New music contribution

Create music and sound effects for mainline or user-made content.

Moderators: Forum Moderators, Developers

Post Reply
Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

New music contribution

Post by Pluft » July 30th, 2018, 10:28 am

Hey folks,

Totally new here, please excuse any misbehavior :)

So, I've been playing this game for the last months. I enjoy it very much, mainly because campaign narratives have depth and maps are well designed, but also because of its music. Although I'm a skilled musician and music composer, I must say this is my first attempt in the world of "virtual" orchestration (used Reason 10 and ewql essentialy). I'm submitting this track to your evaluation, and I would gladly receive any respectfull critics about it.

https://soundcloud.com/pluft/cry-from-elensefar

You can consider this as my natural response to the game. The whole idea just came to me while I was playing. Again, if music genre is not suitable or something like that, please excuse me. I tried my best, and this is not quite my musical environment, although I enjoy it very much.
Cheers!

User avatar
zookeeper
WML Wizard
Posts: 9739
Joined: September 11th, 2004, 10:40 pm
Location: Finland

Re: New music contribution

Post by zookeeper » July 30th, 2018, 2:34 pm

From a more or less layman standpoint, sounds good to me. Hopefully West will chime in for some helpful technical critique.

Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pluft » July 31st, 2018, 5:48 am

zookeeper wrote:
July 30th, 2018, 2:34 pm
From a more or less layman standpoint, sounds good to me. Hopefully West will chime in for some helpful technical critique.
Yes, hopefully. Thank you!

User avatar
nemaara
Discord Moderator
Posts: 190
Joined: May 31st, 2015, 2:13 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by nemaara » July 31st, 2018, 5:52 pm

It sounds good to me too, but I guess I can offer a couple comments (mostly little things that probably are just preference).

I like how you've used all the different instruments and voices, the orchestration is quite nice actually and you preserve the melodic line when switching instruments. The first thing I'd say about the instrument choice is that I've (personally) thought that Reason's and ewql's low brass has always been their weak point in sound quality, so I've always avoided using it as much as possible (again, might be personal preference thing). The winds and strings do sound nice, though. ^_^

Second, the plucked string instrument at the beginning (I'm not entirely sure what it is) sounds a little out of place to me, it would be nice to replace it with harpsichord/celesta/bells or something like that.

Development-wise, the only part that really sounded a bit odd to me was around 3:26-3:31; it doesn't quite fit with the rest of the piece for me. :hmm:

Overall, it sounds quite nice, it's easy to hear that you're an experienced composer! (Might add more comments later if I think of anything else)

User avatar
Sapient
Inactive Developer
Posts: 4453
Joined: November 26th, 2005, 7:41 am
Contact:

Re: New music contribution

Post by Sapient » July 31st, 2018, 9:55 pm

Impressive! I really enjoyed the intense and unique opening part of the song. Unique, but in a good way.

I also enjoyed the quiet, eerie part, although maybe it was a little too long? Not sure.

Finally, If I had one critique it would be that plucked instrument around 3:21-3:31 (guess I am agreeing with nemaara here, but disagree with nemaara's other critique that it didn't suit the beginning).

(Note: I am speaking just an ordinary listener, not as a musician/developer here)
http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/User:Sapient... "Looks like your skills saved us again. Uh, well at least, they saved Soarin's apple pie."

Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pluft » August 1st, 2018, 8:43 am

I must thank you guys for all the time and effort you put into listening and commenting on this piece. It means a lot.

Regarding the use of low brass, it is ewql only. Choirs are Voxos and some strings are Loegria. I used Reason patches only for those plucked instruments you're complaining about ;) - they were drawn from proppelerhead's new "ethnic" sampler called Pangea. I thank you for pointing that out, because I actually had to strive a bit to get used to them during composition process. Harp in middle is definitely ok, but those non-orchestral instruments pose a problem of being unrealistic. It is difficult to mix them up - if they are in the front, they don't stick with the orchestra, if they are in the background... well, what would be the point, right? Still, I find them important, as they add some sense of 'otherness' to the western feel of the orchestra, and this feature has its value in a game that is mainly about the clash of cultures. Listening again, these instruments sound a bit too harsh to my ears, I would go for some further work in mixing, and maybe try out some other similar samples.

