How many people play Flight to Freedom?

Discussion and development of scenarios and campaigns for the game.

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sipahi
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Flight to Freedom- comments

Post by sipahi »

I'd played this Campaign a while back; it wasn't that fun with the slave units, and I'd stopped at "Manor". The recent version, with updated text, graphics etc. is much better. It became really fun at and after Blue River. I stopped playing at Underground though- just run out of turns. Drakes are too slow underground to beat an army of dwarves and still have enough time to traverse the whole map. DavidBryon on the Drake Campaing forum has outlined why this is near impossible as it stands. It's too bad since I can see from the .cfg files that there are many more fun levels ahead. But I see from your Campaign forum that you have a new beta that balances the underground campaigns. I'll wait for FtF 3.0 then, and let you know how it goes.

Apart from fine-tuning this level, in order to get more people to play this, I think you need to emphasize on the Campaign sidescreen that it's a new version, etc. and maybe include fmunoz's Malakar pic to entice people who have downloaded it to actually try it! Since it's been downloaded 24000+ times it must be that people have it but don't necessarily play it (only a small subset of whom will drop a note here in the forum of course). I can't emphasize how much the Campaign selection screen influences what I try next out of all the ones I've downloaded. For example, Taurus's Northern Rebirth campaign has a very cool high res graphic with the castle, moat, sword etc. that draws the gamer in and implies that effort was spent to make the Campaign look and play well.

Main comments:
1) Limited availability of unit types at the beginning stages is probably what turned most people off this campaign. Maybe you can include some text in the Manor level hinting that if Prax is dealt with, Malakar will be able to recruit true Drake fighters to his cause. This will give added incentive to finish what is a very tight level - 25 turns would make it much more enjoyable, and one might even finish it in one go without having to restart several times. In the old version of this campaign that I tried, "Manor" is where I quit playing out of frustration, just when it was about to get fun in hindsight.
2) Open Ocean- really trivial- just run the main ship straight down while sacrificing 1 ship to distract the easternmost cuttlefish. This level needs some more intricacy to make it more worthwhile to play. It's a nice concept though. I always like sea campaigns, and am waiting eagerly for a grand Mermen vs Naga campaign.
3) Landfall- Bridge event still has bug- flying units also perish
Turn limit of 60 is way too much, and that's from someone who loves extra turns. Map is too bland basically.
BUT- I love those lightning golems. Reminds me of Warcraft.
4) Drake Escape- great level! favorite so far.
5) Underground- need better defensive positions for Drakes! Ridiculous to have to deal with 50-60 dwarf units with no good defensive position, even if they are only level 1. Overall map design isn't as well thought out as the campaign calls for- I can defeat the main army if I recruit tons of Clashers, but not before turn 30+, by which time it's nearly impossible to get down to the castles, even with Quick Clashers moving 3 tiles/round. I guess the map is too large, or the turns too few. The side quest for variable chests of gold is trite, since I have to spend all my gold on an army of Clashers to win, and I'm in negative income most of the time. I mean, I like having a lot of features on the map like the dragon skeleton etc., but it's not very fun when your units are crawling around at 2-3 tiles/turn max and you're racing to find these damn Dwarf lords to kill, one on each torturous side of the map, before time runs out. Sorry to have to bring up Northern Rebirth as a gold standard of this type of fun cavern crawls, but it really does set a precedent. I think there is fundamentally something wrong with this level, and have quit playing at this stage.

Actually, I think if you put paths down the main throughway so the drakes can move faster and get to the bottom of the map where the combat is due to occur, that would make the map MUCH more enjoyable. Conduits, basically, at least in the top of the map where the fighting doesn't take place anyway. There are a lot of underground maps in other campaigns that have these kinds of paths to speed things along for those cavern-challenged unit types.

Minor comments:

Dragon and Kogw graphics are superbly drawn! fmunoz rocks as usual.

The new dialogue is still curt but more entertaining! Malakar's haughty attitude comes through.

Having neutral wildlife is a cool addition. I always thought this campaign is pretty unique with that. Now all you need is a Dragon Ranger type unit that can charm them onto your side!

