After the Storm 0.10.2 [Wesnoth 1.14]

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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bumbadadabum
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by bumbadadabum »

shadowmaster wrote:
bumbadadabum wrote:I don't think it's that broken. I usually choose Dryad for the extra 17(!) ranged damage. Sure, Sylvan Spark is nice to have, but I find the unit pretty weak.
I find that having a resilient Forest Spirit around is extremely useful when dealing with shaxthal units, since they are have better resistance to impact attacks and are immune to poison.
I usually keep 1-2 forest spirits for this as well. Shaxthals can get pretty annoying to deal with.

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Battlecruiser_Venca »

The damage is really inferior as L3, maybe give them musthave fearless to help them out at night? Because in this campaign you have to fight mostly at night

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Iris »

Battlecruiser_Venca wrote:The damage is really inferior as L3, maybe give them musthave fearless to help them out at night? Because in this campaign you have to fight mostly at night
I do not find their damage output to be as subpar as people make it out to be for whatever reason. The faerie line has very little HP on purpose, but they can be deadly effective when put to use correctly as I have experienced myself while playtesting Episode I on 1.11.1+svn as of late, even though they have always been intended as support units (hence the high cost).

The thing about fighting mostly at night is neither accurate nor important enough to concern me. In most cave scenarios pre-Divergence (which are not too many to begin with) you will find patches of lit terrain where the effective ToD is twilight (dawn/dusk). Endless night scenarios (Wesmere and post-Divergence) are meant to pose a challenge on their own. I have found myself being perfectly able to use Faerie Spirits and Dryads effectively post-Divergence, even if they are reduced to L2 power output by that point. Then again, two incredibly important mainline chaotic units post-Divergence are effectively capped at L2, so this is not a problem in my view.

I have been considering a variety of alternatives, including making the whole unit line liminal with must-have fearless. However, this would not look very good in the UI (Forest Spirits already look quite bad with three traits that don’t fit in the sidebar), and I have not considered all the possible ramifications of such a change nor done any testing of the liminal alignment in 1.10.x or 1.11.x.

In general, I won’t do any balancing changes between 0.9.0 and 1.0.0 without extensive testing, and I will handle external suggestions in the same way as the mainline MP developers do.
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by gooby »

Not enough gold on Return to Wesmere Part I. (Playing at "Normal" difficulty.)

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Iris »

gooby wrote:Not enough gold on Return to Wesmere Part I. (Playing at "Normal" difficulty.)
So, what amount of gold is “not enough” in this case?

That said, there is this couple of fixes in the queue for the next release.

Code: Select all

  * E1S10 - Tears:
    * Fixed gold carryover from E1S8 (Fear) being reduced to its 40% (for an
      effective carryover of 16%) when calculating the initial player gold
      supply for this scenario.
    * Reduced minimum starting gold to compensate for the bug fix above.
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by gooby »

shadowmaster wrote:
gooby wrote:Not enough gold on Return to Wesmere Part I. (Playing at "Normal" difficulty.)
So, what amount of gold is “not enough” in this case?

That said, there is this couple of fixes in the queue for the next release.

Code: Select all

  * E1S10 - Tears:
    * Fixed gold carryover from E1S8 (Fear) being reduced to its 40% (for an
      effective carryover of 16%) when calculating the initial player gold
      supply for this scenario.
    * Reduced minimum starting gold to compensate for the bug fix above.
I'm pretty sure I started with 350.

In scenario "The Eastern Front", the starting gold cuts it—but only with a few extra turns.

Either an extension on turns or increase in starting gold were welcome.

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Iris »

gooby wrote:I'm pretty sure I started with 350.
350 gold should be a decent amount of gold to handle Return to Wesmere, part 1 given the right strategy and appropriate recalls.

I am not sure about The Eastern Front, I haven’t read any complaints about it since ages?
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by vultraz »

I had no problems myself with the amount of gold in either aforementioned scenarios. Maybe you're playing wrong?
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by gooby »

Well, tell me how you played.

I'm only finding a few scenarios problematic here but it is possible that I was "playing wrong".

On "The Eastern Front", I remember recruiting a whole bunch of skeletons to deal with the Elvish menace to avoid incurring unacceptable losses to my veterans because most of the Elvish units were relatively incapable of damaging them, for obvious reasons.

I like to avoid getting my veterans slaughtered (compare how the triarii were used in the Roman Republic)—your strategies may have been more open to this possibility.

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by vultraz »

gooby wrote:Well, tell me how you played.
I'm the eastern front, I basically, focused my resources on the northwest leader, since it's the closest to my keep. Send your units up that way, and send a small packet of level 1s to the east and southeast. Defeat the northwest leader. By the time the other units reach you, you'll have secured the top part of the map. Then, turn your units around and began attacking the other side's units while slowly pushing forward. Your advance guard should have weakened them slightly, and along with the level 3 units you have by now, you should win easily.
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Alarantalara »

shadowmaster wrote: I have been considering a variety of alternatives, including making the whole unit line liminal with must-have fearless. However, this would not look very good in the UI (Forest Spirits already look quite bad with three traits that don’t fit in the sidebar), and I have not considered all the possible ramifications of such a change nor done any testing of the liminal alignment in 1.10.x or 1.11.x.
As currently implemented liminal with fearless is identical to neutral, so there's absolutely no reason to consider that alternative other than for flavour purposes.

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Iris »

Alarantalara wrote:As currently implemented liminal with fearless is identical to neutral, so there's absolutely no reason to consider that alternative other than for flavour purposes.
Ugh, I was under the impression that liminal units were supposed to get a bonus on neutral/twilight ToDs configured to recognize them, not a 0% bonus (if the [time] tag documentation is anything to go by). What the hell? Although I guess the implementation could have changed at some point given who came up with the idea in the first place.

*watches his plan go down the toilet*
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Passer2010 »

Hi, shadowmaster, I met a bug when playing E3S9. My BfW is version 1.11.1 and AtS is Version 0.9.0. The bug is showed in the figure.
Thanks.
Attachments
bug.png

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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Iris »

Hm. Wow.

Could you PM me your start-of-scenario saved game (and the saved games for the last turn of the previous two scenarios, if you have them)? Assuming you don’t feel like downloading Wesnoth 1.11.2 and replaying from Dark Sea/the end of Dark Fire again, that is. That’s probably a bug caused by the code that is supposed to work around a bug that affects Wesnoth 1.11.1 and was fixed in 1.11.2.
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Re: After the Storm 0.9.0 [Wesnoth 1.10.x/1.11.1] (complete!

Post by Battlecruiser_Venca »

I think, it is 1.11.1-specific (it's very buggy version), because when I was playing at 1.11.1+SVN I haven't noticed anything like this

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