Scenario 15: Save the King

Feedback for the mainline campaign Delfador’s Memoirs.

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Pewskeepski
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Pewskeepski » October 30th, 2011, 5:48 pm

You should probably just keep trying. This scenario is a bit unbalanced in that way, as Garard sometimes does a good job at staying alive, but then other times, he fails miserably.

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taptap
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by taptap » October 30th, 2011, 9:51 pm

As I said, I deleted the savefiles. I tried many times and Garard was never even close to surviving = I believe the only way to do it on difficult is by having a flying squad and I was proceeding very fast in several attempts. Removing poison, giving the western AI better movement - some roads in the woods (leading Garard to recognize him earlier), making Garard recruiting some more weak but cheap units, leaving him with more units overall (= statistically more even results) and a little more meat for the opponents to cut through, stopping Garards units to suicide in the water at the first opportunity to rush in there or making Garard playable by the player maybe if necessary with half the gold, would all be ideas to balance this better + give better terrain for movement around my initial castle.

This was 1.9.9, Great Mage (difficult).

(Or is it, that the scenario just increases the amount of gold of the enemy leaders and leave Garard as he is with increasing difficulty?)
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Pewskeepski
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Pewskeepski » October 31st, 2011, 7:56 pm

Try changing the default_config file so it sets recruitment_ignore_bad_combat, and recruitment_ignore_bad_movement to "yes". This makes teams use there full recruit lists unless modified within the scenario. I used it when I beat this.

For more info, see Maiklas3000's thread on this matter.

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taptap
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by taptap » November 1st, 2011, 12:27 pm

Pewskeepski wrote:Try changing the default_config file so it sets recruitment_ignore_bad_combat, and recruitment_ignore_bad_movement to "yes". This makes teams use there full recruit lists unless modified within the scenario. I used it when I beat this.

For more info, see Maiklas3000's thread on this matter.
This feels like cheating even if it isn't. I mean if a scenario (on highest difficulty) is unbeatable without modifying files, because of the performance of an allied AI, there is a balancing problem.
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Pewskeepski
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Pewskeepski » November 1st, 2011, 5:19 pm

Well, this campaign is short of a maintainer so I doubt this scenario will get changed anytime soon.

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Ninjuri
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Ninjuri » May 28th, 2012, 8:35 pm

Normal 1.10.2
Difficulty: 5
Objectives 100% clear
Dialogue: Good
Challenges: Getting across the river in time. For some reason the king send 90% of his units to fight in the villages to the east, leaving himself completely undefended. He took some poison but i was able to make it over there in time.
Fun:7
Changes: none
Reloads: none
Fate is against me.

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taptap
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by taptap » August 11th, 2012, 6:47 pm

Thanks for fixing this scenario, beetlenaut. Garard is now able to hold the first round of enemies at bay, though you have to handle the second round. The difficulty and the tension in the campaign drops from here on, so basically losses don't matter.
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WesnothNewbie
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by WesnothNewbie » December 20th, 2013, 4:35 pm

Content Feedback wrote:1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
(9) If you know a bit of the Wesnoth Markup Language - do you think that the WML of this scenario is clear and well commented? If not which part would you like to be documented better?
1. Medium, Wesnoth version 1.10.2.

2. 8. On this version and on this difficulty, it's hard. It seems easy at first--the Sovereign is killed quickly, and I didn't have too much difficulty in dealing with the trolls--but I can't save Garard, or whatever his name is. Sure, he fights off the first wave of attackers--although he takes quite a few casualties, since the AI is too stupid to make use of Level 5 Leadership--but it's the second wave of attackers that get him; it's basically a rush of level 2 units against him and his few survivors. Not fun. I had to cheat my way out of it: making Level 3 and 4 Drakes appear in the middle of the day, out of nowhere, was probably the only good thing in that.

3. Pretty clear. Kill everything; don't let Garard die.

4. It was okay, but as mentioned, the Sovereign had no personality at all.

5. Garard not dying.

6. 4. It's nice at the beginning, but sucks at the end.

7. Basically, don't give the Orcs a second wave! It'd also be more fun if Zorlan tries to stay alive. Oh and one more thing: leadership is almost useless for Garard. Turn him into a tank, preferably with no weakness to fire.

8. See above.

9. Haven't checked out the WML for this one, but the other scenarios had clean code. I'd just recommend commenting sections--e.g. "here is the log of moves", "here are the friendly characters"; "here the enemies" etc.
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vanatteveldt
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by vanatteveldt » July 25th, 2014, 10:31 am

(1) Version: Medium, 1.10
(2) Difficulty: 7
(3) Clarity: perfect
(4) storyline: fine
(5) Challenges:

Keep Garard alive. Although the 'walktrough' suggests that Garard should survive fine on his own, he didn't in the two times I tried the scenario. The first run, I killed Vorlan and moved east to the troll king with my main force, but Garard was killed a couple turns later. The second try I immediately crossed the river after killing Vorlan and was able to rescue Garad, but I don't think he would have survived another turn (he only had two bowmen left and was surrounded by orcs).

Apart from that, the enemy is weak against l3 units and good tactics, so it was easy to kill the remaining enemies.

One problem is that even though I only recalled 7 units (starting only with 150 gold), I had large negative income most of the time and again ended without any money, so I hope that the next scenarios will be forgiving.

(6) fun: 7
(7) changes: maybe place a real ford instead of shallow water to make crossing a bit easier?

