Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

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Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Content Feedback » March 10th, 2006, 12:59 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby mstefek » July 18th, 2006, 11:50 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
medium, 1.1.7
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
5
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Not so clear, since I didn't know where should I go. I had to replay the scenario when I realized that the orks are located in the east and all my units were to far to the west.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Ok.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Not getting killed on the bridge, also I couldn't take advantage of my cavalary in the mountaints.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
3 - You have to know where you should go, I lost too much time hoping that there is something interesting on the west side of my starting position.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The abandoned castle is unnecessary. I don't belive that you can get there with positive amount of money. If there was a way to get there faster...
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Postby Jgrr » July 27th, 2006, 6:36 pm

(1) medium, 1.1.7
(2) not very difficult, 5
(3) clear, the shroud was not much trouble
(4) where did the drakes come from? (or was that another translation error) and why would owaec suggest going to that abandoned castle?
(5) trolls on the mountains at night
(6) fun (7)
(7) the gryphon was kind of lonely, maybe cheer him up a bit. :)
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Jami » March 25th, 2007, 4:47 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
- Normal
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
-6ish, crossing the bridge without losing my Arch and red mages was fun.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
-Clear, but it took me three reloads to find the troll castle
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
-Defeat the gryphons? I only saw drakes... and weak ones at that.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
-Not being stupid with my General.
-Leveling up a horseman to a Paladin in one scenerio. (=O)
-keeping my mages alive on the ice
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
-8
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
-Add a path to the trolls.

(Please do not reply if you are not running 1.1.1+svn, as there have been changes to the scenario since previous versions.)
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Postby cph » June 16th, 2007, 8:44 pm

1) Medium, 1.2.4
2) 7
3) The stated objectives are clear; finding where the enemies are you have to beat is more tricky
4) Okay
5) First fight with the trolls in the mountains was tricky; apart from that combat itself was no problem.

Working out where to go, and with what troops, was harder. I got to the abandoned castle on turn 26 or so, having seen nothing of the Troll leader and having no idea where he was (initially I assumed the abandoned castle was his, and he had wandered off into the surrounding mountains). I had to reload back from about turn 14 or so, and spend a while just wandering units around until finding the Troll castle; and then reload again to make a serious attack on it.

Since my recall list is mainly knights, white mages, and HI (with just a few swordsmen/pikemen with holy attacks), I had little available that had move 2 in mountains (and the opening dialog didn't strongly hint to me that I would need them). Dacyn in particular has move 5, and Owaec can't participate in the mountains at all.

Fortunately I had recalled a quick red mage, so he, one swordsman, and Gweddry were sent over the mountains to tackle the Troll leader, while the motley collection of move 5 spearmen that lived through the opening fight marched south and killed the Gryphon.

6) 5
7) I guess the fact that the initial wave of trolls came from the NE should have tipped me off to the location of the troll base, so perhaps it's okay as is.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby YoFiffy » May 10th, 2008, 6:16 pm

(1) Hardest
(2) 8; there is nothing too difficult about killing either of the leaders. But at the beginning, there are way too many griffons. It was impossible to shield wounded units because the griffons would just fly around back and gain up on them. You might kill 4 griffons and a troll one turn, and the next turn 5 more griffons come and finish off all your units. There is no money to recruit more units later on. I had to cheat to get past this initial onslaught, but the rest of it was relatively easy. I also considered going east over the mountains, but this was not realistic with my unit types. I would have used all my turns just getting to the griffon leader.
(3) Clear enough.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
There is not really a compelling story leading up to them taking refuge on the island, e.g., a plan for what to do when they get there other than hide from the undead for the rest of time. Which doesn't even make sense because undead can cross water, and there are plenty of shallow crossings.

Also, it's lame that trolls show up at the end. I thought this was said to be an island, devoid of any enemy presence except the wild beasts who live there? Not coherent at all.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

see above

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

2. I would pick the other branch of the campaign next time to avoid this scenario.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

More coherent story line, a better arena for fighting off the initial onslaught, e.g., can put your back to high mountains where the griffons can't get around. It worked well to force the enemies on the snow and mine on the grass, but I was using iron maulers, so they were about as weak defensively, even so.

(Please do not reply if you are not running 1.1.1+svn, as there have been changes to the scenario since previous versions.)
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Jozrael » May 20th, 2008, 2:46 pm

YoFiffy wrote:Please do not reply if you are not running 1.1.1+svn, as there have been changes to the scenario since previous versions.


???
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby zookeeper » May 20th, 2008, 2:50 pm

Jozrael wrote:
YoFiffy wrote:Please do not reply if you are not running 1.1.1+svn, as there have been changes to the scenario since previous versions.


???

