Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

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holius
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by holius » April 2nd, 2019, 1:06 pm

I suggested some kind of visual distinction for the liminal/lawful split, without precision. As I am no artist, I don't know if the suggestion is feasible, but what I had in mind was leveraging the (middle east) multiple influences that seemed to be used at the faction creation, and choosing some particular theme for each alignment, as though the liminal units were from "some part" of the desert, and the lawful from another. Think Turkish cities warriors (lawful, chain mail / white clothes) vs Sahara desert mercenaries (liminal, indigo tagelmoust.

The other way to justify a Lawful/Liminal distinction in the coloring of the clothes would be an analogy with the Woodsman fork (lawful Bowman / chaotic Poacher), one is integrating the regular army, the other being a solitary mercenary or outlaw.

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ghype
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 2nd, 2019, 3:25 pm

The old herbalist purple was too much of a colour to be represented that much in a sprite. I would go with a simple blue/green differentiation between the alignments.
holius wrote:
April 2nd, 2019, 1:06 pm
I suggested some kind of visual distinction for the liminal/lawful split, without precision.

There is one big problem however, that is the burner line. We did some tests, giving each burner advancement a green cloth so they fit with each others. In the end however, we realised that there is no real need for such a thing. So we decided against it. So if we would go with this concept of yours, we would need to give the entire burner line different clothes to (which would be possible).
If would want to hear more opinions on this however before I actually go and this

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The_Gnat
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by The_Gnat » April 3rd, 2019, 2:25 am

@holius - I personally like your idea of giving the units variation by alignment. That would put the Soldier, Burner, and Shield Breaker in the lawful category. And the Rover, Rider, and Herbalist in the liminal category.

Currently you can see that the that liminal units all have a similar green theme:
liminal.png
liminal.png (24.48 KiB) Viewed 1072 times
However, the lawful units also have this green theme (with the exception of the Burner):
lawful.png
lawful.png (7.57 KiB) Viewed 1072 times

The first idea that comes to my head, however, is to make the Lawful units more white (like the Burner). That could look good, and it would make sense given the desert heat. :)

That is just an idea. :)

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by Celtic_Minstrel » April 3rd, 2019, 4:51 am

White (or other very light colours, such as tan or yellow) certainly does fit for the desert heat.
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ghype
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 3rd, 2019, 5:40 am

that would also mean that the only bit of coloring the unit gets is the TC, rest is gonna be white. Is that really what we want?

Lets say lawful are designed really that way , to be compeltly white/tan and only colours come from TC. What are happening to the non-lawful units. They will have 1 core colour + TC, hence two colours. If the 1 core colours is green for example, a player playing DF on position 3 will have only 1 colour.

I think the idea at core is not bad, but it is not very practicable

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 3rd, 2019, 12:56 pm

Upon the current update, here are two modification made for the Raider and Marauder to fid the newly made proposals.

They dropped the mace for a torch to compensate the loss of burners fire melee.
raider-new-6.png
raider-new-6.png (7.81 KiB) Viewed 1018 times
marauder-new-5.png
marauder-new-5.png (8.27 KiB) Viewed 1018 times

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Xalzar
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by Xalzar » April 3rd, 2019, 3:24 pm

ghype wrote:
April 3rd, 2019, 12:56 pm
They dropped the mace for a torch to compensate the loss of burners fire melee.
My only observation is that their torch is drawn in a much different style than the Goblin Pillager's one.
Image
Maybe it should be more stylistically coherent?

Consider that I'm no artist and I know how difficult is to draw pixel art from past experience; I don't want to pester you with details or anything... :oops:

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by Pentarctagon » April 3rd, 2019, 3:32 pm

I like the Raider's/Marauder's torch more, actually. The fire for Goblin Pillager's torch looks kind of like it's hovering behind the torch rather than burning it.
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ghype
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 3rd, 2019, 6:03 pm

Xalzar wrote:
April 3rd, 2019, 3:24 pm
Maybe it should be more stylistically coherent?
maybe we can update that one as well (if not give it the exact same maybe - i mean how can be torches look different other then maybe the grip).

