Legend of the Invincibles

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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Which of these units you find worth advancing and gearing heavily? Unpopular ones will be reworked.

Prophet
14
19%
Reaper
6
8%
Scythemaster
4
5%
Shadowalker
4
5%
Shadow Prince
9
12%
Siege Troll
4
5%
Sky Goblin
1
1%
Snow Hunter
9
12%
Soul Shooter
3
4%
Swordmaster
13
17%
Troll Boulderlobber
0
No votes
Warlock
5
7%
Werewolf Rider
2
3%
Zombie Rider
1
1%
 
Total votes: 75

Whiskeyjack
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Whiskeyjack »

Actually the armor stays in the training room. I restarted the campaign a few weeks earlier and explicitely looked for it.

Mistake in the description for Healing Potion:

This unit is completely healed, and its total hp was is increased by 10.

-> is increased by 10.

Also perhaps adjust "completely healed" to match one of Greater Healing Potion ("completely restored") and Potion of Vitality ("fully healed") (except if this was intentional? It somehow struck me as strange).

In my opinion the unit "Shadow Hound" is too weak. I think the first time I encountered one level 12 still meant a very powerful enemy, but they are weaker than most level 7 demons. By the time I reached Inferno they were just free ep for whatever unit I wanted to gift them to. The only danger they pose is for wounded and badly equiped units in the backline (like healers) because of the Skirmisher ability (but in Inferno I have enough gear to equip all 20 of my autorecall units quite strongly). On the other hand I would only buff them slightly because they would be to dangerous in the early levels otherwise.
Under blood-red skies, an old man sits
In the ruins of Carthage - contemplating prophecy.
dabber
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by dabber »

Whiskeyjack wrote:In my opinion the unit "Shadow Hound" is too weak.
Been meaning to say that myself. I agree it is too weak, but I would increase its power significantly. The hellhound at 13-5 / 8-4 is slightly easy for a level 5 unit, especially one with no defense/resistance. Level 12 Shadowhound at 18-6 / 12-5 is less than double the damage of the hellhound, despite much higher level. Normal units going from level 1 to level 4 more than double their damage and this is a relatively bigger increase in level for less increase in damage.
For comparison, the level 12 Demon Overlord is 21-6 / 17-5, with good resistances, more hitpoints, AND 3 demon traits.

I would give the Shadow Hound improved resistances and some weapon specials on its attacks, like melee struggle and ranged leech.
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

Whiskeyjack wrote:Actually the armor stays in the training room.
Okay, so they forgot it there in the hurry to learn what was going on.
Whiskeyjack wrote:Mistake in the description for Healing Potion:
Corrected it, and also corrected the inconsistency with Potion of Vitality.

Regarding Shadow Hound, I have added him ranged drain and melee cleave and lethargy. Since lethargy gets additional targets from cleave, it will reduce damage of more units of yours. I wanted to try something different than just pure damage/defence.

If you think that lethargy is a bad name for a weapon special that reduces the opponent's damage by 2 with each hit (its effect doesn't last for long), we can find something better.
hkBst
Posts: 3
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by hkBst »

Thanks for explaining the calculation of the resistances! Reducing the amount of damage you get by the percentage makes a lot of sense. Efraim has -30% blade, so takes 1.3 times the normal damage, and the potion reduces it to 1.3 * 0.75 = 0.975, or in other words your new resistance is 2.5%. The only thing I do not yet understand then is how the 15% blade resistance of the sword is added. Following the method you explained the final resistance should be 1 - 1.3 * 0.75 * 0.85 = 17.125, not the 13.75 that is actually shown in the unit information menu/window (rounded to 14% in the health popup on right). And the additional resistance from the sword is only taken into account after un- and re-equipping it, which also changes the damage it does... This is something you can try on the first turn of the first scenario, at which time it is dawn, meaning no bonus for the sword. It seems like somehow the +20% damage from the Twinkling Sword remains for Efraim after he has given the sword to Elenia...

Also Delenia start turn 1 with 8/9 movement points. This can be explained by the strange jump from lvl 2 to lvl 3 after she has gotten the sword, when she takes off her armor. As a lvl2 she has 6 MP, which the Twinkling Sword sets to 6/8 when she gets it, then she becomes a lvl 3 and goes to 8/8 MP (which I think should have been 7/9 or ?/9 at least), then in the first scenario she starts with 8/9...

Finally I found it a little unfortunate that the order of resistances in the unit information window follows a different order than the standard order of the game.
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

If the resistance is added just for one type of damage, it's added normally.

