn 1.
No, you don't - because it's not true. That's a very sweeping statement you have there...
appleide wrote:And it can all be made back if a DA accidentally stepped out of the forest, or when a bat saw your quick horseman and couldn't quite fly back.
It's (obviously) not that simple. :| (Plus, your horseman is even more or a wimp if it's Quick :P)
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Re: Elvish Pillager's Comprehensive Guide to the Horseman

Post by appleide » July 16th, 2006, 8:07 am

Elvish Pillager wrote:
appleide wrote:You also have to consider that all good players recruit only ghouls DAs ghosts and bats in turn 1.
No, you don't - because it's not true. That's a very sweeping statement you have there...
You must agree, that DAs are always part of an above average player's initial recruit. I want to note that a single Horseman have a role no matter what their opponent's race is. :?
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Re: Elvish Pillager's Comprehensive Guide to the Horseman

Post by Elvish_Pillager » July 16th, 2006, 10:02 pm

appleide wrote:You must agree, that DAs are always part of an above average player's initial recruit.
Indeed. However, Skeletons may be also. I, for instance, usually defend Adepts with Skeletons of one type or other, making the Horseman rather weak. Granted, its presence is a restriction on how I can place the Adept(s), but is that really worth 23 gold?
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