Portraits for Northern Rebirth

Post by **wayfarer** » November 20th, 2006, 7:45 pm

Somehow I think you don't get the message saying, don't comment in a forum is like walking nude in the city saying don't watch.
Just in case you haven't read.

Maeglin Dubh wrote:
wayfarer wrote:OK no one called you a bad artist but your work is improveable as many other artists work around here (including mine). We had some gorgeous artists around here which work I wouldn't touch in years but at the moment most artist skills can be improved. Editing and commenting is a vital part. So your attitude is somewhat contra productive. (Or you haven't seen the big sign Open Source and Community)

I wrote:
Take your pick. They say essentially the same thing.

Else you can limit your communication over the pm box.

Wayfarer

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 20th, 2006, 7:48 pm

Alright then, I can't stop you, just critique all you must

Post by **zookeeper** » November 20th, 2006, 7:48 pm

wayfarer wrote:Somehow I think you don't get the message saying, don't comment in a forum is like walking nude in the city saying don't watch.
Just in case you haven't read.

Well, since this is for Taurus and he's basically only asking his opinion on whether the style/concept is what he wants, I think it's fine. "In a forum" is a bit different than "in a forum, in a specific thread for some user's campaign" in this case.

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 20th, 2006, 7:53 pm

Personally I think a lot of people should read this: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10263

I just said don't critique me. So don't do it. According to the tread I referenced that is OK to ask!

Please...

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 20th, 2006, 7:55 pm

zookeeper wrote:
wayfarer wrote:Somehow I think you don't get the message saying, don't comment in a forum is like walking nude in the city saying don't watch.
Just in case you haven't read.
Well, since this is for Taurus and he's basically only asking his opinion on whether the style/concept is what he wants, I think it's fine. "In a forum" is a bit different than "in a forum, in a specific thread for some user's campaign" in this case.

At least there is one person that has read the tread i referenced

Post by **wayfarer** » November 20th, 2006, 8:05 pm

Ok you succeded, what I write would get probably censored. So I'll leave you alone here.

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 20th, 2006, 8:18 pm

wayfarer wrote:Ok you succeded, what I write would get probably censored. So I'll leave you alone here.

Why would anyone do that?

Post by **Maeglin Dubh** » November 20th, 2006, 8:50 pm

No, I certainly did read it. Irrevenant and I moderated together and worked closely on a lot of things. That wasn't one of them, but I read it as soon as he put it up. My point still stands. You can refuse to accept criticism and edits, but it will only hurt the development of your skills. You have to choose between ego and possesiveness and the improvement of your drawing ability.

Although, in this case I do agree with Zookeeper. This is a special circumstance. One problem I'll point out pre-emptively is the difference in style between this and the other portraits for the campaign, but if Taurus doesn't mind, it should be ok.

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 20th, 2006, 8:59 pm

I see your point. Well if I have those two alternatives I would naturally chose to improve my drawing skills

Perhaps enough of the off-topic talk or I'm afraid that this tread may be moved to the off-topic area like my introduction tread, which is still in off-topic area

Post by **Jetrel** » November 21st, 2006, 2:35 am

battlesquid wrote:Personally I think a lot of people should read this: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10263

I just said don't critique me. So don't do it. According to the tread I referenced that is OK to ask!

Please...

To put things very bluntly, you do have a right to ask people not to critique you.

However, if you want any chance of the work going in, you need to be willing to receive critiques, because right now your work sucks, and critique is the only way it will improve.

Getting criticism is nasty medicine. It sucks to swallow your pride, and correct your work - I get criticism all the time. But 'if you can't take the heat, stop playing at being a blacksmith.' Having one's mistakes pointed out to them is part of the job - because of how human psychology works, an artist will not see most of their own errors, and they need other people to point them out.

Post by **Taurus** » November 21st, 2006, 7:17 am

As a matter of fact, that is the type of thing I am looking for. Maby you can give him a a bit more armor, a big viking like helement with those horns sticking out of the side and a fat axe somewhere. Otherwise I think it is great. I especially like the little axe on his belt buckle. Adds a nice little touch.

About the style, I am not especially concerned right now. My main concern is getting the portraits at all. I think that anything of reasonable quailtiy would be better then nothing.

And about this whole philosophical discussion on critiquing, I aggree that critiuqe will help him improve artwork, and I am sure he does too. But, I think in this case he was hoping to get the artwork finished before the critiques started rolling in.

Post by **West** » November 21st, 2006, 12:41 pm

Taurus wrote:But, I think in this case he was hoping to get the artwork finished before the critiques started rolling in.

I think that's part of the problem. Isn't it better to be aware of the flaws on an early stage so you have a chance of correcting them before moving on to inking, coloring etc?

Post by **zookeeper** » November 21st, 2006, 12:46 pm

West wrote:I think that's part of the problem. Isn't it better to be aware of the flaws on an early stage so you have a chance of correcting them before moving on to inking, coloring etc?

Maybe, but at this point I think he'll learn the point better when he has first spent hours drawing something which gets rejected because of a simple fault he could have fixed easily early on but which is impossible or very hard to fix when the image is "finished".

Post by **West** » November 21st, 2006, 1:18 pm

zookeeper wrote:Maybe, but at this point I think he'll learn the point better when he has first spent hours drawing something which gets rejected because of a simple fault he could have fixed easily early on but which is impossible or very hard to fix when the image is "finished".

Good point.

battlesquid · Post by **battlesquid** » November 21st, 2006, 1:33 pm

Jetryl:
If you think my art sucks, then I'd like to know why. I will take your advice, although personally I don't think my art sucks. I was rather pleased with my sketch, as this is my first attempt to draw a dwarf, and the fact that it looks like a dwarf (at least to me it does) is mainly the reason why. This is still only a rough sketch to let me know whether the style/concept is what Taurus wants. That being said I would like your comments on proportions, stance, style etc in order for me to improve my draft and general drawing ability. Like you pointed out (very articulately) I need your advice to point out the mistakes I cannot see.

Taurus:
Great, I'm glad you appreciate my efforts. I will add heavier armor, a viking style helmet with two slightly bent horns and a double headed axe. The axe should probably be held quite high up so the blade is visible also in a cropped image.

zookeeper & West:
I'd like to avoid the picture being rejected of course so I'm open for your comments.

In spite of what I said before I would now like to receive comments, as it's apparent to me now that I need it. Sorry about my confusion, it's a totally new way of working for me... I hope you will not make a big deal about this. Let's move on to more constructive things

battlesquid