Unit Names

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Pagawan
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Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

I propose the review of unit names and re-assignments to proper names that take the units faction into consideration. For example the Dwarvish 'GuardsMAN' should simply be a 'Dwarvish Guard'. The suffix man doesn't really make sense here. The same applies to Orcish Crossbowmen. There might be others too that need the proper name assignment.

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EarthCake
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Re: Unit Names

Post by EarthCake »

I wouldn't agree with Orcish Crossbowman. Orcish Crossbow really doesn't make sense.

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Pagawan
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

I think it does. The suffix 'man' cannot be used in a name of an orc. Maybe call it Orcish Arbelast then.

SnipeSmash
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Re: Unit Names

Post by SnipeSmash »

Crossboworc, guarddwarf, spearelf, are these any good?

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Pagawan
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

Orcish Crossbow/ Heavyarcher, Dwarvish Guard and I never saw Elvish Spear... But there you go, a name that clearly communicates the unit type and race

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Celtic_Minstrel
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Celtic_Minstrel »

I disagree on the root premise here. To me the word "man" only requires that the person described is male, not that they're human (though it does require them to be humanoid). I mostly wouldn't change these, though "guardsman" could perhaps change. And its not like there's any confusion about the race, because it's right there in the first word.
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Pentarctagon
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pentarctagon »

We're not going to be renaming core units that are used by who knows how much UMC without a very good reason, regardless of anything else.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

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Pagawan
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

Pentarctagon wrote:
November 15th, 2019, 3:50 am
We're not going to be renaming core units that are used by who knows how much UMC without a very good reason, regardless of anything else.
I thought the game was committed to always improve; from units basics (hp, resistances, animations etc), the world (maps, terrain etc), GUI etc. Surely even the names could be always improved (where necessary). The Wesnoth Community have seen such changes happen (most currently on dunefolk) across various units types, especially for Ageless Era. I'm pretty sure the few Default factions wouldn't end the world if some changes were implemented.

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Ravana
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Ravana »

I dont understand your point how Ageless is involved in this discussion.

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Pagawan
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

Ravana wrote:
November 17th, 2019, 11:05 am
I dont understand your point how Ageless is involved in this discussion.
I'm giving an example of how the changes there were implemented and everyone got used to them... :roll:

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Ravana
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Ravana »

There are less than 10 people who create addons which explicitly rely on ageless names.

Tad_Carlucci
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Tad_Carlucci »

@Pagawan

"We're not going to be renaming ..." should not be taken as a hard and fast prohibition but an example of the resistance.

We just went through a major renaming for the Dunefolk. It took a long time for it to come about and we're still dealing with the aftermath.

There might be cases where certain units might want to be renamed. But it's not going to be a quick suggestion and everyone jumps on board. It will take a lot to show there actually is a need, either within the existing system or as part of a larger goal. There are considerations beyond just the name. There is a vast body of work based upon the existing structure which we don't want to needlessly break and, often, cannot, ourselves, fix.
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GunChleoc
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Re: Unit Names

Post by GunChleoc »

If the unit has a female version, call that version "... Crossbowwoman". Problem solved. The race prefixes already make it clear that we're not talking about humans here.

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Pentarctagon
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pentarctagon »

Pagawan wrote:
November 17th, 2019, 9:57 am
Pentarctagon wrote:
November 15th, 2019, 3:50 am
We're not going to be renaming core units that are used by who knows how much UMC without a very good reason, regardless of anything else.
I thought the game was committed to always improve; from units basics (hp, resistances, animations etc), the world (maps, terrain etc), GUI etc. Surely even the names could be always improved (where necessary). The Wesnoth Community have seen such changes happen (most currently on dunefolk) across various units types, especially for Ageless Era. I'm pretty sure the few Default factions wouldn't end the world if some changes were implemented.
You have to demonstrate how it would be an improvement though. In this case, changing the unit's name would likely affect many people's add-ons, and in exchange the "man" part of the name would be removed from units that can only be male in-game anyway. That doesn't seem like a worthwhile trade-off.
99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs
take one down, patch it around
-2,147,483,648 little bugs in the code

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Pagawan
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Re: Unit Names

Post by Pagawan »

Pentarctagon wrote:
November 22nd, 2019, 1:14 am
Pagawan wrote:
November 17th, 2019, 9:57 am
Pentarctagon wrote:
November 15th, 2019, 3:50 am
We're not going to be renaming core units that are used by who knows how much UMC without a very good reason, regardless of anything else.
I thought the game was committed to always improve; from units basics (hp, resistances, animations etc), the world (maps, terrain etc), GUI etc. Surely even the names could be always improved (where necessary). The Wesnoth Community have seen such changes happen (most currently on dunefolk) across various units types, especially for Ageless Era. I'm pretty sure the few Default factions wouldn't end the world if some changes were implemented.
You have to demonstrate how it would be an improvement though. In this case, changing the unit's name would likely affect many people's add-ons, and in exchange the "man" part of the name would be removed from units that can only be male in-game anyway. That doesn't seem like a worthwhile trade-off.
We all have to agree the names (and game in general) are not perfect.
The game has indicated a presence of different languages and tongues used by the various races found in Wesnoth (an example is that river Arkan-thoria *spelling might be wrong*. It has a different name to the Elves, Humans and I believe orcs too). This can be expanded to include some of this units names. The current naming trend is very much bland and unimaginative. Wouldnt it be so much more exciting and immersing to explore wesnoth while discovering units from different races, not only with good looking avatars traits etc but also unique names that tickle the players sense of adventure? :geek:

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