Legend of the Invincibles

[Silux]

It's true i learnt more about WML hacking this campaign than hacking the ufficial ones.
Lua is still out of my reach, but it's really similar to Python and i'll dig it eventually.
The item.cfg file is a land of wonders for me and some of the comments are really funny!

[Dugi]

What is the point of item storage though? I forgot. Most of the stuff you try to put in there will just disappear.

There is a big message in red letters telling that these items are not available after the second turn, but it was suggested that they will be available also after the second turn if the unit is standing on a castle. It is to prevent sharing the same items between more units.

Welcome back, gooby.

It's true i learnt more about WML hacking this campaign than hacking the ufficial ones.
...
The item.cfg file is a land of wonders for me and some of the comments are really funny!

Seems I should add more of comments, then.

[Silux]

the comments are like an easter egg farm for me!

Castle storage could be esploited swapping an epic gear up between units in the castle or other castles but it could be really boring to unstore and store each time.
However castles aren't so common and it'd give a breath between long battles:)

[Dugi]

it could be really boring to unstore and store each time.

Yes, so it has to be made impossible, you must know about the ways to farm exp by killing endlessly spawning enemies in scenarios without a turn limit. I am thinking about another possibility - making each unit whose inventory was manipulated (or each unit who has taken an item except potions/gems) unable to attack in that turn. But on the other hand, you don't fight too much on castles.

[gooby]

In Where The Sun Does Not Shine there is a castle near the north-east corner

Yeah but there are a ton of enemies that will kill me before that point. I need zombies earlier.

EDIT: Then I remembered that Lethalia has the plague ability. D'oh.

On a related note, see if you can find out what's wrong with this picture:

[4b4b4b]

is it just me or does anyone think that chapter 9 is too easy in terms of fighting? My heros hardly ever get hurt and the only hard part is to go through all the scenarios and find the way, and wait for the long load

[gfgtdf]

@4b4b4b
i got the same impressions but i cheated a bit in the chapters before before (lowered the +amla default bonusses) so i didn't knew weather that was normal, i played the other chapters maily with "normal" units and this one only with my hearos+little_lethalia+Elvish gryphon rider for scouting

i'd like to know how much advancements/and max_exp your heros got at the end, can you tell me?

@gooby that was posted already, but there was no real solution if i remember right, i think a new flying unit as the advancement of flying corpses would be the best but you'd need new fiting images for that.
ps: i killes uria with one attack of the little lethalia (is was a rage atttak)

[Silux]

On a related note, see if you can find out what's wrong with this picture:

Lol! i already pointed out that^^
There aren't lvl2 skeleton which fly, so they end up... well you know.
That was the most hilarious situation in found in the whole wesnoth and i farmed hundreds of zombie bats from that chasm.
That spawn point could be made to stop spawning bats after a while to prevent this massive bat plague.After turn 20 they are just a zombie bat farm or an ineffective exp farm.

@dugi
I'd leave some mild exploiting like armour swapping in castles.
It would be a bonus related to castles, and would make scenarios where you are sieged more interesting.
I prefer the unability to move than to attack, or you can't unstore the unit if it doesn't have free attacks.

Can we have in the campaign some units which have more attack turns?
I know that by default units are allowed to attack only once, but they could have extra attack rounds:)

[axds123]

Hey dugi have not played for a while so redoing second campaign but why does redeem not work every turn it says that it recharges but does not mention in the information in game about that.

[Dugi]

@gooby What I wanted to say was already told, zombie should have an option to advance to something else, something that can fly, but at the moment I don't have any idea how it might look.

@4b4b4b It is possible that it is too easy, when I asked for proper save files from the end of chapter 8, I received none, and creating them + properly testing them would have doubled the time needed to write the chapter. Being able to play it leader only was never intended; it is possible that once that you start completing a part of the campaign with leaders only, you will get enormous amounts of experience that will let you get much stronger that it was supposed to be possible, and continue wrecking everything just with leaders.

Possible solutions:
Make the enemies stronger (would render many normal units useless).
Make the enemies more numerous.
Make the leaders need more experience to advance on higher levels.

Same for gfgtdf's K.O. to Uria. Should Uria be stronger? Is the evil Lethalia too strong?

@Silux What do you need so many zombies for? The relatively recently added turn limit should limit this, or should I decrease the maximum number of turns there? Or maybe the bats might be getting stronger?
I didn't mean to make it impossible to swap items with units that have already attacked, only to make units that already swapped the gear unable to attack that turn, that is, making it impossible to attack with new gear.
There is one problem with units that can attack more than once per turn. It is normally allowed by the design of the game, the number of attacks per turn just defaults to 1 and no normal units have more than one attack; but it does not show if a unit has 1 attack left, 2 attacks left, 3 attacks left or more. I might make it display somewhere, but where? I used the traits' bar in the World of Wesnoth project (significantly unfinished, no need to try it out yet), but normally units do have traits. The place around the unit is already clogged with information about equipped items.