Passing Wind is the name of the chasing human ship! :) that tops it all. You don't want to be downwind of those guys ;)

thanks for spending the time and effort to make a cool campaign!
Science is what you know. Philosophy is what you don't know.
Bertrand Russell (1872-1970)
MadMax
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Post by MadMax »

sipahi wrote:I'd played this Campaign a while back; it wasn't that fun with the slave units, and I'd stopped at "Manor". The recent version, with updated text, graphics etc. is much better. It became really fun at and after Blue River. I stopped playing at Underground though- just run out of turns. Drakes are too slow underground to beat an army of dwarves and still have enough time to traverse the whole map. DavidBryon on the Drake Campaing forum has outlined why this is near impossible as it stands. It's too bad since I can see from the .cfg files that there are many more fun levels ahead. But I see from your Campaign forum that you have a new beta that balances the underground campaigns. I'll wait for FtF 3.0 then, and let you know how it goes.
Actually, I must ask that you try the beta, as I need as much feedback on it as possible.
sipahi wrote:Apart from fine-tuning this level, in order to get more people to play this, I think you need to emphasize on the Campaign sidescreen that it's a new version, etc. and maybe include fmunoz's Malakar pic to entice people who have downloaded it to actually try it!
I'm using Jetryl's portrait now. Can you point me in the direction of fmunoz's?
sipahi wrote:1) Limited availability of unit types at the beginning stages is probably what turned most people off this campaign. Maybe you can include some text in the Manor level hinting that if Prax is dealt with, Malakar will be able to recruit true Drake fighters to his cause. This will give added incentive to finish what is a very tight level - 25 turns would make it much more enjoyable, and one might even finish it in one go without having to restart several times. In the old version of this campaign that I tried, "Manor" is where I quit playing out of frustration, just when it was about to get fun in hindsight.
The turn limit is not really tight. You need to ignore the spears, as they are not your first priority (you can send down any extra units near the end to pick them up if you really want them). I do not really think that limited availabilty of unit types turned most people off. There are other campaigns that do not have any recruitment at the beginning, and I do introduce the full range of drake units in Survival.
sipahi wrote:) Open Ocean- really trivial- just run the main ship straight down while sacrificing 1 ship to distract the easternmost cuttlefish. This level needs some more intricacy to make it more worthwhile to play. It's a nice concept though. I always like sea campaigns, and am waiting eagerly for a grand Mermen vs Naga campaign.
Maybe an island in the bottom right corner, forcing you to move left? I'll experiment with it.
sipahi wrote:3) Landfall- Bridge event still has bug- flying units also perish
Turn limit of 60 is way too much, and that's from someone who loves extra turns. Map is too bland basically.
BUT- I love those lightning golems. Reminds me of Warcraft.
I'll reduce the turn limit to 50, but I cannot explain the bug with the bridge event. I checked my WML, and it's correct. You might have a severely outdated version of FtF, but I doubt it.
sipahi wrote:Passing Wind is the name of the chasing human ship! that tops it all. You don't want to be downwind of those guys
I can't believe that you would be the first one to notice that :) .
sipahi wrote:thanks for spending the time and effort to make a cool campaign!
Thanks!
The Raven wrote:I had the saurians flank and they got decimated
How about I get rid of that Iron Mauler that appears at the north gate?
DoctorJ wrote:Manor' is good, though tough. Unless you're one of those players who's blows always hit & always manage to parry enemy thrusts, 20 turns is just barely time to get past all the defenders & take out Prax. I had to restart several times to get the right combination of steps for success. I initially went into the room of the spears - then the whole rest of the scenario trying to get out. The enemies all blockaded the hall outside the door. Spear or no, i couldn't break through. I eventually decided the spears weren't worth the effort. I will say this: until i read this forum, i didn't understand that Prax was being held by Malakar. I thought Malakar had killed the slaver.
Malakar does hold Prax, but changes his mind at the beginning of Caravan ('after killing the man and torching his house, ...').
DoctorJ wrote:'Landfall' is where i am now, and why i came to this forum in the 1st place. It seems as though Jake lands twice in rapid succession, giving the humans a bit of an unfair advantage. This happens in BfW 1.0, i just dl'ed the campaign last week so i think it's up to date, too. Now that i know the human ship can be destroyed, though, i think i'll try that tack.
Do you have the 3.0 beta? IIRC, I attempted to fix it, although I may have added them after I uploaded to the campaign server.
"ILLEGITIMIS NON CARBORUNDUM"

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Oreb
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Post by Oreb »

definately, with all the humans still up their the iron mauler is pretty much what kills them all
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DoctorJ
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Post by DoctorJ »

