Some comments on that game?
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Some comments on that game?
This was definitely my longest game on isars cross, took ~40 turns until we both agreed on who was the winner.
Since green and red survived longest, i would be happy if You can give some comments about how we played, and how we could have changed the game.
I(red) had a good unit advantage for most time of the game. And altough i leveled two dwarfs up to level three i never had the feeling that i could kill him, until ~turn 35 when i trapped a big part of units in the old castle of purple, and i could level a berz. I was three or four times in front of the enemy castle, but i never could get trought it (at least i think. If you point out when i had a good opportunity to kill him i'd really like to know.)
Thx to everybody who takes his time and watches this.
Since green and red survived longest, i would be happy if You can give some comments about how we played, and how we could have changed the game.
I(red) had a good unit advantage for most time of the game. And altough i leveled two dwarfs up to level three i never had the feeling that i could kill him, until ~turn 35 when i trapped a big part of units in the old castle of purple, and i could level a berz. I was three or four times in front of the enemy castle, but i never could get trought it (at least i think. If you point out when i had a good opportunity to kill him i'd really like to know.)
Thx to everybody who takes his time and watches this.
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Re: Some comments on that game?
First of all: If you are looking for a true analysis of play and useful advice, isars cross is not a very good map as it offers very little strategic flexibility. As a result much of this will probably be little quibbles about recruiting style and minor tactical notes which will probably not be overly useful in any other given game with a completely different tactical situation. Also 2vs2s are a pain to try to take apart because it is harder to break up the responsibility in any given situation. That being said I’ll give it a go. It will be a long post.
Turn 1:
red: On such a small map money might be better spent on something other than a griffon however I doubt that it will be overly crippling.
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 2:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 3:
red: Even if the guardsmen would be of little use near the front, he’d be more use there than in back.
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 4:
red: I generally find that around this time it’s good to get an ulfserker to force the undead to be careful with their non-skeleton units.
blue: No Comment
green: Not sure why he decided to occupy that piece of terrain. It offered no real advantage and kind of exposed his units to retaliation.
purple: May have been a better idea to get a unit that would be more effective against drake enemies, then again considering that the drake enemy is fond of saurians it probably won’t be too big a problem.
Turn 5:
red: I’d think it would be slightly more advantageous to put a fighter where you put the guardsman and attack the skeleton. Although it wouldn’t be quite as tough and would take more retaliation it would be a greater deterrent to counter attack. No skeleton or ghoul would hesitate to attack a guardsman, even at day, but a fighter will hit either of them back pretty hard.
blue: No Comment
green: No comment
purple: I think he would have gotten more mileage sending the burner that attacked the ghoul to attack the ghost. There were several units present who could finish off the ghoul however none of reds units are good at ghosts. Should have put his leader on the other village to prevent theft.
Turn 6:
red: Leaving your village open for theft there was probably a mistake. He can easily plop a ghoul or something else annoying to remove in it and both have a lock on the channel your reinforcements come through and syphon gold which would either force you to attack into a tough situation or slow down your reinforcements.
blue: No Comment
green: Instead of taking a safe but only slightly advantageous strategy mentioned in my note on red he chooses to go after your leader. This was a risk on his part as he stands to lose quite a bit for little substantial gain if it fails. I am thinking that were his troops in slightly better condition it may have been more worthwhile however you will probably be able to escape and the net effect will be that he will have forced your leader to stay out of the fight for awhile.
purple: No Comment
Turn 7:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: It may have been a mistake to move the skeleton that was blocking blues burner but then again that skeleton was cannon fodder if it stayed so not good either way.
purple: That skeleton was cannon fodder anyway it seems. It is worth noting that greens dark adepts pose a serious threat to purple however it is a fairly safe bet that they will be busy trying to kill red.
Turn 8:
red: The griffon had a much higher CTK on the ghost than the fighter.
blue: No Comment
green: Failing to kill that guard there is going to hurt him down the line.
purple: I’m thinking that purple probably wanted to bring at least one drake back with his leader so that blue cannot as easily deny him his recruit.
