The Yōkai

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megane
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by megane »

Actually, I would suggest that, rather than powering down the two lines with plague, it might help to not allow recruitment of the lv0 units, but only the lv1. The lv0 would, of course, still be what results when a unit dies to the plague attack, but would not be available to spam, thus making it harder to pull a Devling-style upkeep victory.
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Vendanna
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Vendanna »

megane wrote:Actually, I would suggest that, rather than powering down the two lines with plague, it might help to not allow recruitment of the lv0 units, but only the lv1. The lv0 would, of course, still be what results when a unit dies to the plague attack, but would not be available to spam, thus making it harder to pull a Devling-style upkeep victory.
There's only one line with plague.and is the swarm guy.

the swarm guy is the one that makes all difference against devling, since they get surrounded even as they have units to deal with them (overgrown and nailers?) since devlings has a worse movetype. each devling this thing crushes is a foe that can extend itself.

Also, when playing with these, I didn't noticed at first the leadership on the poltergeist, I only needed the weavers + swarm to destroy the foes.

As a note, I think the weaver moves too much or too well, because I can also use them as secondary scouts and they have the ame function as the steppe hunter on steppe orcs, being an annoying unit to face that changes the tides of the battle :)
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Unnheulu
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Unnheulu »

Interesting faction, I like it, keep up the work and don't give up! :)
Elerias
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Elerias »

I tryed Yokai on dark forecast and the swarm was nearly able to win it on its own. Killing every unit he could provided so many small swarms i was perfectly able to cover all my ranged units. It was two player and the second was windsong with just 3 or 4 units to finish what left living after the yokai turn. I find the unit hard to balance for this type of games.

As to what u wrote. I dont think shroomkin are overpowered. They seem be quite ok. Also the changeling seems to me a little weak w/o the healing. Increasing the damage to 7-3 will be nice. I love the poltergeist art. I would play them even if they would just stand and look at the enemy:).

The idea of having lvl 1 leadership unit and many lvl 0s is nice but when lvl 1s cant be recruited it kinda restricts the playstyle of the faction to one way. If there was an option to recruit lvl 0 and also lvl 1 it will give the Yokai much more versatility in my opinion.
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Vendanna
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Vendanna »

Elerias wrote:I tryed Yokai on dark forecast and the swarm was nearly able to win it on its own. Killing every unit he could provided so many small swarms i was perfectly able to cover all my ranged units. It was two player and the second was windsong with just 3 or 4 units to finish what left living after the yokai turn. I find the unit hard to balance for this type of games.
The Swarm is very potent, tought its resistances are a bit similar to the skeleton one, its a creature you want to damage with ranged attacks, and should be taken down with impact (wose crush them as example due to pierce resistance and impact damage) Magic also dispose of them quickly. As a note the recruitable one seems balanced, its the small ones that deviates it.

Note for melon, this unit is considered human, but it doesn't make sense that a swarm of insects to be "drainable" or turn plagued, etc... it should get mechanical until a better trait comes to change this unit modus operandi.
As to what u wrote. I dont think shroomkin are overpowered. They seem be quite ok. Also the changeling seems to me a little weak w/o the healing. Increasing the damage to 7-3 will be nice. I love the poltergeist art. I would play them even if they would just stand and look at the enemy:).
The Shroomkin is the natural beater on mirror match, since it takes down without problems (thanks to drain) the opponent swarm walkers and the ghost type poltergeist, I tend to use most of the units on longer games except for the sprites that are only used for village grabbing.
The idea of having lvl 1 leadership unit and many lvl 0s is nice but when lvl 1s cant be recruited it kinda restricts the playstyle of the faction to one way. If there was an option to recruit lvl 0 and also lvl 1 it will give the Yokai much more versatility in my opinion.
There's a few lvl 1 already to recruit, the occultist is lvl 1, the poltergeist and the swarm walker are also lvl 1. You already can cause much harm with them alone and the weaver.
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Elerias
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Elerias »

Vendanna wrote: The Swarm is very potent, tought its resistances are a bit similar to the skeleton one, its a creature you want to damage with ranged attacks, and should be taken down with impact (wose crush them as example due to pierce resistance and impact damage) Magic also dispose of them quickly. As a note the recruitable one seems balanced, its the small ones that deviates it.
Sure. I dont say its hard to take down when an oponent knows what he is doing. I was talking about a survival map where the swarm lord looked very very good producing tons of small ones.
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Melon
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Melon »

