Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

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esr
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by esr » July 13th, 2009, 9:43 pm

We've had inquiries about adding ae, dd, and ff glyphs to steel-hand.

We won't add dd. Steel-hand has a glyph for the edh sound this digraph represents in Welsh, we'll use that instead.

I can't actually see adding ff either. In Welsh, 'f' -> /v/ and 'ff' -> /f/, but our transcriptions of Wesnothian names don't use 'f' as /v/ and we're not going to start.

An ae ligature is possible, but it's really just a quirk of Welsh orthography rather than a distinct sound. I'll have a look at the big list of names, though.

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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by furioso » July 17th, 2009, 6:30 am

I'm really impressed with these scripts, especially the steel-hand. I'm quite into languages and I like the the thought that's gone into the system as well as the aesthetics of the letters.
I read the pastebin entry and I was a little surprised that while there are glyphs for j, zh, and Scottish ch (/dZ/ /Z/ /C/) there aren't any for English ch or sh (/tS/ /S/). I think Kitty's original proposal had them, so are they being left out of the final version?
I hope that's not a silly thing to ask; I understand that you (Kitty and Esr) have clear ideas on how the script will work.
Also, is there any plan for making fonts for these? I use Fonstruct for making fonts of my own, and it can be used for making Creative Commons-licensed fonts. I think it would work OK for the steel-hand design; are there any problems with the licensing?
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melinath
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » July 23rd, 2009, 12:34 am

Okay... from now on, all people wishing to see what Kitty's up to with scripts should check out the thread she made for it!

In the meantime, as long as you're here, here's another try at reinking the lines on the signpost and adding texture.
Attachments
signpost.png

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kitty
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by kitty » July 23rd, 2009, 7:12 pm

Hmm, I don't know what method you are exactly trying to use for the lines, but they still look wether pixelated or way too thick. Have you tried working with paths? That should be easier if you work with a mouse. Also working big is important for smooth results, I'd use a minimum of 800px (at 72dpi) height. Better bigger than sorry afterwards.

And it just occured to me that design-wise the shape of the pole is a bit problematic. Why did you make the top thicker than the rest of the pole? That makes it appear unbalanced visually (technically it would surely work).

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melinath
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » July 24th, 2009, 8:02 am

Use paths? But that's... cheating... :P
Thanks for the suggestions, kitty. I am working at ~1000 px, then shrinking it to 500 for my posts. My previous attempts at linework were with ballpoint pen on paper... then I would take a HQ digital photo of it, try to isolate the lines, and color between them (using layers, of course).

Oh, and thanks esp. for the point about the width change. I got it from a reference, but it doesn't really fit here.

Here's a shot using paths.

EDIT:: Looking at it again, there are a few smudges over the lines near the end of the sign. Will be fixed in the next version.

I tried to use a variable width on the path, but it seems to look a bit odd. Perhaps there's a better way to set it? (GIMP)
Attachments
signpost.png

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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by thespaceinvader » July 24th, 2009, 9:30 am

Using variable width on paths 5tends to end up with lines thinner at one end than the other. You're better off varying the width of the lines manually in this case by painting each path with a different thickness of brush.
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » July 24th, 2009, 2:01 pm

TSI: Not entirely sure what you mean. They are painted with different sized brushes...

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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by thespaceinvader » July 24th, 2009, 2:10 pm

It seems I misunderstood.
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » July 25th, 2009, 10:03 am

I was likely unclear.

The lines between shadow and shadow are painted with a 7px brush; between shadow and light with a 5px brush; between light and light (i.e. lines nearest the lightsource) with a 3px brush.

In addition, I had tried using variable brush size in a (perhaps misguided) attempt to make it less obvious that it was a straight, computer-drawn line. I fear it may have backfired....

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melinath
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » November 19th, 2009, 8:44 pm

So I now have access to a very nice tablet and photoshop CS4, and I'd like to try and make this something, working on it as a break from what I'm actually supposed to be doing.

Here's a new attempt at making the lines different thicknesses. I may have overdone it a bit...

Working size: 1500px x 1645px
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by Girgistian » November 20th, 2009, 2:55 am

melinath wrote:Here's a new attempt at making the lines different thicknesses. I may have overdone it a bit...
You know, I think the line width was already good enough in the previous version, and I can't see anything else that could be critically wrong with it either (though the asymmetrical lines do add a bit of the flavor the previous one was kinda missing). Looks pretty cool, almost inspiring, in a way :hmm:
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by kitty » November 22nd, 2009, 3:46 pm

Nice to see you continueing working on this! :)

As you said yourself the lineweight contrast is way too big now...
But I'm glad the lines aren't perfecly straight anymore and appear more natural. But you left the arrow's lines straight - do you plan to make it less perfect as well? Please make it appear more like wood and not cut-out-cardboard, examples: 1, 2.
The second problem is the way you paint the wood's texture - you shouldn't depict it as random scribbly lines. Take a look at some wood and study its structure: the lines follow a very strict inner order.

Apart from those issues, I still like your colour choices very much, they have a very nice weathered feel!

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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by Frogger5 » December 23rd, 2009, 11:31 am

kitty wrote: The second problem is the way you paint the wood's texture - you shouldn't depict it as random scribbly lines. Take a look at some wood and study its structure: the lines follow a very strict inner order.
I agree. Tree lines need to flow with the tree and not directly intersect each other. DIRECTLY I say meaning they can, but at an almost parallel angle.
http://mayang.com/textures/Wood/images/ ... 250001.JPG This is a log thats been lopped in half.
This is a close up so don't pay too much attention to the details but basically, the wood is long flowing groves. Any cracks in the wood should follow the flow of the grooves. I had a lot of trouble with trees when I first started drawing them so your doing pretty well.
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melinath
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Re: Melinath's Scenery: signposts.

Post by melinath » December 23rd, 2009, 6:12 pm

Thanks very much for your feedback, kitty and Frogger5. I haven't had time to work on this over the last few weeks, and I don't have access to a tablet right now, but this is still on my mind. I'll put your suggestions to good use as soon as I can. :-)

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