Elemental Faction?

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Elemental Faction?

Postby WTL » March 11th, 2006, 10:39 pm

I thought to myself "What don't I see much of."

And I realized it was Elementals.

But an elemental faction seems a little far out there. Sort of "why would these creatures all bind together, I think there'd actually be a good deal of enmity actually".

But there didn't seem to be an actual board to post individual unit ideas, so I thought I'd bring it here.

Anyways, its kind of out there anyways. The basic idea is that you have 4 units (fire, earth, wind, water) which can move in different directions, however the same units (level 1 fire elemental and level 1 earth elemental) could advance to the same unit through choices (level 2 magma elemental). The idea being when their level occurs they can either mix elements or just get stronger at their current element.

This leads to literally dozens of permutations. 4 level 1 -> 16 level 2 -> GodOnlyKnowsHowMany level 3. I was thinking of caping the mixture at level 2, and then only straight improvement at level 3.

Anyways, it may or may not be a faction. However, I think the use of having elementals in Wesnoth may be... well... useful. So here's the idea.

Elementals

Earth - Stone - Mountain
-Magma - Molten
-Mud - Clay
-Dust Devil - Sandstorm
Fire - Blaze - Inferno
-Magma - Molten
-Heat - Scorching
-Boiling - Steam
Water - Wave - Tidal
-Storm - Hurricane
-Mud - Clay
-Boiling - Steam
Air - Gust - Whrilwind
-Heat - Scorching
-Storm - Hurricane
-Dust Devil - Sandstorm

Now the idea isn't so much that they be a faction, but that they be an available semi-neutral (meaning non-recruitable but findable) unit that can go a number of directions.

That looks like a whole ton of units, its actually only 24, which is still a whole lot, but not as many as it looks like.

Now it might be easier to smallify it. Taking out a few combinations (Fire and Water (Boiling/Steam) seeming a little silly to me).

Any critiques, comments, or ideas?
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Postby Ranger M » March 11th, 2006, 10:42 pm

download the summoners era to get a quick start with some graphics, as far as i know it isn't maintained anymore, so they are up for grabs.

if you can't get them for whatever reason then I'll post them here as a .zip file.
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Postby WTL » March 23rd, 2006, 6:23 am

I couldn't find much from the Summoners, maybe I'm looking in the wrong spot. All I could find were the two golems and the green summoner or green mage dude. But I'm not very good with this "internet thing" :?

In lieu of having the work already done by someone else, I came up with these three. The earth elemental advances to the Magma Elemental. And with the Air elemental its hard to see mainly because I used a semi-transparent brush with white. Instead of giving it a [hide] command everywhere (which would suck for anyone else) I just made it difficult but not impossible to see, at least hopefully not impossible. The eyes are supposed to make life easier for the opposing team.
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Elemental-Air copy.jpg
blue background added to make life easier
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elemental-earth.png
elemental-earth.png (4.96 KiB) Viewed 8591 times
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Postby Ranger M » March 23rd, 2006, 7:46 am

there are way more than that.

This is the origional era, just extract this in your campaign folder, and then try it in multiplayer to see all of them.
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Postby diekil » March 23rd, 2006, 5:07 pm

Man finally got my pc working again and what do i see? An idea that was going on in my mind posted bye sombothy else. Aroe you a minde reader???? I really like the idea the only problem that i notice is their relationship with each other. So I have some questions: IS evry tipe rival? (i would think not becous they take elements from the other types.) But what about this: Are the total fire dudes rivals of the other becous they didn't wan't to combine with them???? And could i use it in my era i am making with the field dwarfs? and last but nt least cwould you like to help me out with the graphics for that faction?,,

Thats all for today

greetz
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Postby WTL » March 23rd, 2006, 11:30 pm

What I was shooting for isn't so much an actual playing faction (although it could be) as an added element(al) for compaigns. I thought maybe some cave areas could use earth elementals and maps with alot of ocean could use water elementals. There aren't any opposing types as I have planned (even mixed fire and water... creepy).

Just got a first look at the summoners era. Its amazing how similar the graphic concepts are!
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Postby WTL » March 27th, 2006, 12:00 am

Molten Elemental. Not entirely sure what to do with the bottom half of him, the lava is supposed to be kind of coming up from the ground, holding him aloft.

Also the stones that make up his "torso" need to be shaded, I can get to that eventually.

Any idea for decent stats for these three (Earth-> Lava-> Molten)?
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Postby Ken_Oh » March 27th, 2006, 4:09 am

I was watching the Chronicles of Riddick last week and thought of what an elemental faction would be like.

What would their damage types and resistances/weaknesses be like? Here's what I generally thought:

Earth:
damage - impact
weakness - pierce (think of a jackhammer)
resistance - fire and/or cold

Fire:
damage - fire
weakness - cold and/or impact (stamp out a fire)
resistance - fire (duh)

Water:
damage - impact and/or cold
weakness - impact (think a river dam) or maybe even cold (which freezes water)
resistance - pierce and/or fire (water puts out fire, but really hard to get enough fire to boil water)

Air:
damage - pierce and/or blade
weakness - fire (flames consume oxygen)
resistance - They'd probably have high all around resistances, and super high vs pierce.