@axds123
Hm, good idea, I might add it somewhere.

[Silux]

@Silux What do you need so many zombies for? The relatively recently added turn limit should limit this, or should I decrease the maximum number of turns there? Or maybe the bats might be getting stronger?

Zombie bats were really valuable to me.They were the only unit able to fly and plague enemies.And i was just trying if i could fill all the scenario with zombies^^
A turn limit is fine.

I didn't mean to make it impossible to swap items with units that have already attacked, only to make units that already swapped the gear unable to attack that turn, that is, making it impossible to attack with new gear.

I prefer not be able to unstore after attack, than being unable to attack after unstoring.As i could preview how a weapon would affect the attack just before it.

There is one problem with units that can attack more than once per turn. It is normally allowed by the design of the game, the number of attacks per turn just defaults to 1 and no normal units have more than one attack; but it does not show if a unit has 1 attack left, 2 attacks left, 3 attacks left or more. I might make it display somewhere, but where? I used the traits' bar in the World of Wesnoth project (significantly unfinished, no need to try it out yet), but normally units do have traits. The place around the unit is already clogged with information about equipped items.

The unit info panel it's too small for this campaign:P
My Efraim would need 46 lines of description to see all of its attacks and there are only 18.
Two attacks would be easy for the player to keep in mind or make it related to the moves.
If the unit has 10 moves, he can move it for 5 tiles and attack 5 times or move only for 10 tiles:)

[Dugi]

I prefer not be able to unstore after attack, than being unable to attack after unstoring.As i could preview how a weapon would affect the attack just before it.

It would also allow you to take the ideal weapon from the storage after choosing which enemy will you attack.

Two attacks would be easy for the player to keep in mind or make it related to the moves.

Hardly, if there would be more than one or two of units like that, and because I don't want to give this ability to leaders, it would have to be a standard unit type, that would not be limitable to be only once or twice in the scenario (and I don't want to limit the number of some standard units in the game).

If the unit has 10 moves, he can move it for 5 tiles and attack 5 times or move only for 10 tiles:)

I don't understand what did you mean.

[Jeffers0n]

If the unit has 10 moves, he can move it for 5 tiles and attack 5 times or move only for 10 tiles

you mean each move could be used as an attack? that would make my Stormrider with 19 moves really overpowered.

[gfgtdf]

that would make units with hit_and_run or even penetrate ablity realy overpowered. (infinite attacks)

hm about the chapter 9 think more units wouldn't be a good idea because especialy in the scenarios with plants the enemys turn already take very long.
maybe you could give uria some buff like 20 hp for each advancement your units have taken or something like that.

i dont think little lethalia was much too strong, she is a bit stronger than normal units i tihnk, and i realy pushed her all throug the 9 chapoter + gave her the best possible equip from my other units, i think at least some of my "normal" unit could get around equal strengh under that circumstances.

and for the attack thing, i think you normaly dont have than 3 units of one type in this campain because there are so much new units and you normaly want to discover all of them. and to mcuh units on the on your side are annoying to play. but if you sure want it to display anywhere i'd probaly display it above all the attacks, with usind an unusable attack as text placeholder.

[Dugi]

If the unit has 10 moves, he can move it for 5 tiles and attack 5 times or move only for 10 tiles

If you and I are getting it properly, it would be something impossible to code, because if a unit has 1 move/attack remaining, it can move 1 hex or attack once, but not both, and there is no way to force the interface to let the unit attack targets next to it an disallow it to attack a unit that is reachable, but not right next to it.

hm about the chapter 9 think more units wouldn't be a good idea because especialy in the scenarios with plants the enemys turn already take very long.
maybe you could give uria some buff like 20 hp for each advancement your units have taken or something like that.

You mean like scaling her properties accordingly to your power? That would be an interesting conception indeed. I'll think of it.

i dont think little lethalia was much too strong, she is a bit stronger than normal units i tihnk, and i realy pushed her all throug the 9 chapoter + gave her the best possible equip from my other units, i think at least some of my "normal" unit could get around equal strengh under that circumstances.

So you didn't play with leaders only. If they were far from massacring your units, it is probably time to make the enemies stronger. I think that making them more numerous would not cause slowdowns, because it would not synergise with the time the plants' turn takes.

and for the attack thing, i think you normaly dont have than 3 units of one type in this campain because there are so much new units and you normaly want to discover all of them. and to mcuh units on the on your side are annoying to play. but if you sure want it to display anywhere i'd probaly display it above all the attacks, with usind an unusable attack as text placeholder.

That is a good idea. Maybe I'll give it to the thing Soulless will advance to.