Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

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West
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Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by West »

Following this discussion, I'm working on something that *might* be a fitting replacement for elf-land.ogg. What I'd like to know is: will some scenario break if I make it longer than the original?

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zookeeper
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Re: Possible replacement for "Elf land"

Post by zookeeper »

I'm pretty sure not. At worst there might be a case where elf-land plays once, followed by other tracks, but even if elf-land was replaced with a much longer track in those situations and would therefore be playing much longer before the other tracks kick in, I doubt it'd noticeably break the intended mood or anything.

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Re: Possible replacement for "Elf land"

Post by West »

Ok, thanks zookeeper.

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Re: Possible replacement for "Elf land"

Post by West »

Wow, almost two weeks and all I got is 38 seconds of music. :/

Silvan Sanctuary

Not finished obviously, this is just an intro.

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by TreizeCouleurs »

What you have here so far is pretty rad West!
Chord progression is awesome ... totally fits the theme, same to with the melody! I think you've nailed that perfectly.
Just to bring up two things if I may:

The string re-attack at 00:25 I find a little fake sounding. Maybe just keep the chord carried on from the previous bar. For a similar effect do a volume automation dip instead. I think that'd suit the fluid nature of the piece more than just an abrupt stop.

The flute sample also can be a little unrealistic at times. For example at times the flute vibrato will start a tad before the next note comes in which a real player won't do. Keyswitching and/or some volume automation would really make it come alive awesomely. E.g Trail out volume levels on the end of phrases yadda yadda yadda and maybe even crescendo into new phrases. I think being as fluid as possible is the key here.

Oh and please promise you'll bring in some sexy cor anglais or oboe lines in there soon :P

All in all, can't wait to here more !

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by IoN »

I agree about the string attack at 0:25 (well I assume we're talking about the same thing; the "play" option on box doesn't seem to give the time). Maybe a longer rest in between would help it sound a little less abrupt besides any technical tinkering.

Also unless my ears are deceiving me (which they probably are) are you using string tremolos with layered choir for that background effect? It's a nice effect.

By the way, how do you get that nifty "play" option on Box? :P Is it one of the things that comes with the pro upgrade?

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by West »

TreizeCouleurs wrote:What you have here so far is pretty rad West!
Chord progression is awesome ... totally fits the theme, same to with the melody! I think you've nailed that perfectly.
Thanks!
TreizeCouleurs wrote:The string re-attack at 00:25 I find a little fake sounding. Maybe just keep the chord carried on from the previous bar. For a similar effect do a volume automation dip instead. I think that'd suit the fluid nature of the piece more than just an abrupt stop.
I believe you're right, the pause isn't really necessary. I think I was trying to break up the denseness, but as you say, that is probably better done with changes in volume. I have yet to create any expression curves for the parts, I usually don't do that until a piece is more finished.
TreizeCouleurs wrote:The flute sample also can be a little unrealistic at times. For example at times the flute vibrato will start a tad before the next note comes in which a real player won't do. Keyswitching and/or some volume automation would really make it come alive awesomely. E.g Trail out volume levels on the end of phrases yadda yadda yadda and maybe even crescendo into new phrases. I think being as fluid as possible is the key here.
I hear ya. The flute is basically just a rough placeholder part. In fact I'm not even sure I should use a flute, as it tends to get masked too much by the strings. Speaking of which...
TreizeCouleurs wrote:Oh and please promise you'll bring in some sexy cor anglais or oboe lines in there soon :P
I might try an oboe or cor anglaish instead of the flute, actually. But then again, reed instruments don't convey the same ethereal feel as flutes -- they're not as elvish-sounding, if you will. I'm definitely planning to use harps and windchimes though. As everyone knows, elves love harps and windchimes. :D
IoN wrote:Also unless my ears are deceiving me (which they probably are) are you using string tremolos with layered choir for that background effect? It's a nice effect.
Choir, yes, tremolos, no. Both 1st and 2nd violins play with vibrato though, and together they might sound slightly tremolo-ish.
IoN wrote:By the way, how do you get that nifty "play" option on Box? :P Is it one of the things that comes with the pro upgrade?
I don't have a pro upgrade. Try uploading an mp3 instead of a wav and watch the Play button magically appear ;)

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by Tyler Johnson »

There's a trombone in there or french horn that sounds out of place to me, maybe because when I think elves I don't think brass.

But I like the harmonies and chord progressions! :D

I like elf-land.ogg, could this one possibly be "added" and not replace that one?

For the tutorial, elf-land.ogg is perfect. Maybe it could be renamed to "Tutorial.ogg"?

Is it just me or does the very first chord sound exactly like "Eine Kleine Nachtmusik" Mvt. 1's first chord? :D

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West
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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by West »

Tyler Johnson wrote:There's a trombone in there or french horn that sounds out of place to me, maybe because when I think elves I don't think brass.
French horns, yeah. I agree with you about that and I have removed the horns, I'm going to stick with strings and winds for this piece.
Tyler Johnson wrote:But I like the harmonies and chord progressions! :D
Thanks. It took a fair bit of experimentation coming up with that chord progression actually, as I wanted it to be in a major key but without sounding cutesy. I don't know how much sense it makes theoretically but I'm fairly happy with the way it turned out.
Tyler Johnson wrote:I like elf-land.ogg, could this one possibly be "added" and not replace that one?

For the tutorial, elf-land.ogg is perfect. Maybe it could be renamed to "Tutorial.ogg"?
Well, the whole idea was to replace elf-land with something a bit more up to date, but if people like it I have no real objections against keeping it in.
Tyler Johnson wrote:Is it just me or does the very first chord sound exactly like "Eine Kleine Nachtmusik" Mvt. 1's first chord? :D
It does, yeah. But it's just a G major :)

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by Tyler Johnson »

West wrote:It does, yeah. But it's just a G major
But I think it might have the same voicings, it sounds identical!

Anyway, what if we rename elf-land.ogg to tutorial.ogg and have your new version replace all other versions of elf-land. Because you're right, the old one is a bit short, and if you expand on this one, it would work better for gameplay. But I think the tutorial is perfect how it is.

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by PPH »

It sounds identical indeed. Less vigorous, but the notes in the chord seem to be the same.

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by West »

Well here's an clip of the chord. 1st violins G5, 2nd violins B4, violas D4, celli G3. Eine Kleine Nachtmusik ought to be available as free sheet music, so anyone who's curious and can read music can check it out and compare :)
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chord.zip
(861.51 KiB) Downloaded 345 times

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by PPH »

I checked the score. It's very similar, except for the fact that in "Eine Kleine Nachtmusik" the D is played by violins and the viola plays G.

Violins: G B D
Viola: G
Cello: G

The score can be found here:

http://imslp.org/wiki/Eine_kleine_Nacht ... g_Amadeus)

I'm not very good at reading scores, so someone might want to check whether I'm wrong, although I shouldn't.

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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by Tyler Johnson »

It's very simliar:
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Silvan Sanctuary
Silvan Sanctuary
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Eine Kleine Nachtmusik
Eine Kleine Nachtmusik
EKNM.jpg (152.7 KiB) Viewed 3711 times

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West
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Re: Silvan Sanctuary (possible replacement for "Elf land")

Post by West »

New version. Still just trying to think of where to head with this piece. Following the discussion about pianos in the credits music thread, I tried incorporating one. As I'm not a piano player, the stuff I write for the piano always end up sounding kind of amateur, so I dunno. *shrug*

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