From there you could make level ups an option to combine elements like Water and Earth to make a Mud Elemental, Water and Air to make a Hurricane or Earth and Fire to make a Lava Elemental.

Take those thoughts how you will. Best of luck to working the faction.
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Postby Flametrooper » March 27th, 2006, 4:09 am

You know, I was just about to make a golem faction...and you posted this. Dang. :shock:
Anyway. I had thought of a tree something like this:
Code: Select all
Fire Golem->Inferno Golem->Volcano Golem (Fire Meele atack, throws fire boulders at L2, resist fire)

Rock Golem->Rock Golem Warrior*->Great Rock Golem*

Air Elemental->Storm Elemental->Tempest Elemental(stronger attacks, flies)
                   ->Shadow Elemental->Elemental Wisp(Nightstalk[?],skirmish)

Water Elemental->Ocean Elemental->Tsunami Elemental(swims)
                       ->Ice Elemental->Blizzard elemental(doesn't swim as well, does better on snow, and has Cold Slowing attacks(freeze).)

Golem Summoner->Golem Commander->Golem Lord(human, leadership, moderate magic/meele)



Im not saying this is how you have to make it, its just that was the tree for the elemental faction I was making, and you can use some of that.

Note: All units with * need better names.
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Postby catwhowalksbyhimself » March 27th, 2006, 4:13 am

How about
Rock Golem->Granite Golem->Diamond Golem

I will point out, however, that golems and elementals are actually two different things.
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Postby Dragon Master » March 27th, 2006, 7:36 pm

golems are created using an element or aspect, like you could make an iron golem or even flesh golem.
elementals are magical embodiements of the natural elements I.E. air, water, fire, or earth and or any aspects of them (like magma, lightning, ice, etc. )
It would however be cool if you made light and darkness elementals, and order and choas elementals
just my two cents
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Postby catwhowalksbyhimself » March 27th, 2006, 9:11 pm

golems are created using an element or aspect, like you could make an iron golem or even flesh golem.
elementals are magical embodiements of the natural elements I.E. air, water, fire, or earth and or any aspects of them (like magma, lightning, ice, etc. )

Correct. You sir, have just won the grand prize of Absolutely Nothing! That's because I'm cheap.
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Postby WTL » March 27th, 2006, 9:48 pm

Ken Oh wrote:I was watching the Chronicles of Riddick last week and thought of what an elemental faction would be like.

What would their damage types and resistances/weaknesses be like? Here's what I generally thought:

Earth:
damage - impact
weakness - pierce (think of a jackhammer)
resistance - fire and/or cold


I don't know about earth elementals being weak to piercing. You've got to remember what sort of things to piercing damage in Wesnoth. Arrows, spears, daggersm, rapiers, flying thorns, etc etc. If I had to fight a giant living rock, I would not take arrows to do it with. I was thinking more likely a high resistance against pierce and blade. Normal resistance to impact, and a minor weakness to ice, since freezing a rock can harden the any moisture inside the rock, and expand the ice, exploding it. I figured he'd just be a damage soaker the didn't hit too too hard (or often).

By the way, what exactly about the Chronicles of Riddick inspired you to a golem faction?
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Postby Flametrooper » March 27th, 2006, 10:30 pm

Earth should be weak to fire, since you can melt rock with enough heat, and besides, it fits the sort of image of "strong against normal damage, weak to magic" image that most people think of when they think of golems.

And, most elementals shouldnt get the 20% holy resistance that all living units get, since theyre not really living. But then again, they're not quite "undead" either, since theyre not reanimated dead warriors. Maybe 0% vs Holy?
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Postby Ken_Oh » March 29th, 2006, 12:33 am

WTL wrote:
Ken Oh wrote:I was watching the Chronicles of Riddick last week and thought of what an elemental faction would be like.

What would their damage types and resistances/weaknesses be like? Here's what I generally thought:

Earth:
damage - impact
weakness - pierce (think of a jackhammer)
resistance - fire and/or cold


I don't know about earth elementals being weak to piercing. You've got to remember what sort of things to piercing damage in Wesnoth. Arrows, spears, daggersm, rapiers, flying thorns, etc etc. If I had to fight a giant living rock, I would not take arrows to do it with. I was thinking more likely a high resistance against pierce and blade. Normal resistance to impact, and a minor weakness to ice, since freezing a rock can harden the any moisture inside the rock, and expand the ice, exploding it. I figured he'd just be a damage soaker the didn't hit too too hard (or often).

By the way, what exactly about the Chronicles of Riddick inspired you to a golem faction?


There is an Elemental race in Riddick. The only one you see is Judi Dench's character.

You're right about the damage. I was thinking the same thing, that an Earth Elemental would have high resistances to everything in general. Who knows, you'd have to balance it all out somehow.
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