New Campaign: Return of the Legions (0.2.5)

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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turin
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Post by turin » December 1st, 2005, 11:30 pm

zookeeper wrote:
, how would there be another really powerful undead leader appearing in just a few years?
Because I mostly ignore how something is tactically possible or feasible (how much time would it take to recruit 200 wraiths, for example) and focus on the characters. If there's a chap who's good enough (err...evil), then I'm willing to give him his army in a week, if needs be.
Well, I suppose that's one approach to making a campaign.

My main problem with this is it makes it seem like events are too squished together. Having 300 years of boring nothing, then 15 years containing 2-3 almost-doomsday events, seems contrived to me. However, as I said, I have yet to see how you will manage it. So far I've only expressed my reservations about hte idea.
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turin wrote:It is probably a decent campaign. Unfortunately, Rashdin disappears at the end of the first scenario; you probably forgot to un-unstore him.
That's very odd, and I can't neither replicate this or find anything in the code that could cause this. In case you don't have a replay or savefile, could you tell in which order did the following things happen (not all may have): death of Nurinamor, death of all enemy units, Rashdin reaching the trapdoor, Rashdin returning, end of turns, end of level? There are quite a few event branches, and I suppose it's possible I've missed one combination.
1) Death of Nurinamor 2) Rashdin being move_unit_faked from his starting position (not from where he was on the map at the time) to the trapdoor, and his subsequent disappearance from gameplay 3) death of all enemy units which led to 4) winning event, which had some odd dialogue with the elvish hero talking to himself which made me suspect Rashdin had been accidentally destroyed. (In the next scenario, this was confirmed.)
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Post by Anyar » December 1st, 2005, 11:34 pm

Emmanovi wrote::x Do I have to try and get WINE to work?
If you dont mind the command line, you might want to try this.
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Post by Emmanovi » December 2nd, 2005, 7:25 am

Thankyou.
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Post by toms » December 2nd, 2005, 10:06 am

Where do you get it?
I can´t download it from the campaign server I think.
Is its name "Return of the legions" or another?
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Post by zookeeper » December 2nd, 2005, 10:13 am

toms wrote:Where do you get it?
I can´t download it from the campaign server I think.
Like I said in the first post, you can't get it from the campaign server. Read the first post.

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Post by zookeeper » December 2nd, 2005, 10:15 pm

turin wrote:
zookeeper wrote: That's very odd, and I can't neither replicate this or find anything in the code that could cause this. In case you don't have a replay or savefile, could you tell in which order did the following things happen (not all may have): death of Nurinamor, death of all enemy units, Rashdin reaching the trapdoor, Rashdin returning, end of turns, end of level? There are quite a few event branches, and I suppose it's possible I've missed one combination.
1) Death of Nurinamor 2) Rashdin being move_unit_faked from his starting position (not from where he was on the map at the time) to the trapdoor, and his subsequent disappearance from gameplay 3) death of all enemy units which led to 4) winning event, which had some odd dialogue with the elvish hero talking to himself which made me suspect Rashdin had been accidentally destroyed. (In the next scenario, this was confirmed.)
This is really odd. I've looked through the code and done things in the same order for many times before, and I quite frankly have no idea what could be causing it. None of it makes any sense.

What version of Wesnoth are you using? The only thing I can think about is some weird bug triggering in the version you're using that messes up some event code. I've played it with 1.0 and tested the case you described now with 1.0.2, but...it works for me. Of course I wouldn't mind if you (or anyone else who's proficient in WML) glanced at the code, just in case I've missed something obvious.

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Post by turin » December 2nd, 2005, 10:26 pm

Well, I was using 1.1+svn. Then I switched to my build of 1.0.2+svn, and the scenario worked. :?

My guess is, the WML processor in 1.1+svn has changed, and your code is being interpreted differently.

[edit]
On second scenario, there is a bug. (I think). I tried to debug through, and killed the orcish leader. So, there's no enemies left on the map. However, it still tells me I need to either kill all enemies or get Rashdin to the exit.

This is probably a problem in the real game, because it is possible to kill all of the orc leader's troops, then him, and it will cause the same problem.
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Post by zookeeper » December 2nd, 2005, 10:41 pm

turin wrote:Well, I was using 1.1+svn. Then I switched to my build of 1.0.2+svn, and the scenario worked. :?

My guess is, the WML processor in 1.1+svn has changed, and your code is being interpreted differently.
All right then. I'll try to have a look at what's changed and see if I can fix the scenario to be compatible with the new WML processor.
turin wrote:[edit]
On second scenario, there is a bug. (I think). I tried to debug through, and killed the orcish leader. So, there's no enemies left on the map. However, it still tells me I need to either kill all enemies or get Rashdin to the exit.

This is probably a problem in the real game, because it is possible to kill all of the orc leader's troops, then him, and it will cause the same problem.
Yes, it seems this is a bug in the scenario itself. I'll fix this in the next release, and probably post a fixed scenario file as well soon.

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Post by zookeeper » December 5th, 2005, 10:42 am

Bug fix!
zookeeper wrote:
turin wrote:[edit]
On second scenario, there is a bug. (I think). I tried to debug through, and killed the orcish leader. So, there's no enemies left on the map. However, it still tells me I need to either kill all enemies or get Rashdin to the exit.


