Legend of the Invincibles

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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Which of these units you find worth advancing and gearing heavily? Unpopular ones will be reworked.

Elvish Nightprowler
17
15%
Elvish Overlord
7
6%
Elvish Seer
16
14%
Elvish Warlord
5
4%
Exterminator
13
11%
Forester
3
3%
Goblin Ravager
0
No votes
Goblin Warbanner
0
No votes
Grim Knight
0
No votes
Faerie Incarnation
16
14%
Infernal Knight
5
4%
Lich King
6
5%
Lunatic Knight
10
9%
Monstrosity
0
No votes
Orcish Nightblade
0
No votes
Orcish Strafer
4
3%
Pilum Master
4
3%
Orcish Warmonger
3
3%
Phantom
3
3%
Predator
3
3%
 
Total votes: 115

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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

Konrad2 wrote:There is not. In turn 2 my ally has 6 units that are not able attack in this turn. 5 of them do not take one of the 6 avaible villages, instead they move towards the far away enemies. Only one decides to take a village. I can't explain that by saying 'there is fighting all around'. D:
Seems it will need more investigation.
Konrad2 wrote:Could you include that in the help? It's kinda important. D:
Done.
Konrad2 wrote:EDIT: Lethalias and Efraims 'Soul eater score' isn't displayed in their unit information before their first kill (after becoming liches)
Done. It starts at 30, right?
Konrad2 wrote:In 'Shadow Empire' the note says 'Generals will turn to your side after Zorox's death'. I think you mean after he was captured. Because you don't kill him.
Changed it to Zorox' fall.
Whiskeyjack wrote:Concerning Efraim's knife AMLAs: I think the nerf of -2 damage per extra attack was a little heavy.
Okay, reduced it to -1 for the first upgrade to attack count.
Dugi wrote:
Whiskeyjack wrote:Dugi, what do you think about making [...]
Yeah, I could do it. I don't want to mess up the commits at the moment, please remind me this in a week if I forget.
Done.

#Blood rain
There might be another way to prevent chapter 9 soloing. I might add a highly frequent trait that would make enemies explode on death (or apply some other penalty to the killer or nearby enemies). This could allow me to restrict the blood rain to only a couple of scenarios to keep it interesting.
Possible death effects:
  • Good old explosion, damaging adjacent enemies
  • Poison to non-poisoned killers, high damage to poisoned killers
  • Lethargy to killer
  • Staying at 1 hp if defeated in retaliation
  • Combinations of properties of these
Edit: 420th page. I hope it will not make this thread look like a stoners' talk.

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

Dugi wrote:
Konrad2 wrote:EDIT: Lethalias and Efraims 'Soul eater score' isn't displayed in their unit information before their first kill (after becoming liches)
Done. It starts at 30, right?
It starts on 45 (hard difficulty).

EDIT:
I have this question regarding the description of the item 'Crapsack World' (it's an amulet).
'Oh, almighty god, why did you create this world?'
'It was not me. I have a perfect alibi, by the way.'
What is his alibi and how can it be perfect, when there was noone to see him yet? Ha! His alibi must be fake! How do you explain that?! xD

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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

Konrad2 wrote:It starts on 45 (hard difficulty).
Oh, thanks. I have set the starting value wrong.
Konrad2 wrote:What is his alibi and how can it be perfect, when there was noone to see him yet? Ha! His alibi must be fake! How do you explain that?! xD
Discussions about stuff related to religion are not encouraged here. Feel free to ask me elsewhere.

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ZIM
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by ZIM »

Regarding the changes in chapter 9, I think some of them were too hard. Here is my opinion about them:

1.The black soul demons
They were quite powerful, but it's their lethargy that made them harder to kill. Especially the demon overlord and demon despot, they become very nasty once turned into black soul. Currently my strategy is to kill one demon at first, then after defeating the black soul version, I continue to kill the other demon.

2.The flies
This one is more as a nuisance. They were not very hard to kill. But they keep spawning, so just after my units killed the enemy for more than one direction, they get trapped. And just after my unit kill the flies, another one spawn again. They made my units progress through the map very slow, especially in caves. After a while, I get tired of repeatingly kill the flies in order to get and change the cfg files so that the flies will only spawn once.

3.The demon soul
They were not very strong. They also quite easy to kill. I think they are fine and don't have to be changed.

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

'undead mastery (X)' is explained as 'Adjacent allies will do X% more damage'. I think it should be 'adjacent allied undead', right?

angrynarwhal
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by angrynarwhal »

Just played through the Journey South. The scenario description says no early finish bonus but gave me a whopping 9k extra gold for the next one :shock: (tried both mining & seige).

Loving the campaign! More general feedback would be I like having plenty information about scenarios before starting them, and that it feels a wee bit on the easy side.

Also...

- I thought tax collector would generate revenue for your side. It does the opposite (makes more sense, but could clarify the equip description).
- Took some experimenting to figure out how potions work; that the effects are removed whenever a unit advances. This could effect also be made more clear. (current plan is to feed lots of potions to my grand knight :mrgreen: )

dabber
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by dabber »

Blood rain definitely made me end scenarios sooner. But it was because it was annoying, not because it was preventing me from continuing. It would need to upgrade its damage significantly for it to prevent continuing.

I'd also like to say remove the blood rain from last crusade. If you want to be silly and keep going, let the player do it.

