[POLL] Removing planning mode

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How often do you use the whiteboard?

A lot
10
8%
Not much
31
25%
Never
82
67%
 
Total votes : 123

Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby SatHyre » March 6th, 2016, 6:22 am

hello,

i play mainly world conquest and 2 vs 2. i use planning mode to show to my teammate my moves. it's very useful, instead of talking.

but, are there issues even it is not activate? in my case, i activate it when it's necessary, and deactivate in other times.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Mystery » March 7th, 2016, 8:00 am

As Velensk, I never use it because I don't know how to use it. It didn't exist when I first started playing and I'm too stubborn and lazy to figure out how to use this new-fangled technology. I've no opinion of the feature.

I do like Delay Shroud, I use it to help plan out unit movements and final placements. I flicker it off briefly if I actually want to vision scout. It prevents me from moving a unit any length, seeing new enemies and forcing the game to finalize my movements until I'm ready to sign off on them.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby SigurdFireDragon » March 10th, 2016, 4:14 am

I've tried to use it in 1.12.5, but there were some bugs. I can see where I would make use of it to make planning for village grabbing go quicker.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Zap-Zarap » March 12th, 2016, 5:45 am

I voted never, and i don't like it very much, when my contrahents are using it. I play 1v1 mostly and when the other player is using planning mode, first it seems there's no movement al all for some minutes, which often makes me think connection broke down, then suddenly all units move at the same time, what often gives the impression to me, that all that sudden rush of data transmission makes the game crash, on days when my network is weak. I think that's quite boring (the no-movement-at-all-phase) and annoying (the game crashes caused by transmission overkill, though i might be wrong concerning the latter). I prefer to see each enemy unit move individually one after the other. I always appreciate it, when the other player(s) don't use it.
@ Velensk: that's, by the way, how you notice if someone is using it. ;)
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Ben24626 » March 22nd, 2016, 2:48 pm

I voted never.

This is because assuming the opponents or any teammates moves don't mean I need to change my moves, it MIGHT save me a small amount of time (I say might because sometimes it lags and moving units takes very little time, it's the deciding where to move them that takes time). If I have to change moves it takes longer than not using it in the first place and can be confusing. Also, it can crash the game and at the least cause annoying error messages.

So basically it is completely useless. I have no idea how anyone finds it useful at all.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby vultraz » March 23rd, 2016, 3:09 am

Currently the overwhelming consensus (79%) of you say you never use the whiteboard.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Xudo » March 23rd, 2016, 4:08 am

Why do you need to remove it?
You can ignore its presence.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby taptap » March 23rd, 2016, 10:31 am

I play single player and rarely use it, as I like to adjust plans according to how initial contact goes. Given how long multiplayer matches last, I understand that people cling to anything to speed things up even if they only use it for a few turns per match.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby GunChleoc » March 24th, 2016, 9:26 am

Xudo wrote:Why do you need to remove it?
You can ignore its presence.

Code manintenance I guess. Every line of code contains a potential bug.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Freem » April 8th, 2016, 11:10 am

Zap-Zarap wrote:I play 1v1 mostly and when the other player is using planning mode, first it seems there's no movement al all for some minutes


Maybe your opponent use dsu, then. The symptoms are exactly the same: nothing is send while no action actually changes anything about the game. So, the only moment you will notice a change with dsu is either when the player start a fight (rng changes the game) or when he decides to update his vision. And starting a fight also update the vision.

Anyway, the planning mode is useful when you play with limited time per turn and/or when turns are long. An example is conquest. As far as I know, it is also by far more stable than it used to be a while ago. If it was more usable, it would really be an interesting tool.
Now, if removing it may simplify the codebase without bothering tons of people, then so be it.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Eagle_11 » April 8th, 2016, 11:38 am

So if an opponent uses delayed shroud update and moves a wose into forest tile for ambush you wouldnt see it moving ?
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » April 14th, 2016, 4:07 pm

Given that 11 out of 51 voters (22%) use planning mode, and there is at least one developer among them, I think it is unlikely that planning mode will be removed in 1.14. If gfgtdf fails to address the issues with it, there may still be a slight chance of it being removed after that.

There was also a separate poll running on Twitter, where 6 out of 31 voters (19%) use planning mode while not claiming it to be useless. (10 out of 31 – 32% – if you count the people who voted that it wasn't useful.) Though the percentage is smaller, so is the sample size, so in my opinion this also supports the result of this poll.
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby howwitty » April 17th, 2016, 1:04 pm

Planning mode created some mutual accountability among players who may experience a language barrier. I find planning mode was useful before it caused issues with oos. Although I don't have a formal bug report, I suspect the whiteboard might be the root cause of some connectivity problems and runtime errors as well. These issues appear to happen most frequently when wesnoth is in full screen mode and is running in the background. Application switching may have caused this (alt+tab).

It's easy from a logistical standpoint to find fault with a feature in development (that's meta, it's not important to gameplay). At this point, I don't use planning mode because if moves are executed too quickly, it causes oos almost 100% of the time. If it wasn't an obstacle to gameplay I would use planning mode to reduce planning during my turn (shorter turns).
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Telchin » April 17th, 2016, 3:17 pm

I voted never, but I'm not target group of this feature, as I never play multiplayer and in campaign I use save/load instead of planning :oops: I don't have feelings about the whiteboard one way or another, though I find sad that a feature once implemented might be removed. That said I have no idea how hard such feature is to maintain.
Given that 11 out of 51 voters (22%) use planning mode, and there is at least one developer among them, I think it is unlikely that planning mode will be removed in 1.14. If gfgtdf fails to address the issues with it, there may still be a slight chance of it being removed after that.

I'm not sure how representative these polls are. I don't know how many people play Wesnoth or visit these forums regularly, so I can't tell how many voters should be needed. However, from my experince people voting in such polls tend to be people with strong feeling about the topic in question, because people who don't care (or are satisfied with the status quo) don't feel urge to voice their opinion on the internet. Of course, BfW's features aren't added or removed based on referenda, but on whether the developers can or want to do it. (see FAQ)
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Re: [POLL] Removing planning mode

Postby Celtic_Minstrel » April 17th, 2016, 4:55 pm

The polls are definitely not very representative – only 82 people voted (probably less actually), which is a terrible sample size. That's also why I'm not treating a majority against it as a reason to remove planning mode, though if gfgtdf had not expressed interest, it might have been removed anyway.
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