This is probably a problem in the real game, because it is possible to kill all of the orc leader's troops, then him, and it will cause the same problem.
Yes, it seems this is a bug in the scenario itself. I'll fix this in the next release, and probably post a fixed scenario file as well soon.
I've uploaded a fixed scenario file to correct this bug. If you're using the lite version, get your fixed scenario file here.

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Post by guest » December 6th, 2005, 1:31 pm

Hello!

Thank you. I enjoyed the campaign so far, and wish to provide some feedback. I played on medium difficulty. The campaign is from start rather professional-looking. I enjoyed the difficulty images, where the hard one really looks rather intimidating. :-)

MILD SPOILERS AHEAD. (BE WARNED: You may be able to decipher the main plot from this.)

1. The difficulty was nicely balanced. It is nice not to need too much save-loading, which is the case for some other campaigns. Gold is all the time in control, so the player never gets an indecent amount to use. (This is mostly due to the time limits that are quite suitable.) What you say in bugs.txt about the "scenarios not being tactically interesting" - I don't agree. They are quite interesting.

2a. The scenario "Mouldering Barrow" is a bit off the general line, balance-wise.. Mostly, this is due to the given objective, to "Find *****". (The saurians give you some resistance and mostly slow you down.) -> When the player tries to search thoroughly, it takes time and spreads your forces. Thus, the first time that I managed to find him (not the first time I tried), I ended up being one hex away when turns ran out. This scenario could probably use a couple more turns (3-4 more should be enough).
2b. It is confusing that your advisor advises you to "not rely on scouts" (overly much). First time around I didn't get any, due to the warning / wording. Second time around, I understood that yes, they are needed (at least one), for visibility in the fog. (Advisor's wording could perhaps be clearer.)

3. I mistook the fire bow to work in a same way as the hammer = by constant stats (which it doesn't). If you want to consider making this clearer for the chooser, I wouldn't object. (Very kind of you to allow the chance to decline taking it. Thank you.)

4. "The revelation" -scenario is essentially a council type scenario. I think it would be preferable to have it continue to the next scenario without reducing the player's gold to 80%.

5. I really think the rain looks very nice. A small bug - it is, unfortunately, not shown completely on the lower-most half-hexes of the map. This may require touching the C++ code to fix - I don't know.

6a. "The Council" 2nd time around offers the same save-name as at the 1st time. Could you consider renaming it? (E.g. "The Council Reconvenes" could work, but I believe you can better think of something more suitable to the campaign's character.)
6b. This incarnation of the council is the only place where I found spelling errors. There they emerge in several repliques. Just for your attention. Otherwise the language can be said to be clear and to appear even rather polished.

7a. I realise that the end is not finished. You can't get both of your heroes to stand where they should, because the game decides that when one of them goes there (and decides accordingly), that is enough.

Maybe that is the meaning, though, as the scenario states "result=continue", and then you're supposed to come back to this for the second time? If you're supposed to return here, the save-game naming issue mentioned above occurs also here. The player can, of course, manually rename it each time.

7b. You're not supposed to have the chosen companion in your recall list, I presume. :-)


To wrap it up: It is a very nicely done campaign so far, and among the best made for Wesnoth. Also, as I mentioned, the difficulty setting is quite suitable, in my opinion. I like all the scenarios. The talking scenarios are polished, and the playable scenarios offer a nice gameplay. Good work, thank you again.


Edit:
a) I hope you finish the campaign, it's really worth it.
b) The music (while it first sounded different) fits well, and creates a good atmosphere.

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Post by Lord_Aether » December 7th, 2005, 12:13 pm

I really like this campaign, and hope that you finish it.

I also hope that you can continue to make campaigns in the future :D
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Post by lynx rufus » January 8th, 2006, 11:16 am

I too really enjoyed playing it... Chose "easy" and made it through to the end.

Good story line... great storm. Weather, that changes throughout a scenario, should become part of the Wesnoth experience.

Couldn't figure out how to use the bow in the third scenario which was a bit frustrating. :?

I look forward to the rest of the tale. :D

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Post by zookeeper » January 8th, 2006, 11:28 am

lynx rufus wrote:Couldn't figure out how to use the bow in the third scenario which was a bit frustrating. :?

I look forward to the rest of the tale. :D
Glad to hear you like it. As for the bow, take it with any unit that already has a bow attack (fighter, archer, scout) and see how it's a lot better than their old bow. :wink:

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Bow problem

Post by lynx rufus » January 9th, 2006, 11:12 pm

The problem I had was that I tried picking it up with the leader and then when I went ot get it with another unit (an archer), although the image was still there I could not pick up the bow.

Useful weapon for Ranger/Avenger but I am assuming that the 70% would be useless with a markself/sharpshooter as they already shoot at 70%.

Does the rain need to last all of the turns? Sort of monsoon like. Also, could the rain reduce visibility or rather, could it turn daylight into dusk/dawn and dawn/dusk into night? :twisted:

Like the game thus far... played it again and I really like finding weapons, et cetera. 8)

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Post by db0 » January 10th, 2006, 1:47 am

I played the first 5 or so scenarios and I'm genuinely impressed. Seriously, I'm left feeling rather dwarfed by the quality of your campaign (compared to mine that is) and a refreshing change from most of what I've played so far.
It would seem we have the same approach to storyline.

Damn. Now I need to make my campaign even better...

Keep up the good work, I'll be wathcing your progress

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