Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

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VampiricRose
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Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by VampiricRose » May 5th, 2009, 9:52 am

I am trying to make a campaign about undead and i decided to include the "Death Squire" from Liberty, but i need a portrait for it. Could someone help me out?

I'm still working on the name/story.
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by thespaceinvader » May 5th, 2009, 9:53 am

I suggest using the Death Knight mainline portrait.

And reading this http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=9579
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VampiricRose
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by VampiricRose » May 5th, 2009, 10:03 am

I considered that but as the Squire has a sword and the Knight has an axe, i didn't think it would work.

And yes, I have read that.
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by thespaceinvader » May 5th, 2009, 11:04 am

Ah - there's a death squire with an axe out there somewhere - look in Invasion from the Unknown's unit files.
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Longbow
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by Longbow » May 5th, 2009, 3:04 pm

I use the Death Baron in my era and campaign, the art for the sprite is Shadow Master's.

Speaking of UMC portraits, an Elvish Hunter one would be good, if a skilled artist had the time or inclination to make one, as IftU, Elvish Legacy :) , UtBS (desert hunter) and a few more UMC campaigns which I can't remember use it.
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Jetrel
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by Jetrel » May 6th, 2009, 5:39 am

thespaceinvader wrote:Ah - there's a death squire with an axe out there somewhere - look in Invasion from the Unknown's unit files.
Yeah, I really need to redo that unit, based on the scraps left over from making the death knight, and mainline it.

Fact: most races need a "leader/special" unit line that you can use for campaigns, either as antagonist leaders, or as easy art for a UMC protagonist. People just want them.
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VampiricRose
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by VampiricRose » May 6th, 2009, 6:56 am

The Invasion from the Unknown uses the death baron, not the death squire.

And, frankly, it looks like it would advance from the death knight, instead of to it.
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by thespaceinvader » May 6th, 2009, 7:58 am

Jet - i'll put it on my list for the summer, too - race you ;)
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by shadowm » May 6th, 2009, 1:44 pm

VampiricRose wrote:The Invasion from the Unknown uses the death baron, not the death squire.

And, frankly, it looks like it would advance from the death knight, instead of to it.
Jetryl's attempt was even more impressive IMO:
Neoskel's baseframe + Jetryl's bling
Neoskel's baseframe + Jetryl's bling
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The Baron/Squire name change is just personal preference. In fact the unit stats are mostly the same IIRC, and it advances from Skeleton and to Death Knight.
Dammit, my baseframe sucks.
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by thespaceinvader » May 6th, 2009, 1:51 pm

ImageImage

For comparison, btw. I think that the difficulty is that the shield is effectively additional equipment which is lost in favour of the 2-handed axe with the upgrade. Taking the shield away and keeping the axe 2-handed but smaller (roughly on a par with the l1 skellie's) would probably lend a more 'level 2' air to the guy, as might removing the cape, which the Loyalist l2 equivalent, the Lieutenant, doesn't have.
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Neoskel
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by Neoskel » May 6th, 2009, 5:43 pm

Shadow_Master wrote:Dammit, my baseframe sucks.
You cut that out. At least you did most of the work in yours. All i did really was bring it to the attention of more talented artists than me.
thespaceinvader wrote: For comparison, btw. I think that the difficulty is that the shield is effectively additional equipment which is lost in favour of the 2-handed axe with the upgrade. Taking the shield away and keeping the axe 2-handed but smaller (roughly on a par with the l1 skellie's) would probably lend a more 'level 2' air to the guy, as might removing the cape, which the Loyalist l2 equivalent, the Lieutenant, doesn't have.
A similar thing happens with the level 1 naga to the level 2, but no one seems to be bothered by that. Maybe just make the shield smaller and/or less significant looking. Removing the cape would probably help too.

In addition to whatever revisions the sprite needs, the unit needs a new name too. Something that evokes the same feeling as 'Death Knight' but slightly less so. Death Squire just doesn't cut it to me, squires are servants not warriors. And you need to add in the leadership vibe too. 'Baron' is a rather specific position, much more so than 'Knight'. a more generic name would fit much better. And it makes me think he should be flying some sort of skeletal biplane. :P

I tried tacking 'Death' in front of a bunch of different synonyms for 'knight', etc. but I didn't find any really satisfactory ones. It might do better with other evil sounding prefixes. I'll just keep banging my head against it and see if anything better drops out. Please do feel free to share ideas.

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VampiricRose
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by VampiricRose » May 7th, 2009, 7:34 am

Neoskel wrote: In addition to whatever revisions the sprite needs, the unit needs a new name too. Something that evokes the same feeling as 'Death Knight' but slightly less so. Death Squire just doesn't cut it to me, squires are servants not warriors.
Actually, the Death Squire/Baron's description says that they serve the Death Knight.
Plus squires were required to learn the fighting arts as a page anyway.
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Neoskel
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by Neoskel » May 7th, 2009, 7:01 pm

VampiricRose wrote:
Neoskel wrote: In addition to whatever revisions the sprite needs, the unit needs a new name too. Something that evokes the same feeling as 'Death Knight' but slightly less so. Death Squire just doesn't cut it to me, squires are servants not warriors.
Actually, the Death Squire/Baron's description says that they serve the Death Knight.
Plus squires were required to learn the fighting arts as a page anyway.
Well, the main part of my dissatisfaction with the name is just that 'squire' is a really wimpy sounding word. Plus, it excludes the option of lvl2 death knights working on their own. If they aren't affiliated with a full-on death knight, there isn't much reason for them to be there.

I'd rather have something that makes you think 'second in command' or 'right hand man' when in relation to a Death Knight rather than 'errand boy' or 'armor bearer'. Not literally 'second in command' so that theres no puzzlement over them working independently.

In any case, don't worry about it. I'll not bring it up again until i can think of a good replacement or two.

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VampiricRose
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by VampiricRose » May 8th, 2009, 6:51 am

Well the Lieutenant often works separate from the General, doesn't it?
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Re: Death Squire portrait needed for UMC

Post by kyi_the_bard » May 8th, 2009, 10:48 pm

It is

Skeleton Warrior>Death Squire>Death Knight

Right?

If so, then I propose a change to

Skeleton Warrior>Death Guardian>Death Knight
Meow

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