I will check if the damage is okay and the why the movement isn't full.
Whiskeyjack
Posts: 474
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Location: Germany

Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Whiskeyjack »

Regarding Shadow Hound, I have added him ranged drain and melee cleave and lethargy. Since lethargy gets additional targets from cleave, it will reduce damage of more units of yours. I wanted to try something different than just pure damage/defence.

If you think that lethargy is a bad name for a weapon special that reduces the opponent's damage by 2 with each hit (its effect doesn't last for long), we can find something better.
I think lethargy is actually a good name for this kind of ability and the change sounds very interesting. It still leaves the Skirmisher feeling, but now they pose an actual problem and have to be dealt with quickly (while giving the debuff on meele and having drain on ranged makes it a tough choice how to do that).
Under blood-red skies, an old man sits
In the ruins of Carthage - contemplating prophecy.
Delicius169
Posts: 179
Joined: February 16th, 2015, 5:02 pm

Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Delicius169 »

Well, it would be interesting, if they would also have guerilla skill, but I am not sure, if AI would let them run away...
EDIT: Now, I have a champion with Legacy of exile. 80% resistance in attack, 60% in defense. Defense will be higher, about 15% after 1-2AMLAs.
With marrowned 18-9 (on defense),he is really nice guy, who can (have to) hang around alone. I am planning to give him berseker attack, probably from book, or maybe I will be lucky enough to find helm of insanity (+berseker (2))...
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

Okay, it seems that you find it challenging enough now.

@Delicius169
Are you trying to suggest that Legacy of Exile might be overpowered?

Regarding older issues:
I have investigated the weird damages in tutorial and found that the last weapon Efraim took there increased damage by 5 instead of 3 because of a wrong number in code. Other damages were correct. Rounding and time of day made it look quite wierd (4 damage + 20% increased damage is 4.8 damage rounded down back to 4, then increased to 5 by time of day).

It seems that the AI has a flaw causing its leader to attack nearby enemies even if it's time to return to keep. I'll see what can be done.
Delicius169
Posts: 179
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Delicius169 »

Abillity to double resistance of unit in attack is really strong. There is antisocial added because of it, but this unit does not move around people so, it isnt really a penalty. I think that this unit should have somethnig like a carefull, but on attack. And I would give it max +15% added while attacking.
(Because of this abillity, I do not really have to care about resistances of unit, this unit is weaker on attack- cannot use leaders, but its survivality is extreme. )
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

You mean you gave him something that adds a steadfast-like ability in combination with the forsaken ability to get huge resistance?
Legacy of Exile gives an ability (called zeal) that increases resistances while attacking.

So you mean it's not overpowered, the unit just has quite a particular use on the battlefield, right?
LMCS
Posts: 2
Joined: March 20th, 2015, 9:27 pm

Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by LMCS »

Hi,
For the third time, I replay this campaign. By far the one I love the most.
This time I decided to play the multiplayer campaign. It is huge and it allows me to develop all the units to the maximum. It is what I really like, the AMLA and the level 4 (and 5) units.
Unfortunately, when I advance the Javalineer to Pilum master, the game crashed.
Please, help me, I want to finish the game and after once more, the main campaign.
Best Regards,
LMCS
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

I have found the cause. I have fixed it and it will be included in the next version, but any change in that scenario will take place after you restart it and restarting that scenario will be greatly annoying, so if you want, you can attach the save file and I will correct it so that he will advance properly.

It's nice to read that you like my work, thanks.
LMCS
Posts: 2
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by LMCS »

Thanks for the fast answer.
For sure restart is not the best way.
The file is attached for you to fix it, the javalineer is about to level up, just need to kill 1 level 2 unit, nearby him.

BTW, there is some other minor problems too. Some messages appear showing unknown enemy units. Marauders and another one I do not remember.

Thank you again.
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LotI_-_Hordes_of_the_Other_..._Turno_89c3_.gz
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Xargon
Posts: 86
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Xargon »

Hi!
First of all, really nice campaign with many interesting features. Maybe I will write a longer post at some point about which parts I liked a lot and which parts I liked not so much.
For now, just one thing: It seems that the blackguard unit (with charging backstab attack) does not receive the charge bonus from leadership units with that aura (e.g. duke or one of the heroes with the appropriate upgrade).
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Dugi
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Re: Legend of the Invincibles

Post by Dugi »

@LMCS
Here is the fixed save file. Javelineer will work well there and you will see no more unknown unit messages. Keep on mind that before I release the update, the bugs are fixed only in this save file and all save files created from it.
LotI_-_Hordes_of_the_Other_..._Turno_89c3_.gz
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@Xargon
These effects don't stack because I prevented them from stacking because it was allowing overly huge damages.
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