MadMax wrote:Do you have the 3.0 beta? IIRC, I attempted to fix it, although I may have added them after I uploaded to the campaign server.
Dunno. I see the version # on the server, but don't see any version info in my campaign folder. My 1st save file for this campaign is dated 28 Oct, which is most likely the day that i got the campaign. Does that narrow it down? In my case, it's a moot issue now, as i've already beat that scenario & gone underground.
MadMax
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Post by MadMax »

DoctorJ wrote:
MadMax wrote:Do you have the 3.0 beta? IIRC, I attempted to fix it, although I may have added them after I uploaded to the campaign server.
Dunno. I see the version # on the server, but don't see any version info in my campaign folder. My 1st save file for this campaign is dated 28 Oct, which is most likely the day that i got the campaign. Does that narrow it down? In my case, it's a moot issue now, as i've already beat that scenario & gone underground.
The beta was released November 2.
"ILLEGITIMIS NON CARBORUNDUM"

Father of Flight to Freedom
http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/FlightToFreedom
MadMax
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Post by MadMax »

Has anyone else been able to reproduce DoctorJ's bug in Landfall? I am going to release soon, and I'd like to squash it.
"ILLEGITIMIS NON CARBORUNDUM"

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lu_zero
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Post by lu_zero »

which bug? I can complete landfall but the next scenario I just have the pirate and nobody else.
DoctorJ
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Post by DoctorJ »

MadMax wrote:Has anyone else been able to reproduce DoctorJ's bug in Landfall? I am going to release soon, and I'd like to squash it.
I've just gotten back to this point in FtF, using the beta campaign on another BfW installation [this time on my laptop]. Sure enough, the whole process of Jake landing [& ensuing dialog] is repeated twice.

I have a screen grab & savefile taken right after, but couldn't seem to get them posted.

Anyway, i liked the other changes i've seen so far in this campaign.
MadMax
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Post by MadMax »

DoctorJ, I am attaching an updated Landfall.cfg. Try it.

lu_zero: That bug was fixed in an earlier version. Please download the beta.

EDIT: old Landfall.cfg removed
Last edited by MadMax on November 27th, 2005, 11:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"ILLEGITIMIS NON CARBORUNDUM"

Father of Flight to Freedom
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DoctorJ
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Thanks, MadMax

Post by DoctorJ »

MadMax wrote:DoctorJ, I am attaching an updated Landfall.cfg. Try it.
That does the trick. My hat's off to you. Even though i'll miss the extra 10 turns income... :wink:
lu_zero
Posts: 196
Joined: April 16th, 2005, 10:25 am

Post by lu_zero »

MadMax wrote:DoctorJ, I am attaching an updated Landfall.cfg. Try it.

lu_zero: That bug was fixed in an earlier version. Please download the beta.
it isn't redownloaded the campain today and the bug is still present
DoctorJ
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What?

Post by DoctorJ »

Now that i'm able to beat Jake in Landfall, i get this other weird thing that happens: after killing Jake, a drake happens to land on the peninsula @ 7,18. Malakar is immediately teleported to 7,19 & surrounded by some new humans - complete w/ the message that i've just been defeated. Since i'd already killed all the humans, i really don't understand what happened. :?:
MadMax
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Post by MadMax »

DoctorJ wrote:Now that i'm able to beat Jake in Landfall, i get this other weird thing that happens: after killing Jake, a drake happens to land on the peninsula @ 7,18. Malakar is immediately teleported to 7,19 & surrounded by some new humans - complete w/ the message that i've just been defeated. Since i'd already killed all the humans, i really don't understand what happened.
A stupid bug on my part. There is an event that is supposed to make you lose if you attempt to land the Unforgiver in the humans' castle (which should have been triggered at 7,17, but another bug, also fixed, landed it in 7,18 ), but I forgot to specify the Unforgiver, meaning that any unit from side 1 could have triggered the bug. Also, the terrain at 7,18 should have been vertical bridge, not sand. This version of Landfall.cfg fixes the WML bugs, but as the terrain error has only a cosmetic effect on gameplay, an updated map will be released with 3.0 (whenever I weed the bugs out of the beta).

lu_zero: Try replaying from the beginning of Landfall (use a beginning-of-scenario save). If you can still reproduce the problem, then I am indeed overlooking something, but I had a look at the code, and I am pretty sure it is correct, as there are no teleport or kill events to get rid of Malakar.
Attachments
Landfall.cfg
(16.2 KiB) Downloaded 170 times
"ILLEGITIMIS NON CARBORUNDUM"

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