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Xalzar
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by Xalzar » April 4th, 2019, 9:26 am

ghype wrote:
April 3rd, 2019, 6:03 pm
maybe we can update that one as well (if not give it the exact same maybe - i mean how can be torches look different other then maybe the grip).
It would be great.
And I agree with Penta that your version seems superior, can't wait to see it animated! ;)

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ghype
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 4th, 2019, 9:41 am

credit goes to doofus. he initially made those new torches. I think no one bothered to update the wolf rider though

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 4th, 2019, 3:22 pm



The Rider, Swiftrider and Windrider now have sattle to sit on. Any further ideas on what to add/change to the horse armour accessiors ?


rider-new-6.png
rider-new-6.png (6.79 KiB) Viewed 914 times

swiftrider-new-7.png
swiftrider-new-7.png (7.23 KiB) Viewed 914 times

windrider-new-5.png
windrider-new-5.png (7.88 KiB) Viewed 914 times


Maybe something like this around the horses neck for the Swift/Windrider.
Maybe something like this on the Winderider's horse head? From the same link, I'd try to design Sunderers Lv2 horse armour similar to that or more like this. For the lv3 Sunderer I'd do the same just more fancy. The lv3 CTP would get a full armoured horse.

But i have no clues on how to design the Raider/Marauder. Any ideas?

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by Caladbolg » April 4th, 2019, 11:05 pm

I'm not an artist and I might not be able to properly explain so take these with a grain of salt:
  1. Warmaster's lower face is a bit hard to read. Is that a really dense beard, or some kind of a face covering/mail to shield the mouth from sand?
  2. Warmaster's lower body appears very wide due to the cloth between his legs being the same(?) shade as pieces of cloth (cape?) to the left/right of his legs. The cloth between this legs is magenta and stands out against the dark green legs, especially as they're partially obscured by swords. This attracts attention to it, making the pink seem like the main part of his body below the belt. The pink to the left/right of his legs then seemingly extends that, giving it a stretched, wide appearance.
  3. The upper edge of the cloth between Warmaster's legs seems to be almost perfectly aligned with parts of the armor to the left and right of it. As a result, the line separating the lower and upper body seems almost straight, giving the lower body a slightly blocky look, also feeding into point 2.
  4. The cloth between Warmaster's legs seems to start too high, almost at bellybutton level, with legs also looking a bit too long as a result.
  5. Windrider's bow still looks wierd. I don't even see where/if it is even held. It still looks like it's floating behind the guy.
The 1st point can probably be solved with some recoloring or sth. 2nd could be solved by making the cloth between his legs a more different shade of TC, or giving it some texture, or removing the cape to the left/right of his legs (it isn't necessary with all that armor anyways). 3rd and 4th can be solved by slightly altering how it connects to the round shield on his body (maybe don't connect it directly, put a bit of sth in between). 5th by moving the bow slightly to the right, so a part of it is obscured by the rider's shoulder.

Though I think the previous Warmaster sprite was great, I don't see the need for this new version. Unless you talked about slightly changing his concept, I'm not entirely caught up on all the discussions.
All other new sprites are great. Raider/Marauder especially.

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ghype
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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by ghype » April 5th, 2019, 9:01 am

Thanks for your detailed feedback upon warmaster
Every point of yours will be addressed upon next release
Caladbolg wrote:
April 4th, 2019, 11:05 pm
Though I think the previous Warmaster sprite was great, I don't see the need for this new version. Unless you talked about slightly changing his concept, I'm not entirely caught up on all the discussions.
It was agreed upon for the lv4 to drop the shield ofr a 2nd blade just like the original sprite. it's just to make it closer to the original. The fact the the lv4 Warmaster no longer lv ups from lv3 Bladesmaster allows the visual differences in the sprites.

About the Winderider, i think I finally know what the problem is (which might be only a problem if displaying it). It appears flaoting on white backgroudn as the bow string is white too. In-game it shouldn't be a problem. The other riders however have a bow string of a different colour, so maybe i should change that. All though the bow looks really good (in-game).


windrider-display.png
windrider-display.png (7.65 KiB) Viewed 858 times

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Re: Dunefolk Rework - Base Units

Post by beetlenaut » April 5th, 2019, 9:54 am

I think the problem is that the bowstring cuts off the hand, making it look like the elbow. Your eye can then follow the back of the cloak down and you think you've seen the arm. (That's what I thought.) I also can't really read his hand. I think you can fix it with a slight change to the shape of the hand, and by shifting the back of the cloak--even if it falls a bit less naturally. I made a quick edit. It would still need some work, but I think it shows what I mean. It's easier to follow the arm to the hand now.
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