Wow. Kinda old stuff. I removed it.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Benefuchs » February 24th, 2009, 10:54 pm

I have played this scenario now about three times and have always been defeated by turn 30 after having killed every enemy except for the Griffon leader. Where the heck does the Griffon leader hide?? :?
(Playing version 1.2.8 , medium)
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby zookeeper » February 25th, 2009, 7:41 am

Benefuchs wrote:I have played this scenario now about three times and have always been defeated by turn 30 after having killed every enemy except for the Griffon leader. Where the heck does the Griffon leader hide?? :?
(Playing version 1.2.8 , medium)

No idea. Don't play on an ancient Wesnoth? :annoyed: Get 1.5.11 or wait a couple of weeks for the real 1.6 release.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby sabalzen » May 1st, 2009, 12:29 pm

1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Easy, 1.6
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
6 or so, but I reloaded a couple of times during the initial griffon/troll attacks and to kill the troll leader as I could only get a couple of units that far in time. I don't think I could do it without reloading with the units I had.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
The stated objectives are clear enough, how to go about it isn't clear at all.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Very little dialog and no story, this isn't a particularly strong scenario. The abandoned castle and the dialog that go with it are pointless as by the time you find it you have no money and no time left. The 'shroud' makes no sense apart from making the scenario more difficult and ensuring that success is more due to luck than judgement.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
3 griffons or 3 trolls could kill any of my units in one turn at any time of day, so the initial rushes were tough, and taking to the bridge was just suicide until they had all gone.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
3. Not one of my favourites by a long way.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Slow down the initial rushes of trolls and gryphons, so that they only appear one at a time (at least on easy), but keep appearing for much longer. Make it easier to get to and find the trolls, or more simply, just take the shroud off, as I don't see what its justification is and it serves nothing apart from frustrating the player. Warn that you will need mountaineering troops, maybe even provide a friendly dwarf guide or two. Add 10 turns (at least) to the time limit so that the abandoned castle can actually be useful, or move it much closer to the start.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Maiklas3000 » July 12th, 2010, 9:36 pm

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
challenging; 1.8.3

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
9

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
Clear.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
Are trolls considered to be orcs? The dialog seems to say so.

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
It took me many attempts to finally survive the Griffon assault. Just two Griffons can take out any of my critical units, so they spend their time cowering behind my strained lines. Between this and LoW's "Cliffs of Thoria", I have concluded that if a Griffon comes swooping out of the fog, the thing to do is RUN! Where there is one Griffon, there will be more, so back away from the edge of the fog and form a line.

The troll assault is well timed to strain the wounded troops after they have finished off the Griffons.

The hide-n-seek mop up operation is not really more interesting than a normal mop up operation.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
7

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
Have the leaders hold some gold in reserve until you come near their keeps.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby monochromatic » July 20th, 2010, 7:38 pm

turin wrote:(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
Normal 1.8.3
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
2 - Knights and Shock Troopers tore through most of the troops anyway.
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
As with the 2nd scenario. Without knoeing it, it's not clear, bur upon knowing the map opon clear.
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
They're both the same as ever.
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Gryphons. That's about it. The trolls somehow liked water a lot in this scenario.
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
8 - I like hide and seek scenarios.
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
As is.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Thrash » July 22nd, 2010, 4:58 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?

1.8.3, Medium, 366 starting gold

(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)

8, several restarts.

(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?

It's the usual kill everyone, but you just don't know where they are.

(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?

I don't get it, suddenly we're running to some island, where we're going to live happily ever after?

(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?

Griffins diving in at in opportune times. I managed to be in good shape for the first wave, but they can really screw you over when they show up later out of the fog, and given the terrain and time pressure, it's hard to walk around in tight formations.

Finding the chiefs. First time I wandered all of the northlands only to find an empty fort and then ran out of time never finding the griffins.

(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)

5 The bridge is a little different and fun.

(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?

Drop a clue as to where the griffins are.
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Re: Scenario Review - EI: Lake Vrug

Postby Arawn » November 10th, 2010, 6:57 am

(1) What difficulty levels and game versions have you played the scenario on?
1.8.5 Easy
(2) How difficult did you find the scenario? (1-10)
Good. ~4
(3) How clear did you find the scenario objectives?
9
(4) How clear and interesting did you find the dialog and storyline of the scenario?
10 Nothing wrong I can think of
(5) What were your major challenges in meeting the objectives of the scenario?
Usually not getting my units killed. But that's nothing new
(6) How fun do you think the scenario is? (1-10)
4
(7) What, if any, are changes you would have made to the scenario to make it more fun?
The main reason I'm posting this is because I felt it crossed a bit of a line that the hero was willing to kill gryphons just to facilitate running away like a coward. Personally, I would have liked to see him turn around and fight back around scenario 1 but that would require completely revamping the campaign so I won't even try to ask for that. But attempting to survive an undead invasion by hiding on an island seemed really cowardly, especially agreeing to kill gryphons for it. It's not that I had any particular fondness for gryphons but between the undead and the gryphons, our heroes seem to have made the wrong choice. Wouldn't it make more sense if the island was occupied by orcs/nagas/undead that outran the heroes?
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