Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Discussion of all aspects of multiplayer development: unit balancing, map development, server development, and so forth.

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Post Reply
oesis
Posts: 32
Joined: July 12th, 2007, 8:26 pm

Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by oesis »

I have discovered a new strategy that is very effective against undead when you are playing as loyalist. It involves only recruiting Cavelrymen and Mages. Overall the Mages are used to punch through villages or kill ghouls while cav are used for everything else.

Strenghts of this strategy:
Undead have trouble retreating, cav deal 5-3 damage at day and with there high speed it is easy to pick off a unit.
Fast retreat, if undead player does push you back you can easily retreat while risking few units
Fast resupply, units can reach the front line in around 2 moves so more of your gold is in use.

Weaknesses
Undead Archer, these pesky units can be a problem but as long as you can minimize fighting at night you are fine, even though they have a damage advantage you have a speed and hp advantage.
Attachments
oesis_v_F8_Binds,_cav_+_mage_v_undead,_WIN.gz
(22.28 KiB) Downloaded 135 times

donkey_noob_trash1
Posts: 147
Joined: March 1st, 2009, 6:16 am

Re: Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by donkey_noob_trash1 »

oesis wrote:I have discovered a new strategy that is very effective against undead when you are playing as loyalist. It involves only recruiting Cavelrymen and Mages. Overall the Mages are used to punch through villages or kill ghouls while cav are used for everything else.

Strenghts of this strategy:
Undead have trouble retreating, cav deal 5-3 damage at day and with there high speed it is easy to pick off a unit.
Fast retreat, if undead player does push you back you can easily retreat while risking few units
Fast resupply, units can reach the front line in around 2 moves so more of your gold is in use.

Weaknesses
Undead Archer, these pesky units can be a problem but as long as you can minimize fighting at night you are fine, even though they have a damage advantage you have a speed and hp advantage.
Hey, oesis... I'm thinking of starting a thread called "oesis is OP vs UD!" or maybe "oesis- don't play against him with UD."

You're like the bane of that faction.

Also on a side note, I find your cav + mage recruit to be quite effective, although I would add that the mages can't keep pace with the cav. That's a bit of a limiting factor, in my opinion.
"Oh noes, I'm trapped by corporeal beings!" -Caphriel (in a discussion about ghosts and ZoC)

5dPZ
Posts: 199
Joined: July 11th, 2006, 7:20 pm
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Re: Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by 5dPZ »

well, although I haven't tried out this on either side, but I tend to think that this is much less impressive than your pad/ulf combo.

1. the lawful/chaotic matchup require much more planning than chaotic/chaotic, thus requires the cav/mage to obey time of day very tightly , or be killed off really fast

2. speed factor, non-quick (50% of them) mage is same movement as any undead units, thus make ur retreating much more difficult than pads.

3. cost - 17g + 20g vs 14g (archer) + 16g (ghoul), you are at disadv financially, in contrast of 14g pads.

4. mage exposure - it's easy to to expose ur mages to ghoul for offense and get poisoned, whereas for pads match up, you don't quiet need to worry exposure this much since ulf would almost guarentee a kill.

overall, through my mind simulation (lol, again), I think you can't beat an UD player with equal skill with nothing but ghoul(30-40%) and archer(70%-60%).
Maybe some testing is required on this one.

oesis
Posts: 32
Joined: July 12th, 2007, 8:26 pm

Re: Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by oesis »

Ok, after some minor testing this might not be as OP as I originally thought.

Caphriel
Posts: 994
Joined: April 21st, 2008, 4:10 pm

Re: Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by Caphriel »

I think the problem is what donkey said. oesis is OP, and needs to be nerfed.

User avatar
wesfreak
Posts: 1020
Joined: October 28th, 2007, 1:11 pm
Location: in a land far far away

Re: Cav + mage vs Undead, OP

Post by wesfreak »

I think the other guy was also a factor: he had 40 gold when he died, which would have been more usefull on the keep, especially if he had actually defended his own villages, which would have given him more gold. He also could have protected his banebows a bit better.

The strategy might be really good though if you through in a few heavy infantrymen to counter the skele archers in defense, but that would have taken more money.

Post Reply