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

Scenario 'Gods':
Even if the Leader of the Town 'Aloh' dies (he is called Harry?), you do start a dialogue with him when you move close to the town. Except he doesn't talk back, because he is dead. This results into a broken dialogue...
And I'm not sure if you get an item for killing the troll leader, it somehow didn't look like it.

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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

Konrad2 wrote:'undead mastery (X)' is explained as 'Adjacent allies will do X% more damage'. I think it should be 'adjacent allied undead', right?
It's not undead specific.
Konrad2 wrote:Even if the Leader of the Town 'Aloh' dies (he is called Harry?), you do start a dialogue with him when you move close to the town.
Fixed. Yes, his name was Harry. It's not a reference to anything, he bears no resemblances to no Clint Eastwood characters.
angrynarwhal wrote:Just played through the Journey South. The scenario description says no early finish bonus but gave me a whopping 9k extra gold for the next one :shock: (tried both mining & seige).
This is a bug in wesnoth. Enjoy it while you can.
angrynarwhal wrote:More general feedback would be I like having plenty information about scenarios before starting them, and that it feels a wee bit on the easy side.
That would spoil the surprise.
angrynarwhal wrote:I thought tax collector would generate revenue for your side. It does the opposite (makes more sense, but could clarify the equip description).
You can check it on the wiki.
angrynarwhal wrote:Took some experimenting to figure out how potions work; that the effects are removed whenever a unit advances. This could effect also be made more clear. (current plan is to feed lots of potions to my grand knight :mrgreen: )
There is some information in the FAQ section of in-game help.

#Chapter 9
@ZIM
What do you think, could be that problem with black soul demons be solved by changing the types of demons to easier ones? Like replacing Barons with Warriors?

What would you say if I reduced the spawn rate of the flies?

@dabber
I might remove it from that scenario if nobody disagrees (not that I think somebody does).

So you mean that if I increased the damage of the blood rain (possibly reducing the lethargy effect), it might actually do its job?

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

If a damage type is set to cold(or fire/arcane/lighting), the effect 'Sucks 1 health from target with each hit' doesn't work, that's intended, right?
Why do the 'Dark Gloves of Destruction' have this effect when the 'Darf Sword of Destruction' sets the damage type to cold? Is it intended to be a hidden disable for the effect or did you overlook that?

EDIT: In 'Darkness Closing In' there is one enemy elf with no special abilities at all. He starts on 49,32 and is called (if that matters) Emlon'dar. Is that intended?
Another elf is just standing on his starting hex(47,32) and never moved (he has the ability of being very strong though)

EDIT 2: Another unmoving elf (with special ability) is on 58,37 but both attack when you move into their movement range.

angrynarwhal
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by angrynarwhal »

"When this unit hits an enemy, it has a chance to tax its side and part it from some gold." - 'its' is ambiguous & could refer to the unit's side or the enemy.

Do later scenarios in part 1 get harder? Finding the game really easy at this point (on darkest darkness atm, good amount of OP units right now)

Whiskeyjack
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Whiskeyjack »

Dugi wrote:So you mean that if I increased the damage of the blood rain (possibly reducing the lethargy effect), it might actually do its job?
I think if you also make blood rain specific to some maps, it would work. Then it would turn from a bloody annoyance to a tactical challenge for those maps (it could start raining a little sooner and considerably ramp up in damage or something). I'm not sure blood rain as a general tool can be made to work, because it never really ceases to be annoying :D

Just my two cents.
Under blood-red skies, an old man sits
In the ruins of Carthage - contemplating prophecy.

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

You can repeatedly summon Beezlebub with his pillar. You only get the rewards for kill one of them, it hasn't to be the first one summoned. Only the first one summoned get's a health bonus and his health bonus increase for every other summoned Beezlebub.

EDIT: Is it a known bug, that if you kill a unit with parry, you get the xp for the fight and for the kill? (if the unit is lvl 1 you get 1xp for the fight and 8xp for the kill).

EDIT 2: In 'The Army of Darkness' there seems to be an enemy leader missing..?
EDIT 3: I took a look at the map, you accidentally placed the leader tag for side 3 instead of side 6.

EDIT 4: "Infinite Legion" -> Could you add 'or defeat all enemy units' in the scenario objectives?
Attachments
LotI1-The_Army_of_Darkness-Auto-Save1.gz
EDIT 2: What happened to side 6?
(837 KiB) Downloaded 82 times
LotI1-Umbra-Auto-Save2.gz
EDIT: Kill the wolf with Luigi by parrying.
(826.67 KiB) Downloaded 101 times
LotI1-Darkness_Closing_In_Turn_12.gz
Move a unit to the pillar and summon Beezlebub. Again.
(866.44 KiB) Downloaded 100 times

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ZIM
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by ZIM »

#The black soul demon
I think that changing the demon types that turn into black souls to the easier ones would be okay. But, maybe you could just make the black soul demon slightly weaker or modified them to only having two traits. It's just that some of the trait combination made the black soul demons very strong.

#The flies
I think it's okay to reduce the spawn rate of the flies. Maybe for 3-5 turns? Just don't make them spawn forever.

Konrad2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Konrad2 »

In 'Sightseeing' the Elvish Lord on 44,57 doesn't summon any soldiers.

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