Turn 9:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: Has not been having good luck this game.
purple: Should have retreated. Two drakes vs that many saurians and a dark adept even at dawn would be suicide.
Turn 10:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: Could have made a decent bid for his own keep back however even with his fortune in leveling the clasher there will be no good way for either of you to stop blue from taking purples villages. Of course, concentrated force may be the way to go but I think that it might have been better to spread out to try to hold land and stave off excess enemy reinforcement.
Turn 11:
red: I’d probably have replaced the guardsman with a thunderer, may sound a little strange against undead but thunderers are actually fairly useful. They are the one unit you have that dark adepts do not like to attack, they can one shot walking corpses (if the enemy is inclined to use them), and take a decent chunk out of ghouls without being poisoned. They are a bit chancy and arn’t great at skeletons but you have plenty of units with hammers for those and thunders are better at attacking drakes. Also knowing that your enemy will soon have a dark sorcerer out I would defiantly have gotten an ulfserker which is one of the few level 1s that can take one of those out all by itself in one turn with fair reliability (also, can still always autokill careless adepts)
blue: Could have made better use of the leadership ability there. Also, if the last skirmisher isn’t going to fight it should retreat to somewhere where it could heal.
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 12:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 13:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 14:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 15:
red: No Comment
blue: There is no way to activate friendly fire.
green: Risky to run the mage away, it will mostly likely surivve but it might get stalked by the skirmisher and even if it survives it likely won’t have much health to survive the inevitable day attack that is coming, might be better to take a kill while you can get it.
purple: No Comment
Turn 16:
red: Again your force is really missing it’s berserkers, most every enemy on the field is vulnerable to them.
blue: No Comment
green: Not sure that the ghoul move really helped, if he wasn’t going to retreat it then perhaps he should have at least tried to poison one of the augers.
purple: No Comment
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: I’d consider the attack on the stalwart committing to an attack that you cannot profit from, on the other hand blue’s probably not going to get much better an opportunity to push you back.
green: No Comment
purple: In my previous evaluation I had expected purple to counter attack blue’s auger in the open to try to prevent it from leveling. There is no reason why red cannot kill it himself however the situation is not nearly as bad for blue as I had thought.
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: Probably would have been better for purple to leave that village open so that a dwarf could counter attack from there.
Turn 18: Around this point the northeast is on their knees. They can resist for quite awhile but I’m going to start turning my commentary to fast mode.
Turn 19: No Comment.
Turn 20: No Comment.
Turn 21: No Comment.
Turn 22: No Comment.
Turn 23: Reds attack was rather poorly thought out. If you are going to attack support it properly. Get more units into the region where they can help, seize the nearby good terrain before the enemy can park something there that you’d rather not have to dislodge. Also the attack had a decent chance to fail to kill even a single target while leaving two units exposed to a brutal counter attack that would likely end either of them.
That being said, the southwest has enough of an advantage that it will probably come out ahead anyway.
Turn 24: No Comment
Turn 25: No Comment
Turn 26: No Comment
Turn 27: Where are those berserkers? The only unit left that can fight them well is greens leader.
Turn 28: Attacking a ghoul on a village with dwarven fighters is hardly ideal. Not that it matters at this point.
Turn 29: No Comment
Turn 30: No Comment
Turn 31: No Comment
Turn 32: Avoid attacking units on villages with a single unit (assuming that both are normal units like the fighter and skeleton are). Unless you kill them you effectively deal 8 less damage than you do and they benefit from higher defense. So if you hit him once for 10 and he hits you twice for 14 then you effectively did 2 damage to his 14 1:7 is not a good ratio.
Turn 33: No comment
Turn 34: An there’s the guy we all been waiting for. Let’s hear a few evil laughs.
