B0rsuk the vile heretic

[B0rsuk]

Norvell: that _could_ make sense in strategy game based on modern setting.

Mages just get better weapons, right ? And Elvish Hero has better sword, and bow with laser targeting system ?

They are called EXPERIENCE points, not "rank" points . By buying (corruption)a diploma you look educated, but you aren't.

So we want to give reward from taking stupid risks? I have to disagree strongly... fighting is not only about dodging and striking... it is about tactics. How good decision it is from the troll to go in non-advantegeous fight?

Watching a battle from nearby hill and giving commands is very tactical and smart, but will it improve your sword skills or dodging ? You could improve your leadership, perhaps, but not too much - because you don't know how it is like, and what can you expect from your soldiers. It doesn't matter how intelligent the decision was for that troll. More important is the fact, that when he's fighting with dangerous opponent, and his life depends on it, the troll will fight like there's no tommorow, and is more likely to learn advanced tricks and moves.

You seem to think that units should gain points for acting smart way. I don't understand why, and logic behind this statement. But if it was to be implemented in any form, do you think that it's easy to "teach" AI what is smart and what isn't ? You'd had to, if exp was supposed to be given for "smartness".

One of exceptions when exp certainly should be given for kills are backstabs. They are meant to catch enemy off guard, and leave no chance for "fair" fight.

[Norvell]

Norvell: that _could_ make sense in strategy game based on modern setting.

Someone getting credit for another's efforts could happen in any setting. It may not be fair and one may say in that sense it doesn't ``make sense'' regardless of the setting.

Mages just get better weapons, right ? And Elvish Hero has better sword, and bow with laser targeting system ?

Laser targeting system? I may be mistaken, but one of my archers advanced to Marksman and got a long bow which is better than what he had before since it does more damage.

They are called EXPERIENCE points, not "rank" points .

I don't remember calling them ``rank'' points. Advancing in rank seems to be one of the side effects of an increase in EXPERIENCE points. It also seems to affect one's HIT points but I understand that they're still called EXPERIENCE points.

By buying (corruption)a diploma you look educated, but you aren't.

I know; that's why I said the effects of gained experienced on a troop may look the same regardless of whether the gained experience is truly deserved. I may get a job with a bogus diploma; whether I can do the job well is another matter.

One of the earlier discussions had to do with conditions for rewarding XP---one gets XP for kills only? for kills and any damage dealt? not for kills if no other damage was dealt? All I was trying to say is that being rewarded with XP for dealing a death blow---but no previous damage---takes into account the possibility that someone can get credit for another's efforts.

[B0rsuk]

I believe you are mistaken at this point

Longbow isn't simply "better". As opposed to crossbow, mastering longbow requires LOTS of practice - they say one learns it whole life.
I mean it really requires skill to be better archer, especially with longbow.

What you described is more true in real world - for example I'd like to work with computers (preferably graphics), and there's little I can learn about it from training courses or university (because I'm NOT going to code, my brother is system admin and he doesn't remember even basic math). I simply need that damn paper + few years of experience (another paper), so I can get work.

The situation was different in medieval ages, I think. My fame won't help me to survive battle (other than psychological effects), skills and physical fitness will.

[Norvell]

I believe you are mistaken at this point

Longbow isn't simply "better". As opposed to crossbow, mastering longbow requires LOTS of practice - they say one learns it whole life. I mean it really requires skill to be better archer, especially with longbow.

For the purpose of our discussion being ``simply `better' '' is enough. In my earlier post I used the term ``better weapons.'' In your reply you (I'm assuming facetiously) equated a bow with a laser tageting system with a ``better weapon.'' I mentioned long bow simply to show that gaining experience rewards the troops with upgraded equipment. And you're right, learning to use a long bow well probably does take more time than a few turns on a BfW battlefield.

What you described is more true in real world - for example I'd like to work with computers (preferably graphics), and there's little I can learn about it from training courses or university (because I'm NOT going to code, my brother is system admin and he doesn't remember even basic math). I simply need that damn paper + few years of experience (another paper), so I can get work.

Again, the discussion comes back to the real world. How real do we want a fantasy game to be? I've killed a few enemies in BfW (and NetHack, for that matter) when my HP were really low and just happened to advance to the next experience level. My maximum hit points increased and my current hit points increased to either the maximum or close to it. While a soldier in the real world---regardless of the time period---may learn how to stay alive longer after himself killing others (increasing his ``max. HP''), his wounds won't be miraculously healed all of a sudden. But, hey, my Elvish fighter isn't going to complain about that when he's surrounded by enemies.

The situation was different in medieval ages, I think. My fame won't help me to survive battle (other than psychological effects), skills and physical fitness will.

That's true. All I was trying to say is that the effects of gaining experience (advancing in rank, upgraded weapons, et cetera) may be manifested on an inexperienced soldier. I wasn't trying to imply that it's realistic that he is now just as experienced as someone who deserves the level gain.

I'm not trying to be argumentative and I apologize for being so verbose. I'm not always good at going from thought to word.