bards/inspire

[elanthis]

Reviving the bard discussion, but with a different twist. Instead of having the 'leadership' ability, I propose an 'inspire' ability. This ability causes any unit that is next to the inspiring unit at the beginning of the side's turn to have 1-3 extra movement points. (Perhaps based on level difference between inspiring unit and inspired unit.)

As someone who participates medieval combat as a hobby, one of my fondest memories is sitting outside our fort, in the dead of night, knowing that a powerful force was about to attack (a death knight and minions - this particular battle was in a fantasy LARP I play). My character in that game is an undead hunter, and the ghost of a legendary knight was wandering around those of us preparing for the battle. I was role-playing being barely able to hold back from attacking him, when suddenly he broke into song written for invigorating trrops. At that moment, I and the rest of us were ready to follow him to hell and back. When the enemy showed up not a minute later, those of us who were just a moment ago terrified of the encounter charged full speed to match the approaching force.

It didn't really help with the fighting. We got owned all the same. But that charge was incredible. Freezing cold night, terrified troops, suddently invigorated to not just advance on an enemy sure to slaughter them, but charge in ready to meet the enemy.

That's why I'd imagine a bard inspire ability to provide additional movement. The bard inspires the troops to rush forward and face the enemy.

Thoughts?

[Monkey]

I liked this, but you got to tell me what the hell is this medieval battles you talk about. You DON'T dress up like a medieval warrior and go fight with your friends do you?

[Jetrel]

I liked this, but you got to tell me what the hell is this medieval battles you talk about. You DON'T dress up like a medieval warrior and go fight with your friends do you?

Uh, that's exactly what they do. It's a whole heck of a lot cooler than sitting around and rolling dice. Gets you exercise, might actually teach you how to fight... It's like fight club, except you don't damage each other.

Or like jousting, back in the day. Simulated combat for fun.

[elanthis]

Yeah, we do, although it's not just with friends - usually much larger groups. You can probably find a LARP (Live Action Role Playing, www.larplist.com) or SCA (Society for Creative Anarchism, www.sca.org) event in your area if you're interested in doing some *real* role-playing. Just be careful with LARPs, because 95% of them are trash - bad role-playing (I've been to some where people sit around the fire talking about their trucks or something else entirely stupid), horrifically poor fighting (most LARPs are just D&D dorks in costume, with no clue how to use a weapon at all), or generally bad game mechanics. Good LARPs are hard to find.

The actual rules of such games vary widely. King's rules (or similar rules) based games usually have far more realistic fighting. I do recommend avoiding NERO; their events have almost no roleplaying whatsoever and their fighting is the purest crap I've ever seen - I'm among the worst of the 400 or so people I play with regularly, but I am practically a warrior god at a NERO event.

Trust me, getting out and actually *doing* those things you read about in fantasy books and do in games is so, so very much more entertaining and rewarding than sitting around in front of a computer or gaming table. Even the strategy lovers that make up the Wesnoth population - try actually leading a company of warriors in battle and see what real strategy and training is all about. If you're interested in other aspects of medieval life, definitely check out the SCA - medieval dance, art, cuisine, culture, and so on are all aspects of the SCA.

If you need garb, a local rennaissance faire is a good bet (though they are often exhorbitantly expensive), or you can buy from an online retailer like Rampant Mouse (who also sells latex/foam weapons, which are absolutely awesome to use in a LARP, and the norm in Europe). Your local LARP or SCA chapter might also have people who can help equip you with quality garb.

[Gafgarion]

I liked this, but you got to tell me what the hell is this medieval battles you talk about. You DON'T dress up like a medieval warrior and go fight with your friends do you?

Uh, that's exactly what they do. It's a whole heck of a lot cooler than sitting around and rolling dice. Gets you exercise, might actually teach you how to fight... It's like fight club, except you don't damage each other.

Or like jousting, back in the day. Simulated combat for fun.

I like sitting around rolling dice It's a fun social activity, especially for smaller groups (5 or so).

[drachefly]

In the old bard discussion there was mention of a standardbearer. Now, I was thinking of what standardbearers were for -- coordinating battle. Obviously, we don't want to have to include the unbelieveable complexity of issuing orders over long distances.

However, I did think it might let two adjacent units cooperate in attacking another unit. They would alternate in taking turns to attack it. The principal advantage is that if it dies, it doesn't get to finish its attack against one of the units. The secondary advantage is that both get experience for the battle even if the first would have killed it alone (of course, this carries the concommittant disadvantage that the second unit's move is wasted).

for example, units A (2 strikes) and B (2 strikes) attack a unit C (4 strikes)
when C attacks A, I'll mark it c and when C attacks B, I'll mark it C.

here is the order of attacks. AcBCAcBCcCcC

The User Interface for this could simply show the combined attack option(s) among the other attack options. We'd want to avoid mixing ranged and melee to keep the combinatorics down -- without mixing it would give a pair of units with 1 melee and 1 ranged attack 4 options (attack alone 2 ways, attack together 2 ways). It gets awkward with multiple ranged attacks...
(an Elvish shyde and an Elvish sorceress team up on a unit -- 3 individual attack options + 1 shared melee + 4 shared ranged = 8 options. Ow.)