Turn 35: No comment
Turn 36: No comment
Turn 37: No comment
Turn 38: No comment
Turn 39: No comment
Turn 40: Attacking the skeleton archer gave it an easy chance to level it up before you could have sniped it with your berserker.
Turn 41: No Comment
Turn 42: The replay ends here.
Overall: you should have had your ulfserkers out much sooner to force him to invest in some skeletons or ghosts. Skeletons your dwarvish fighters/footpads could have handled and your allies burners could have taken the ghosts but having an ulfserker around forces an undead player to be cautious. Ulfserkers are also one of your best units for pushing ghouls off villages at day and murder skeleton archers and adepts at any time.
Turn 1:
red: On such a small map money might be better spent on something other than a griffon however I doubt that it will be overly crippling.
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 2:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 3:
red: Even if the guardsmen would be of little use near the front, he’d be more use there than in back.
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 4:
red: I generally find that around this time it’s good to get an ulfserker to force the undead to be careful with their non-skeleton units.
blue: No Comment
green: Not sure why he decided to occupy that piece of terrain. It offered no real advantage and kind of exposed his units to retaliation.
purple: May have been a better idea to get a unit that would be more effective against drake enemies, then again considering that the drake enemy is fond of saurians it probably won’t be too big a problem.
Turn 5:
red: I’d think it would be slightly more advantageous to put a fighter where you put the guardsman and attack the skeleton. Although it wouldn’t be quite as tough and would take more retaliation it would be a greater deterrent to counter attack. No skeleton or ghoul would hesitate to attack a guardsman, even at day, but a fighter will hit either of them back pretty hard.
blue: No Comment
green: No comment
purple: I think he would have gotten more mileage sending the burner that attacked the ghoul to attack the ghost. There were several units present who could finish off the ghoul however none of reds units are good at ghosts. Should have put his leader on the other village to prevent theft.
Turn 6:
red: Leaving your village open for theft there was probably a mistake. He can easily plop a ghoul or something else annoying to remove in it and both have a lock on the channel your reinforcements come through and syphon gold which would either force you to attack into a tough situation or slow down your reinforcements.
blue: No Comment
green: Instead of taking a safe but only slightly advantageous strategy mentioned in my note on red he chooses to go after your leader. This was a risk on his part as he stands to lose quite a bit for little substantial gain if it fails. I am thinking that were his troops in slightly better condition it may have been more worthwhile however you will probably be able to escape and the net effect will be that he will have forced your leader to stay out of the fight for awhile.
purple: No Comment
Turn 7:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: It may have been a mistake to move the skeleton that was blocking blues burner but then again that skeleton was cannon fodder if it stayed so not good either way.
purple: That skeleton was cannon fodder anyway it seems. It is worth noting that greens dark adepts pose a serious threat to purple however it is a fairly safe bet that they will be busy trying to kill red.
Turn 8:
red: The griffon had a much higher CTK on the ghost than the fighter.
blue: No Comment
green: Failing to kill that guard there is going to hurt him down the line.
purple: I’m thinking that purple probably wanted to bring at least one drake back with his leader so that blue cannot as easily deny him his recruit.
Turn 9:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: Has not been having good luck this game.
purple: Should have retreated. Two drakes vs that many saurians and a dark adept even at dawn would be suicide.
Turn 10:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: Could have made a decent bid for his own keep back however even with his fortune in leveling the clasher there will be no good way for either of you to stop blue from taking purples villages. Of course, concentrated force may be the way to go but I think that it might have been better to spread out to try to hold land and stave off excess enemy reinforcement.
Turn 11:
red: I’d probably have replaced the guardsman with a thunderer, may sound a little strange against undead but thunderers are actually fairly useful. They are the one unit you have that dark adepts do not like to attack, they can one shot walking corpses (if the enemy is inclined to use them), and take a decent chunk out of ghouls without being poisoned. They are a bit chancy and arn’t great at skeletons but you have plenty of units with hammers for those and thunders are better at attacking drakes. Also knowing that your enemy will soon have a dark sorcerer out I would defiantly have gotten an ulfserker which is one of the few level 1s that can take one of those out all by itself in one turn with fair reliability (also, can still always autokill careless adepts)
blue: Could have made better use of the leadership ability there. Also, if the last skirmisher isn’t going to fight it should retreat to somewhere where it could heal.
