Translation Accuracy

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ying
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Translation Accuracy

Post by ying » October 27th, 2014, 10:38 pm

I briefly evaluated the German translation...

Accurate translations:
"I'm ready" -> "Ich bin bereit"
"Quit" -> "Verlassen"
"Add-ons" -> "Sonstiges"
"Elvish Enchantress" -> "Elfenzauberin"

Inaccurate translations:
"I'm ready" -> "Anfangen"
"Quit" -> "Beenden"
"Add-ons" -> "Erweiterungen"
"Elvish Enchantress" -> "Elvenmystikerin"

Suggestions:
"I'm Ready" -> "Start"
"Quit" -> "Exit"
"Add-ons" -> "User Made Content"
"Elvish Enchantress" -> "Elvish Mystic"
If I spoke the truth, they would put me in a straitjacket. So, I left the society.

Chewan
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by Chewan » October 27th, 2014, 11:45 pm

Ying, verstehe ich richtig, dass du beispielsweise die Übersetzung von "Add-on" mit "Sonstiges" für korrekt hältst?
Und du vorschlägst, die vier Einträge im dritten Absatz Englisch zu "übersetzen"?
Welche Übersetzung schlägst du für die Elvish Sorceres (zu Deutsch Elfenzauberin) vor?
:hmm:

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GunChleoc
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by GunChleoc » October 28th, 2014, 9:25 pm

As a German-speaking computer user the "Inaccurate" translations are actually the translations that seem more natural and familiar to me. The most literal translation isn't always the best ;)

ying
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by ying » October 28th, 2014, 10:25 pm

Chewan wrote: Ying, verstehe ich richtig, dass du beispielsweise die Übersetzung von "Add-on" mit "Sonstiges" für korrekt hältst?
Yes, so the term “add-on” may have more meaning within the context of Halo or within the context of Wesnoth but to the average English speaker the term “add-on” is not a familiar term. “Sonstiges” is a pretty good translation as it explains “add-on” to the regular English speaker.
Chewan wrote:Und du vorschlägst, die vier Einträge im dritten Absatz Englisch zu "übersetzen"?
Yes
Chewan wrote:Welche Übersetzung schlägst du für die Elvish Sorceres (zu Deutsch Elfenzauberin) vor?
Clearly, there is an issue with having multiple units with the same name. Nonetheless, there is a translation quality issue in English with “Elvish Enchantress”:

alpha: can an Elven Enchantress enchant the Elvish Hero's weapon?
beta: no
alpha: can an Elven Enchantress enchant the mind of the Spearman? (charm)
beta: no
alpha: can an Elven Enchantress enchant anything at all?
beta: no
alpha: so, why is it called an Elven Enchantress?
beta: is “Elvish Enchantress” common lure?
alpha: yes
beta: is an “Elvish Enchantress” an elf?
alpha: yes
beta: is an “Elvish Enchantress” a spell caster?
alpha: yes
beta: so, then it is an “Elvish Enchantress”

But, Elvish Mystic is good, because it is not an enchantress that conducts enchantments. Moreover, the mystic is a bit misunderstood and arcane so it makes sense for the unit. Enchantresses might use an alt attack of fire damage type (the primary attack being charm) whereas mystics might use an arcane damage type. (or possibly cold)
If I spoke the truth, they would put me in a straitjacket. So, I left the society.

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GunChleoc
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by GunChleoc » October 29th, 2014, 7:05 pm

ying wrote:to the average English speaker the term “add-on” is not a familiar term. “Sonstiges” is a pretty good translation as it explains “add-on” to the regular English speaker.
You do know that the original language of the game is English and not German, right? Why should the German translation explain stuff to English speakers anyway, since the translation is done for German speakers? English speakers can just use the English version if they want to understand stuff ;)

"Add-On" is a term you will find often on computers and it's a purely computer-related term. Similar terms you can find are "Extensions", "Modifications", "Mods" or "Plugins". In the German language, none of these terms will be translated as "Sonstiges", ever, because "Sonstiges" is a very general term and not specific enough for this context. It means "Miscellaneous" or "Other", so appropiate it is not.

ying
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by ying » October 30th, 2014, 10:56 pm