This would be especially advantageous with, say, a charging unit and a normal unit with enough combined power that one attack from each would finish off the target; but the target could kill the charger if he survived the initial onslaught.

[stillnotelf]

This ability causes any unit that is next to the inspiring unit at the beginning of the side's turn to have 1-3 extra movement points.

I'm honestly not mocking your idea, just pointing out an unintended humorous consequence--basically, your Bards drive soldiers away faster! Apparently they're really off-key...

This ability would only affect units that start next to the Bard, but the inspiration would let them get farther away from the bard. With leadership and heal/cure, you keep the unit with the ability in the center of a group of fighters. This Bard couldn't work like that, he'd drive his audience away faster than they can normally travel...

It's not necessarily a bad idea, but the mechanic is kind of odd...it also seems like you'd need to plan further in advance than you really can, you'd have to anticipate your enemies' movement awfully well to use this effectively.

Another possibility (which falls prey to the same problem) would be to have the Bard influence neighboring unit's movement costs; i.e. let a neighboring Merman move better through Grassland. This would let the Bard help extra-slow units (elves in caves) without affecting units in their best areas.

[Monkey]

How the hell do you battle without harming each other? The "fight clubs" I did with my frieds (by the way, they stole my idea) we fight for real, by the end we are dripping blood. I'm sure that if any of us had a weapon in hand some tragedy were going to happen.

[elanthis]

(Getting off-topic... sorry) Injuries do happen (I've been laid unconscious twice, and seen my share of broken bones) but for the most part, it's pretty safe. We have pretty strict rules about safety, and will non-com or ban any player that has trouble following those rules. LARPs generally use padded weapons (either PVC/rattan with 3/4" pipe insulation wrapped in duct tape or latex/foam weapons made specifically for LARPs - you can find some on the site I linked to) while SCA and other groups use bare rattan, the same as you'd use in martial arts practice - when playing with those, you really really want to be wearing armor or fighting someone you really trust. Rules cover things like not hitting the head, hands, groin, etc, not swinging to hard (you only need to touch the other guy, not crush his ribs), etc. Certain usually valid attacks aren't allowed, like a real shield bash (though we do shield taps) and certain weapons aren't allowed because they are too hard to control (like flails). Non-padded weapons (including fists and feat) aren't allowed, and neither is grappling (although we do grapple where I play, but only after asking for permission to contact).

The LARP I play at is actually pretty rough by LARP standards, though not much compared to SCA battles. A lot of players of other LARPs (like those NERO wusses) won't play at ours. Those LARPs often have even more safety rules, though I personally consider them pretty lame.

In general, it's quite safe, incredibly fun, and something I really recommend people try at least once in their life.

For the bard thing, you're right that the bard drives people away in a sense. Again, though, it does mimic what I've seen in real life (yeah, I know, WINR). Bards don't generally get into combat. They sit on the back lines and inspire the troops about to head off to the front lines.

You're also right that it would make the bard hard to use since you'd have to predict your enemy. Perhaps the effect could last for several turns instead of just one. Open to suggetions.

[Monkey]

$50 dollars a sword, because of the coin here in brasil worthing 3 times less than a dollar, that'll come out $150 for me, plus alfandegary importation taxes, wich are high since brasil is an exportation country, $300 a sword. Ouch. And that's a fake one.

[turin]

I've been making my own PVC/insulate swords and playing with them for years, but I never knew there were organizations for people who do that...

[romnajin]

I thought you lived in the jungle! Or maybe, just the jungles of Brazil.

[Monkey]

of course

[Elvish_Pillager]

I've been making my own PVC/insulate swords and playing with them for years, but I never knew there were organizations for people who do that...

I have a bunch of self-made cardboard swords lying around my room, and it would be easy to glue a bit of foam insulation around them.

I even have a suit of cardboard armor, but that's not as high quality.

[turin]

I've found cardboard to bend too much for weapons. Although for armor, it does work. :)

For weapons, I would buy a length of ~3/4 inch PVC pipe, then cut it up and connect them with PVC connectors... its really cheap.

[edit]
For example, I've spent ~$20 for my whole armory... which is 2 spears, 3 longswords, 2 shortswords, 2 rather long daggers, a morning star, and 2 wooden shields. :P