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flammstrudel
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by flammstrudel » October 9th, 2014, 6:51 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
1.10.3 hard (Great Mage - Difficult)
100 gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
8

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Being flanked by level 3 trolls. That can really ruin your day. Replayed this scenario several times, because I lost so many good units and was dissatisfied.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8/10 The second wave of bad guys. I wish more scenarios would implement this. You are unlikely to lose the mission, because the allied AI fails to defend itself before you could join the fight – well done.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Don't know.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
High losses.
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D-Wade
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by D-Wade » November 15th, 2014, 12:13 pm

1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
1.10.7 - Normal

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
4 - It looked harder than it was. The king's troops did a good job although they once left him open to attacks from the southwest.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
I like the story, especially the bits in the end.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Basically you're hoping that the AI does a good job. If that's the case, you just have to steamroll all enemy leaders. If not, well then you're screwed.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8 - Looked more challenging than it was but still nice and quick.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
I noticed some serious lag when the king's troops had their turn. Don't know what it was but it only happened with his troops. If possible, try to remove it.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
No.

Violet-n-red
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Violet-n-red » July 3rd, 2015, 8:24 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?
1.12.2, normal, enough gold to hire a scout and a round of archers.
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
very clear
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
good enough, although i feel liek some part of it is missing when two bottom orcish leaders suddenly gets their camps refilled while they have negative amount of gold. something about the second wave of assault?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
to deal with all the threats as fast as possible, of course! a horde of 1lvl archers was perfect, as they had great defence in forest to hodl for first few turns, enough ranged damage to poke at every thing that can't shoot back and enoguh movement speed to traverse rough terrain. only one or two of them died, it was great! oh, and a lone scout had to bait out half of the purple army. RIP, Glion, your sacrifice will not be forgotten.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
maybe add some dialogue for when tw obottom leaders gets reinforcements? they could not hire them, because they had negative income and negative amount of gold.
also, king's forces were not very bright, but that's OK because they were keeping the king perfectly safe most of the time. they just did not go into offencive when most enemies were defeated and were not trying to finish off remaining forces stanhding a bit away.
(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?
none.

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Sire
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Sire » September 5th, 2015, 2:54 am

BoW Version: 1.12.4
Difficulty: Apprentice (Normal)

Perceived Difficulty: Easy
- Garard held off the southern enemies easily, perhaps due to the early trigger of his Personal Guards (a wolf rider went on the right tile to trigger it).
- As I had a good recall list as well as the human units from the previous scenario, it was easy to press the offensive and destroy the enemy.
- Also, Normal is the easiest difficulty in this campaign. I keep thinking I should play on Hard mode...

Objectives: Clear

Story: Fair
- The story is good, but perhaps I have been spoiled by more story-driven (heavy text) campaigns.

Challenges:
- Only one, and that is the unexpected gold boost the enemy leaders get on turn 10 or so. I was positioned to take out the south western leader before the troops showed up.
- Some sort of warning to the player (and context) would be appreciated.

Changes:
- Give warning to the player when the "gold boost" happens.

WML Coding:
- Seems like solid code, the comments are appreciated. (Still, give warning about the second wave!)
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shadow12
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by shadow12 » December 8th, 2015, 9:06 am

(1) What difficulty level and version? middle mode, whatever it's called here. Ver 1.0.4 for iOS.

(2) How difficult? (1-10)
10 when Garard died by turn 6.
7 when I could play through.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives? clear, kill all enemy leaders
(4) How clear and interesting?
The storyline is interesting, learning about Delfdor's adventures. Delfador is worried about the open doorway to the dead so we will see what he does next.

(5) Major challenges?
The wiki said that Garard is strong enough on his own, but twice in a row he got killed by turn 6 and ended the game before my guys had a chance to get to him. On turn 6 my army was halfway across the river. The dialog gives a couple of strong hints to hurry to Garard. I don't think my army could get to him by turn 6 even if we had a clear path. The mages are especially slow crossing the river. It didn't help that 5 bowling Trolls were doing their best to squash everyone.

The 4 white mages, high lord and shock trooper were a nice bonus. Recalled a combo of level 3 & 4's including a shyde, a sylph and an enchantress.

Played a third time. This time Garard's army did a good job protecting him. When my guys got there on turn 8, he did not want to move from his post. Around turn 10 when a second wave of enemies hit, I had to protect his butt while fighting bad guys. It worked out ok - it gave me a chance to level up some troops.

Ended on turn 23/30. Started with 16 units and finished with 13 units, including 4 Mages of Light and 2 Enchantresses, hopefully can recall them later.

It was a fun scenario -- as long as Garard didn't die right away. Not sure how this could be changed because it seems to be a matter of luck how well his army does to protect him.
Sometimes life unexpectedly throws a Troll or a nasty Queen Naga in your path.

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Flameslash
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Re: Scenario 15: Save the King

Post by Flameslash » March 28th, 2018, 10:27 pm

(1) What difficulty levels have you played the scenario on?

Medium, 1.12.6

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

Six out of ten. A decent challenge, but I got through it on my first try.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

Save the King, kill the baddies. Got it.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

Generally pretty solid, but not all that interesting. The King didn't have much to say about the alliance with the elves.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Getting to the King before he died; not that this was hugely challenging, but I think his army got pretty lucky on a few occasions.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

Seven out of ten. There's a good challenge, and the threat to the King forces you to take it at a good pace and push forward; which broke me out of my usually more defensive tactics.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

I would have liked to have the King say a bit more - reacting to the alliance with the elves, maybe some context-specific dialog depending on how the battle around his keep is going. In terms of the gameplay, there isn't much I'd change.

(8) Was there any event that caused you to lose the game and forced you to reload or restart the scenario?

No. I had to go back a turn because I advanced Delfador too far, but that was a tactical mistake, not the scenario.

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