Wow thanks for all the feedback guys, I really appreciate it :) . I revised a number of the bigger problems to make the faction a little more fair to play against:
1. Weaver movement has been cut down to 5 spaces. In return they got a slight melee boost.
2. Swarm spawn had their hp cut down to a mere 10, but their xp requirement also got lowered slightly. This makes it a lot easier to manage an onslaught of these guys, since most impact or even blade damage troops have a chance to gun them down in a single hit.
3. Rather then powering down the Swarm Lords, I made the experience requirement for the Walkers higher. This makes it difficult to get a Swarm Lord on smaller maps.
4. The Witch and Kitsune have been revised. The most notable change is that witches now move 6 spaces, while Kitsune have been reduced to 5.

I left the shroomkin as it is for the time being.

I also completely redid the witch sprite since I thought the older one looked pretty ugly.
Last edited by Melon on March 28th, 2008, 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Vendanna
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Vendanna »

Melon wrote:Wow thanks for all the feedback guys, I really appreciate it :) . I revised a number of the bigger problems to make the faction a little more fair to play against:
1. Weaver movement has been cut down to 5 spaces. In return they got a slight melee boost.
2. Swarm spawn had their hp cut down to a mere 10, but their xp requirement also got lowered slightly. This makes it a lot easier to manage an onslaught of these guys, since most impact or even blade damage troops have a chance to gun them down in a single hit.
3. Rather then powering down the Swarm Lords, I made the experience requirement for the Walkers higher. This makes it difficult to get a Swarm Lord on smaller maps.
4. The Witch and Kitsune have been revised. The most notable change is that witches now move 6 spaces, while Kitsune have been reduced to 5.
I think that leaving Swarm spawn life left at 14 is enough nerf, after all 14 is ranging on the smallest life (if not the smallest) to be useful, and take into consideration that these guys retain swarm as special reducing their number of attacks by a percent of their life.
I left the shroomkin as it is for the time being.

I also completely redid the witch sprite since I thought the older one looked pretty ugly.
Ok, sounds nice.
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Melon
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Melon »

The 1.0 Beta is up!

Though this is a by no means a way to say that I am done with the faction, I do consider it completed enough to be committed to EOM (Or any other era, as long as you ask for my permission to use it).
Version 1.0 changes include:
-2 new units: Nixie, an alternative upgrade for the Pixie and Nine-Tailed Fox, a level 3 Kitsune
-Slight cleanup for a few older sprites
-Some slight stat revision
-Probably some other stuff that I can't remember

For the time bing I'll go ahead and say that the unit tree is done, or at the very least finished until I have a good enough reason to change it.

Your comments whether positive or negative are appreciated as always, so don't feel shy about stating your opinions.
Last edited by Melon on March 28th, 2008, 5:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Quietus
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Quietus »

Melon wrote: (Or any other era, as long as you ask for my permission to use it).
Unfotunately anyone who does use it, can do so without your permission, but it would polite if they did ask first.

I do like what you have done to the faction and it does look like an interesting play :) . You've managed to produce the sprites very quickly, which is more than can be said for me lol. Good work
ddrmario123
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by ddrmario123 »

i am sorry i didn't ask, i didn't know i should have
but your faction is awesome its one of those factions with all females like the windsongs
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Neoskel
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Neoskel »

Get rid of the inner tube on the nixie. It doesn't match the setting at all. Maybe give it fins or something if she is supposed to be a water unit.

Also, could you add some more male units and maybe make male variations of the fairies? Don't see why there would be two 'all female' factions in the same era, especially if both kidnap little girls to recruit them. Maybe a male changeling line?
Elerias
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Elerias »

I kinda miss the feeling of power on the higher lvl units except for the poltergeist. The lvl 2 shroom, spriggan and especially weaver are just a little bigger but doesnt look powerfull. Maybe adding some details, accessories/gadgets even if i know its hard to add them to non-human like units.
AI
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by AI »

Most other factions are male-only, so I don't think think that's too convincing a reason.
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Melon
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Re: The Yōkai

Post by Melon »

Neoskel wrote:Get rid of the inner tube on the nixie.
No. Never. Don't ask me again.
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