GunChleoc wrote:You do know that the original language of the game is English and not German, right?
I wasn't sure. It might be a good design if there was some English strings translated into multiple languages English being a language and translators looking at each others translations. So, “more_content” could be a string and “User Made Content” could be an English translation and “Erweiterungen” could be the German translation.
GunChleoc wrote:"Add-On" is a term you will find often on computers and it's a purely computer-related term. Similar terms you can find are "Extensions", "Modifications", "Mods" or "Plugins". In the German language, none of these terms will be translated as "Sonstiges", ever, because "Sonstiges" is a very general term and not specific enough for this context. It means "Miscellaneous" or "Other", so appropiate it is not.
I know that add-on is something that enables Adobe Flash for Firefox or even a map pack for Halo, but most English speakers, who a less computer savvy, don't know. So, “Sontiges” is a good translation as it translates the meaning of “Add-on” to the broader English speaking community.
If I spoke the truth, they would put me in a straitjacket. So, I left the society.

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iceiceice
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by iceiceice » October 30th, 2014, 11:23 pm

ying:

I think add-ons is as clear as we're reasonably going to get. We already have, add-ons, modifications, and in next release I hope to add "plugins", as things that you could download and activate. All these words mean the same thing, I don't think there's so much precise definition as "oh, a modification always applies just to your content, while a plug-in applies just to the application", I mean everyone will have their preconceptions, but it's just generalized computer technobabble. Hoping for this also to translate literally seems... quite hopeful.

Maybe there should actually just be a button "Extras" on the main menu, which opens up a submenu with 3 buttons for "Addons" "Core mods" "Plug-ins" ? :lol:

Maybe what we need is to have a "tutorial" button on the start page that briefly shows you have to navigate the menus and features? +1 if you find a woman with a sexy voice to narrate it.

In honesty, I don't think our menus are really labyrinthine such that they would require a tutorial... sorry that you didn't click on add-ons for all that time, but I don't think it needs to be renamed.

Maybe it could be placed more prominently somehow? Some games (e.g. most blizzard games) have title screens where its more like a "scene" from the game, and the buttons are associated to objects in the scene, so we could place add-ons in a very prominent place in this case.

Such a layout might also be more confusing though.

(Enough stream-of-consciousness forum posting for now...)

Kuchen
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by Kuchen » October 30th, 2014, 11:35 pm

iceiceice wrote:Maybe what we need is to have a "tutorial" button on the start page that briefly shows you have to navigate the menus and features? +1 if you find a woman with a sexy voice to narrate it.
I'd rather hear shadowm's voice in the game but I'm not sure a titlescreen tutorial would be the best use for it

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GunChleoc
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by GunChleoc » October 31st, 2014, 12:27 pm

ying wrote:
GunChleoc wrote:You do know that the original language of the game is English and not German, right?
I wasn't sure. It might be a good design if there was some English strings translated into multiple languages English being a language and translators looking at each others translations. So, “more_content” could be a string and “User Made Content” could be an English translation and “Erweiterungen” could be the German translation.
Gettext (our translation system) doesn't need the extra "more_content" string. For this example, the string is defined as “Add-ons” in the program source code. Gettext uses this string to search in the translation file, and fetches “Erweiterungen” for German or “Add-ons” for English etc. If the string hasn't been translated into the current language, it simply uses the English string from the source code. This way, the software still remains usable even if a translation is missing. However, this also means that if the English string in the source code changed from “Add-ons” to “User Made Content”, it would have to be translated again. And it wouldn't be just for the 1 button, but for all strings containing the expression “Add-on” or “Add-ons”. So, not worth the hassle for an expression that many computer users are familiar with anyway.

As a translator, I do look at what other languages that I speak have done sometimes, but in the end I need to go with what is best for my own language. So, I mostly do this if it's not exactly clear what the English means - words often have more than one meaning.

ying
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Re: Translation Accuracy

Post by ying » November 2nd, 2014, 8:39 pm

Based on your statements, it seems to make sense to have a system where a translator could translate from “More Content” instead of “more_content” or “Add-ons” in the source code. Still, it may be good for “More Content” to be translated to “User Made Content” in the English* and “Erweiterungen” in German.

*the connotation in American English of “made” in “User Made Content” is not merely, the past tense of “make”. “made” has another denotation as in “he is a made man” where made could mean “accomplished”. For example, “made in America” has connotations beyond... (Doh, Google's German translation of “Made in America” is “Made in America”. ) Some other contexts are: “Did you pick the pie up at the store. No, this is homemade pie.” , “Did you get the content from the factory? No, this is User Made Content.” I don't know whether British English has the same sense of the word “made”, but maybe it does.
If I spoke the truth, they would put me in a straitjacket. So, I left the society.

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