This brief section around 3:21 is designed to be a retransition to the main theme. I wanted it to be unstable both harmonically and metrically, so listeners would get confused and then suddenly find themselves back in the heart of the music. Not an easy thing to do, especially because I'm not that used to compose in a sequencer. At this point, I like the result. But I'll keep nemaara's comment in mind.

About the eerie part beeing too long: original plan was to make it shorter, without the more mysterious flutes and choir section. This section came on the fly. I was picturing this music being played during gameplay, and I sometimes get annoyed (personally) by music that is too intense all the time when I'm trying to figure out my next move in the game. So I tried to create a slower, introspective section. But Sapient is not the first one to point out this proportion issue, so I will definitely will consider it more carefully. In any case, I am satisfied with musical flowing, and with the fact that different semantic environments succeed each other in time. If I was to work on form, I think I would rather extend the final section then cut out anything.

Please, let me know what you think about all this. And thanks for all the positive comments!

User avatar
Celtic_Minstrel
Developer
Posts: 1274
Joined: August 3rd, 2012, 11:26 pm
Contact:

Re: New music contribution

Post by Celtic_Minstrel » August 5th, 2018, 3:08 pm

This sounds really good! I find the opening to be a bit jarring (perhaps in large part because of that plucked instrument). I also wasn't so fond of the middle slow section; in places it was a bit hard to hear (even after turning up my volume), though that could be partly because my room's kinda noisy right now; and it also feels like it goes on a bit too long. Perhaps it could even be a bit faster in places? I'm not so sure on that one.
Author of The Black Cross of Aleron campaign and Default++ era.
Maintainer of Steelhive.

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3619
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pentarctagon » August 10th, 2018, 12:30 am

Just a note: mainline Wesnoth requires that any music be licensed under the CC BY-SA 4.0, whereas your soundcloud page says that this is licensed under the CC BY-NC 4.0. So musical merits aside, that is something that would need to be addressed prior to this being added to mainline.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pluft » August 10th, 2018, 8:39 am

Thanks for noticing, Pentarctagon. I see I messed up with license issue. Do you know how can I address it? Could I edit license terms or revoke first license and do it again? I mean, I have no other purpose with this music then put it in my portfolio and offer it to be used by people developing this game. I'm sorry for the inconvenience.

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3619
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pentarctagon » August 10th, 2018, 11:04 pm

It sounds like Creative Commons licenses are irrevocable, in the sense that it will always be available under the CC BY-NC license to anyone who possibly already downloaded it. Since you're the author though, I don't think there's any reason you couldn't change it to CC BY-SA.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pluft » August 17th, 2018, 8:55 am

Hello all,

Just touching base to announce that I changed the license to CC BY-SA, as pointed out by pentarctagon. Reginstration info can be found here: https://www.safecreative.org/work/18073 ... -elensefar.

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3619
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pentarctagon » September 2nd, 2018, 8:17 am

Well, I'm not sure what else specifically would need to be done at this point, since we don't currently have any active musician contributors and (as you can probably tell) there really isn't any standard process for getting new music added. I suppose it might help to have some specific places where it would be used in mainline.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Pluft
Posts: 6
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 10:04 am

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pluft » September 4th, 2018, 9:01 am

Ok, guys. Thanks for comments and all. Since I don't know either where to insert this music in the game, or even if there is a place where it should sit well, I just leave it at your disposal. If anyone should use it in a campaign or else, please tell me, so I can enjoy the result. My guess is that it should be used (maybe partially) for cut scenes and the like, because it might be too busy for background during gameplay.

No need to say, this music is also available for other projects as well. And I can myself edit it for whatever purposes.

All the best,
Bruno

User avatar
Pentarctagon
Forum Administrator
Posts: 3619
Joined: March 22nd, 2009, 10:50 pm
Location: Earth (occasionally)

Re: New music contribution

Post by Pentarctagon » September 29th, 2018, 12:30 am

Is this downloadable from somewhere directly? It doesn't seem to be downloadable from Soundcloud.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

Post Reply