New_style_of_campaign (NSOC)

[alluton]

I redone this post. So campaign is redone versio of To The Lands Unknown.(this is done by inferno8 permission)
So why it is redone? Because you are playing now the enemy!
Someone needed to help wml problems...

Working scenarios so far:4(4th is under testing)
Doesent offer much gameplay yet.
This havent been published in any addon server(yet).

edit:some beta tester wanted( this campaign size is about 60mb)


edit2:What about to make mehir allyes playable in some scenarios?

[bigkahuna]

Have you asked Inferno8 if you can actually use his campaign? I'd start there.

EDIT: My bad, didn't see that.

Anyway, Inferno's campaign was created and balanced for the summoners and not the enemy. The enemy, when human-controlled, would probably be vastly overpowered, as the summoner's strength in TLU is strategy.

Anyway, the campaign will need a slew of balancing to get it fixed, as well as a huge storyline change to justify why you are playing all these different races and such.

[Wendek]

(ofcourse whit his permission).

I guess this answers your question. =)

On topic : sounds interesting. Reminds me of Starsiege... though I doubt anyone here played that game, heh.

[alluton]

Well ofcourse i need to rebalance the difference between summoners and the enemy. And if you got ideas how to modifyi storyline im glad to hear them.

edit:inferno is watching this.(i wonder if he will post something.)
edit2:(5secs later....he isnt anymore:(

[Wendek]

Hum... after finishing To Lands Unknown, I'm wondering something about your campaign. Spoiler for TLU below, people who haven't played it probably shouldn't read.

Spoiler:

What do you mean by "playing the enemy" ? Do you mean we get to play the same missions, but on the enemy side ? I'm not sure it would make a great campaign, because there would be no main character and although it'd be interesting to play with so many factions (Barbarians, Mages, Tharis, Kharos, and the red-Abyss beings as well for one) in a single campaign, you'd never get any veteran or anything. Also, how about the storyline ? If the enemy side wins, technically the next scenarios can't be the same...
Or do you mean something else ? The problem I see is that in TLU, there's not an "enemy of the Summoners"... it's more like obstacles that prevent Mehir from achieving his goals, and as such he needs to fight. But it's not a fixed enemy... unlike in some campaigns where you could play the Ancient Lich that rules everything from behind or something.

Just a few questions that arose in my mind after playing that campaign. But maybe I just missed something batantly obvious... just sharing thoughts.

[alluton]

well i mean that story will be tell from mehir view(cause i think that is only one that makes sense.)
And scenarios are played as what you call "obstacles". Sure they are rebalanced and mehir will got some advanced level units to his use also. This dont have to great or even good campaign. In here i will try to learn all scenario code of TLU(what is really big and takes lots of time) And also i will try modify it fomr some parts. So consider this as big learning project for me that will provide you whit something hopefully fun.

[bigkahuna]

I think what Wendek means is...

How will the storyline EVER work? If you play the enemies that Mehir is fighting and happen to *win* at any one scenario, Mehir would be dead and the story would NOT continue from there. Unless you want yourself to TRY and die, stop yourself from killing Mehir, or stop others of your kind from killing Mehir, the story is not going to work.

[Wendek]

Yes, that's what I meant. More precisely :
-Either you play each mission but on the "other side", and then if the storyline is to work, the player is basically forced to lose every single mission (for instance, if Mehir failed against the Great Efreeti, then there's no way the rest of the storyline would have worked...). Else, as bigkahuna just said, the storyline won't make sense anymore. And though it'd be an original concept, I doubt anyone would want to play a campaign where to goal is to lose every scenario.
-Either what ? You play the allies ? It'd be boring, not to mention there aren't allies in every mission.

However...

In here i will try to learn all scenario code of TLU(what is really big and takes lots of time) And also i will try modify it fomr some parts. So consider this as big learning project for me that will provide you whit something hopefully fun.

If you intend this to be some kind of coding/learning exercise for yourself, so that you learn WML and such, then sure it gives the campaign another, new interest. But this should be stated clearly, and not name it "a new kind of campaign". Because some people, like me, would never give feedback on the coding part (simply cause I don't know anything about it) and as such my feedback would be useless for you. On the other hand, some people would probably be happy to help about it... but they need to know that it is what you're looking for.

[alluton]

Well as i said already if you got any ideas how to modify story im happy to hear them.( i know story from Mehirs view isnt meaningful) But thats good for you. Propably all of your ideas are better then:D


edit:for now i not developing this. Propably it will stopped forever. cause this doesent offer storyline at all....

[pauxlo]

I think you can cut the size of your campaign if you declare TLU as a dependency (in your pbl file), and use its images instead of delivering copies of them.

[Alarantalara]

That would be an excellent way to reduce download size, except for one small problem.
Because I've been working to reduce the download size of TLU, every release since 1.4 has had a different set of images and so declaring them as a dependency could cause a lot of visual bugs.

For example, in the scenario East of Sud-Affar, if you combined the code (map and macros) from 1.5.3 with the images from what is in UMC-dev, the jungle would vanish.
Even having a scenario load TLU's terrain macros and maps wouldn't be safe, since the map sizes have changed slightly, so all the locations specified in the new scenario would happen in the wrong place.