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 12:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 13:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 14:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 15:
red: No Comment
blue: There is no way to activate friendly fire.
green: Risky to run the mage away, it will mostly likely surivve but it might get stalked by the skirmisher and even if it survives it likely won’t have much health to survive the inevitable day attack that is coming, might be better to take a kill while you can get it.
purple: No Comment
Turn 16:
red: Again your force is really missing it’s berserkers, most every enemy on the field is vulnerable to them.
blue: No Comment
green: Not sure that the ghoul move really helped, if he wasn’t going to retreat it then perhaps he should have at least tried to poison one of the augers.
purple: No Comment
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: I’d consider the attack on the stalwart committing to an attack that you cannot profit from, on the other hand blue’s probably not going to get much better an opportunity to push you back.
green: No Comment
purple: In my previous evaluation I had expected purple to counter attack blue’s auger in the open to try to prevent it from leveling. There is no reason why red cannot kill it himself however the situation is not nearly as bad for blue as I had thought.
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: No Comment
Turn 17:
red: No Comment
blue: No Comment
green: No Comment
purple: Probably would have been better for purple to leave that village open so that a dwarf could counter attack from there.
Turn 18: Around this point the northeast is on their knees. They can resist for quite awhile but I’m going to start turning my commentary to fast mode.
Turn 19: No Comment.
Turn 20: No Comment.
Turn 21: No Comment.
Turn 22: No Comment.
Turn 23: Reds attack was rather poorly thought out. If you are going to attack support it properly. Get more units into the region where they can help, seize the nearby good terrain before the enemy can park something there that you’d rather not have to dislodge. Also the attack had a decent chance to fail to kill even a single target while leaving two units exposed to a brutal counter attack that would likely end either of them.
That being said, the southwest has enough of an advantage that it will probably come out ahead anyway.
Turn 24: No Comment
Turn 25: No Comment
Turn 26: No Comment
Turn 27: Where are those berserkers? The only unit left that can fight them well is greens leader.
Turn 28: Attacking a ghoul on a village with dwarven fighters is hardly ideal. Not that it matters at this point.
Turn 29: No Comment
Turn 30: No Comment
Turn 31: No Comment
Turn 32: Avoid attacking units on villages with a single unit (assuming that both are normal units like the fighter and skeleton are). Unless you kill them you effectively deal 8 less damage than you do and they benefit from higher defense. So if you hit him once for 10 and he hits you twice for 14 then you effectively did 2 damage to his 14 1:7 is not a good ratio.
Turn 33: No comment
Turn 34: An there’s the guy we all been waiting for. Let’s hear a few evil laughs.
Turn 35: No comment
Turn 36: No comment
Turn 37: No comment
Turn 38: No comment
Turn 39: No comment
Turn 40: Attacking the skeleton archer gave it an easy chance to level it up before you could have sniped it with your berserker.
Turn 41: No Comment
Turn 42: The replay ends here.
Overall: you should have had your ulfserkers out much sooner to force him to invest in some skeletons or ghosts. Skeletons your dwarvish fighters/footpads could have handled and your allies burners could have taken the ghosts but having an ulfserker around forces an undead player to be cautious. Ulfserkers are also one of your best units for pushing ghouls off villages at day and murder skeleton archers and adepts at any time.
"There are two kinds of old men in the world. The kind who didn't go to war and who say that they should have lived fast died young and left a handsome corpse and the old men who did go to war and who say that there is no such thing as a handsome corpse."
Re: Some comments on that game?
Thank you for all the advices.
I noticed how the berz gave me a good feeling that i will kill his adepts.
I noticed how the berz gave me a good feeling that i will kill his adepts.